Peter Beatte NRL 360 - expansion

[The Great Dane]

You still don't get it. The Sydney based clubs have what I call "longevity credit" Once again add Perth ! No issues there! Just don't "whiteant" the code in Australias largest city as a consequence. It's pretty easy. More teams should translate to more revenue and more interest. The "whiteant" road only offers bitterness and a weakening of the advantage the code still enjoys in Sydney.

So what just keep expanding and expanding until the comp crashes like it was inevitably going to in the 90s?

If not who misses out?

And what we just keep dragging the Sydney clubs along for traditions sake, even though the tradition obviously isn't moving enough product to justify it, and cause some peoples feelings might get hurt? Well if their feelings would get hurt so much maybe they should financially support the clubs they love so much so that they are sustainable...

If you don't support the loss of Sydney clubs then to anyone that translates into them maintaining their top flight status. Otherwise it's killing them off. No other way put it. The smiling assassin at work is what lower tier status translates to in Australia for a top flight club ousted/merged or whatever. Their identity and status are pivotal in a fan's recognition and adoration for the club. You take that away : they are lost! And rugby league loses out as well !

Evidence from every other country in the world with a multi tier system where the lower tiers get reasonable exposure says you are dead wrong, every single one, from the European and South American soccer leagues, the collegiate system in the Americas, Canadian second grade ice Hockey, to figging high school football teams in the US with supporter bases and average attendances that most (if not all) NRL clubs would be envious of, etc, etc.

The only reason that lower tier competitions of popular sports aren't well supported in Australia is cause they get next to no exposure, i.e. it isn't convenient to follow them, make it convenient and give them time and the supporters will come.

Unless of course you've got a reason why the Australian market is completely different then every other one in the world where it's been attempted, and before you say it the tyranny of distance simply doesn't cut it in the modern age, especially since the US and Canada have manged to work around it...

 

[Perth Red]

It seems no matter how much common sense and respect comes through for established clubs the negativity does get a run. Has anyone contemplated that the Sydney market would be strengthened with the readmission of The Bears on the Central Coast? Now that would capture and consolidate this massive population base of metropolitan Sydney (especially northern Sydney) and engage the Central Coast. But no we get " But what if a club goes under... etc) " Once again negativity rather than positivity seems to be the detractors standpoint for Sydney NRL clubs!? Has anyone thought of the( 100000 plus at least )regained fans from the hibernating Bears audience in northern Sydney and around Australia ? No it's not contemplated. It's all.about whom gets cut or merged! So negative and reckless from certain posters! Mind you plenty of others dissagree with the "whiteant" attitude. But we continue to discourse negatively courtesy of some.

No, it’s a stupid idea, even by your standards.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Unless of course you've got a reason why the Australian market is completely different then every other one in the world where it's been attempted, and before you say it the tyranny of distance simply doesn't cut it in the modern age, especially since the US and Canada have manged to work around it...

He hasnt managed to explain why Sydney is so different from every other city, of course he cannot explain why Australia is different fro every other country.

It just is because he says so. Its magic...

 

[Stallion]

So what just keep expanding and expanding until the comp crashes like it was inevitably going to in the 90s?

If not who misses out?

And what we just keep dragging the Sydney clubs along for traditions sake, even though the tradition obviously isn't moving enough product to justify it, and cause some peoples feelings might get hurt? Well if their feelings would get hurt so much maybe they should financially support the clubs they love so much so that they are sustainable...



Evidence from every other country in the world with a multi tier system where the lower tiers get reasonable exposure says you are dead wrong, every single one, from the European and South American soccer leagues, the collegiate system in the Americas, Canadian second grade ice Hockey, to figging high school football teams in the US with supporter bases and average attendances that most (if not all) NRL clubs would be envious of, etc, etc.

The only reason that lower tier competitions of popular sports aren't well supported in Australia is cause they get next to no exposure, i.e. it isn't convenient to follow them, make it convenient and give them time and the supporters will come.

Unless of course you've got a reason why the Australian market is completely different then every other one in the world where it's been attempted, and before you say it the tyranny of distance simply doesn't cut it in the modern age, especially since the US and Canada have manged to work around it...

The comp did not (repeat DID NOT) crash in the 90s. It was hijacked and arse f**ked by a flawed and reckless plan that both divided and screwed the competition. We fundamentally dissagree on the causality and purpose of the split in the ARL competition in the mid 90s. Divide and conquer was the main thrust of this split. You assert a 'crash'. We differ. So I suggest you go back in your little low life corner of destruction and others will aim to remedy a deceitful attack on this vulnerable code. You repeatedly seem to espouse a lower division relegation answer"? How ludicrous In a country of such sparse population and massive dimensions. You counter with the fans can fly to games! ? And you also think people will still follow a club in a 2nd rate competition? ! Shear lunacy ! The top flight is manifestly built on rivalry. If a local rival is relegated the cultural relevance and rivalry is shattered. (now that's a crash!) Just then on the BSB radio sports show the Brisbane born and bred commentator,Dave Stanley,referred to the inter-club rivalry between the Sydney clubs as something very special. You think this would prevail in a 2nd rate format? He also stated that the people of Brisbane don't know about the strong cultural relevance within the clubs residing in Sydney! It's very different . Stanley is showing RESPECT. You are not! Please get back on the drink you spoiler!

 

[Stallion]

No, it’s a stupid idea, even by your standards.

Ignorance and apathy seems to run well and proudly with the dilution /destructionist lobby group in this website ! Shame on you. You are proving to be the stupid one as you are weakening/whiteanting the competition with a logic that encourages 'slash and burn ' So dumb and disrespectful!

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

The comp did not (repeat DID NOT) crash in the 90s. It was hijacked and arse f**ked by a flawed and reckless plan that both divided and screwed the competition. We fundamentally dissagree on the causality and purpose of the split in the ARL competition in the mid 90s. Divide and conquer was the main thrust of this split. You assert a 'crash'. We differ. So I suggest you go back in your little low life corner of destruction and others will aim to remedy a deceitful attack on this vulnerable code. You repeatedly seem to espouse a lower division relegation answer"? How ludicrous In a country of such sparse population and massive dimensions. You counter with the fans can fly to games! ? And you also think people will still follow a club in a 2nd rate competition? ! Shear lunacy ! The top flight is manifestly built on rivalry. If a local rival is relegated the cultural relevance and rivalry is shattered. (now that's a crash!) Just then on the BSB radio sports show the Brisbane born and bred commentator,Dave Stanley,referred to the inter-club rivalry between the Sydney clubs as something very special. You think this would prevail in a 2nd rate format? He also stated that the people of Brisbane don't know about the strong cultural relevance within the clubs residing in Sydney! It's very different . Stanley is showing RESPECT. You are not! Please get back on the drink you spoiler!

Stallion has spoke (without evidence). It is now truth!!! DONT YOU DARE QUESTION TO GREST INVENTOR OF HISTORY!

And you also think people will still follow a club in a 2nd rate competition? !

Under State Of Origin, NRL is ALREADY the second rate league and most of us are still fine with it....

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Ignorance and apathy seems to run well and proudly with the dilution /destructionist lobby group in this website ! Shame on you. You are proving to be the stupid one as you are weakening/whiteanting the competition with a logic that encourages 'slash and burn ' So dumb and disrespectful!

I dont think you understand the meaning of "dilution".

 

[Stallion]

Stallion has spoke (without evidence). It is now truth!!! DONT YOU DARE QUESTION TO GREST INVENTOR OF HISTORY!



Under State Of Origin, NRL is ALREADY the second rate league and most of us are still fine with it....

Toying with words and context doesn't impress! Try again. If you seriously think that the people supporting top flight rugby league clubs would settle for 2nd rate status you are truelly devoid of common sense and logic!

 

[Stallion]

I dont think you understand the meaning of "dilution".

Dilution : the weakening in context and action of something. I don't think you understand what 'context ' is in using the word you question!?

 

[Perth Red]

Stallion can you contemplate a scenario where the NRL does not feel it has either the revenue to expand or the player base to expand with more clubs? In that scenario would you rather see the comp remain the same make up as now or would you rather see something done with existing make up to allow for potentially bigger opportunities in Perth, Brisbane etc to be brought online? I know you'll say it doesn't have to be that way but the reality is that is exactly the way it has been for the past ten years since expansion started to be talked about. Simple answer of stay same or slightly reduce Sydney to expand will suffice.

 

[Stallion]

Stallion can you contemplate a scenario where the NRL does not feel it has either the revenue to expand or the player base to expand with more clubs? In that scenario would you rather see the comp remain the same make up as now or would you rather see something done with existing make up to allow for potentially bigger opportunities in Perth, Brisbane etc to be brought online? I know you'll say it doesn't have to be that way but the reality is that is exactly the way it has been for the past ten years since expansion started to be talked about. Simple answer of stay same or slightly reduce Sydney to expand will suffice.

There are flaws in your overview.For a start the NRL had to(had to) through public outcry(South Sydney) and strategic common sense (Gold Coast )So from the 'magical 14 we now tread water on 16 teams. In my mind and many others genuine expansion meanstarted additional clubs on other areas. BY reducing the established (longtime support)by at the same time diluting the competition is shear lunacy. You are ridding the reason why this competition is so great and other areas want to.be part of it.( I'M ACTUALLY SICK AND TIRED OF GOING THROUGH THIS AGAIN AND AGAIN ) it's same people I've been warned of and others that are insincere about rugby league and its culture that keep the negative discourse continuing. Genuine growth not one step forward two steps back gents! That's progress . Implosion is a recipe to weaken longheld established supporter areas (Sydney being the prize) and also pissing off multitudes of established fan bases around Australia. If you don't think this would happen under your preferred model! ? You are truelly reckless and illogical.

 

[tri_colours]

Most of us keep a eye on ratings and finances of clubs as well. Your first sentence is somewhat true but what you fail to say also is that some Sydney clubs are also home to the worst performing clubs with sponsors and brand names. Yes Sydney has the big end of town but that is divided amongst 9/10 nrl teams, 2 afl teams, 2 soccer teams, 1 cricket and union team and that’s just men’s teams.

What do you propose if a Sydney team goes under/bankrupt in the next 5 yrs?

My first Sentence is not somewhat true Its 100% TRUE !

The Sydney clubs bring to the table more than most . If clubs go under they go under.

They built this game tnto what it is today . And made any future success possible , And for that they deserve our gratitude not be ridicule by bunch of clowns with NFI[/QUOTE]

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Stallion can you contemplate a scenario where the NRL does not feel it has either the revenue to expand or the player base to expand with more clubs? In that scenario would you rather see the comp remain the same make up as now or would you rather see something done with existing make up to allow for potentially bigger opportunities in Perth, Brisbane etc to be brought online? I know you'll say it doesn't have to be that way but the reality is that is exactly the way it has been for the past ten years since expansion started to be talked about. Simple answer of stay same or slightly reduce Sydney to expand will suffice.

I havent read below this post yet. I wanna guess his answer:

Stallion: "This situation is impossible. Sydney clubs are too special to lose and expansion is easy. If we lose the Sydney teams, expansion will be pointless and the game will be diluted (i dont know what dilution is, but it sounds intelligent). What we need is exponential growth (i also dont understand the concept of exponential growth as this would ACTUALLY course dilution of quality). Reckless, Disrespectful, more hollow buzzwords!!!!"

How did i do?

Edit: F*ck, i forgot "genuine growth" (as opposed all that FAKE growth...)

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

My first Sentence is not somewhat true Its 100% TRUE !

The Sydney clubs bring to the table more than most . If clubs go under they go under.

They built this game tnto what it is today . And made any future success possible , And for that they deserve our gratitude not be ridicule by bunch of clowns with NFI

No they didnt, they just happened to have enough poker machines that they bought all the best players from everywhere else in Australia.

Thats like saying the NFL built American Football. F*ck no, they just swooped in later and took the profits.

 

[Perth Red]

There are flaws in your overview.For a start the NRL had to(had to) through public outcry(South Sydney) and strategic common sense (Gold Coast )So from the 'magical 14 we now tread water on 16 teams. In my mind and many others genuine expansion meanstarted additional clubs on other areas. BY reducing the established (longtime support)by at the same time diluting the competition is shear lunacy. You are ridding the reason why this competition is so great and other areas want to.be part of it.( I'M ACTUALLY SICK AND TIRED OF GOING THROUGH THIS AGAIN AND AGAIN ) it's same people I've been warned of and others that are insincere about rugby league and its culture that keep the negative discourse continuing. Genuine growth not one step forward two steps back gents! That's progress . Implosion is a recipe to weaken longheld established supporter areas (Sydney being the prize) and also pissing off multitudes of established fan bases around Australia. If you don't think this would happen under your preferred model! ? You are truelly reckless and illogical.

Simple answer of stay same or slightly reduce Sydney to expand will suffice.

 

[Stallion]

No they didnt, they just happened to have enough poker machines that they bought all the best players from everywhere else in Australia.

Thats like saying the NFL built American Football. F*ck no, they just swooped in later and took the profits.

Are you serious Doctor! ? You are anot unmitigated fool and joke! If you think the NRL has not been based from.the Sydney club scene you are truelly delusional. Even the truth can't enter into your disrespectful tirade on these well known and much adored clubs. And they are not just adored in Sydney! It's Australia wide .But you can't fathom that.Not with tv pushing the great competition into the eyes of multitudes outside of Sydney.This did not happen for any other top flight rugby league in Australia. You seem to.be dirty that this is the reality and your warped view of this integral part of Australian sport is way off the mark! I can see your crocodile tears now. Even they are fake I suggest, just like your total misunderstanning and grasp of the Australian sport scene. Totally inadequate and disrespectful.

 

[Perth Red]

I havent read below this post yet. I wanna guess his answer:

Stallion: "This situation is impossible. Sydney clubs are too special to lose and expansion is easy. If we lose the Sydney teams, expansion will be pointless and the game will be diluted (i dont know what dilution is, but it sounds intelligent). What we need is exponential growth (i also dont understand the concept of exponential growth as this would ACTUALLY course dilution of quality). Reckless, Disrespectful, more hollow buzzwords!!!!"

How did i do?

Edit: F*ck, i forgot "genuine growth" (as opposed all that FAKE growth...)

You are Nostradamus!

 

[Stallion]

Simple answer of stay same or slightly reduce Sydney to expand will suffice.

The blood letting is not required! Simple answer without hurting this marvelous competition! In fact some repairsort just like in prevopus decades are required . But you can't work this out?

 

[Stallion]

You are Nostradamus!

Being cynical is your style. Unfounded , illogical and reckless ideas are your penchant!

 

[Perth Red]

The blood letting is not required! Simple answer without hurting this marvelous competition! In fact some repairsort just like in prevopus decades are required . But you can't work this out?

I didnt ask your opinion of hwat should be, I said in the quite possible scenario that at the end of the year the expansion review returns a verdict that the NRL cant afford to fund more than 16 teams would you rather the NRL stayed the same make up for the next 10-20 years or reduced the clubs in Sydney to bring in other growth opportunities? We know you think it doesn't have to be that way but lets play hypotheticals.