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Pull the finger out Burt

The Colonel

Immortal
Messages
41,810
You will also note how many defenders are usually hanging around Mateo when he runs because they know what he can do... Makes it hard for anyone to be a 2nd/3rd phase runner AND.. it isn't only the Fullbacks role to run as a support player.

Good point. Where was Hayne when Burty ran through the line? As a much better support player he should have been anticipating such a move shouldn't he? ;-)

To be perfectly honest, if I was selecting the team I would probably have Hayne in the side over Burt. But that would be because I believe that as a player whom you want to get a lot of ball and run off the halves it would suit him much better than playing at 5/8.

I just wosh Hayne would play in a similar vein to that of Karmichael Hunt.
 

EELICIT

Juniors
Messages
1,282
Burt cant be all that bad when over the last few seasons he has been the leagues top point scorer until he gets injured!
 

oldmancraigy

Coach
Messages
11,709
I would love to see and compare Burts return yardage and line breaks from the returns with stats for our other option in Hayne.. when Burt runs the ball back at least he runs the whole way back unlike Hayne who jogs the first 10 metres only to goosestep.. fool himself and get tackled...

I agree with the deleted stuff

BUT

you can't really make those claims can you?

Burt has made 61m in kick returns this season. In 2 games. That's horrid.
Hayne made more than that in each and every game he played as fullback last season.
It's really stupid to say that Burt is a better returner of the ball than anyone - I think it's ok to be a Parra fan, but to still accept that Burt is the worst returner of the football in the league UNLESS he happens to get a broken defensive line to attack.
He is terrible at returning the kick - even he knows it, which is why he passes it to Grothe and Reddy all the time (or whoever is on the wing!).

If you have the ball and have an open Runner nearby.. you are wise to promote the ball to them to gain yardage out of your own Red-zone.. that is something that most Coaches encourage .. so to me I don't see a problem with it.
That's not why Burt does it - he does it because he is so bad at returning the ball into the defence. It's no use pretending he's good at it - he's simply not, but that's ok. It's just one of his limitations as a footballer. Nobody is perfect (Grothe keeps trying to offload 4m out from his own line on the 1st tackle...) - I just don't understand why people try and say 'No WeI - BurtZoR is ReElLy eLiTT aT reTurnsZ'. It's as dumb as that sentence looks...

You will also note how many defenders are usually hanging around Mateo when he runs because they know what he can do... Makes it hard for anyone to be a 2nd/3rd phase runner AND.. it isn't only the Fullbacks role to run as a support player.

I think the point is that Burt used to do this much more in the past - it's a crucial part of his game - getting the offload and getting into open space. That's the point of him in the footy game, to run free and finish off half chances. That's what he's really good at - I'm sure even Luke himself would admit he needs to be better at that this season.
Good news is that it's only 2 games old - personally I think Burt will get back to form in this regard.
And - yes, it's not only the fullbacks role - but it's much easier for them to do it (not explaining why now - watch/ coach some footy for a while then you'll get it).

I saw the footage and again.. Burt was doing his job. He was closing the field down but remaining uncommitted in case a kick through or infield pass was made.. It was obvious for all to see that Hindy had it covered and it allowed the cover defence to close the play down completely. Again.. I see nothing wrong with what he did.

Again - I reckon even Burt himself would disagree with you here.
There was no support inside, and there's no reason to assume that a second rower is going to be able to chase down a winger. Burt was in the best position to chase and didn't - that was poor.
Luckily Hayne saved Burt's bacon, and Hindy came over the top and finished off the good work.



This board is ridiculous.

Some people go over the top in their Burt bashing (because he's bad at something, they assume he's bad at everything)
And then others reply by saying that Burt has never done a thing wrong (of course he has - he has some serious limitations as a player!)

You can admit he's a limited player, but still like what he brings! I know he can't tackle, and he's a weak returner of the footy - but I'm on my feet when he actually finds a bit of space, because that's where he's great.
Oh - and his goalkicking has been GREAT the last 3 years.
 

oldmancraigy

Coach
Messages
11,709
Let me just add that Burt tends to look a lot worse in low scoring games because they generally highlight the things he is bad at, and don't showcase what he does well in general play.

When we put up a big score, Burt tends to shine a little more because we start to see his brokenfield running, his support play and his gap running.

But he can still contribute in a low-scoring game by kicking a goal from the sideline can't he?
 

The Colonel

Immortal
Messages
41,810
Let me just add that Burt tends to look a lot worse in low scoring games because they generally highlight the things he is bad at, and don't showcase what he does well in general play.

When we put up a big score, Burt tends to shine a little more because we start to see his brokenfield running, his support play and his gap running.

But he can still contribute in a low-scoring game by kicking a goal from the sideline can't he?

The biggest gripe from the original post seems to be his error under the highball. Sutton could not have put a better bomb in the air if he tried. Just about every fullback, past or present, would have f**ked up..... maybe one or two may have made it to the ball and batted it dead or caught it on the full but it would have been a freakish bit of play.

I actually prefer to see Burt dish off to Reddy, and sometimes Grothe (the heart is always in the mouth as I wonder if he'll try and offload) and then look to get into dummy half for the next play. There have been times he has drawn a penalty off a quick play the ball or snatched 15 or so metres on a dummy half run. His returns leave us in the wrong end too often.
 

Eelementary

Post Whore
Messages
56,843
If I may...

I think what is getting people hot under the collar is that Luke just stood there staring at the ball float away and spin in midair and made no attempt to even swipe it dead over the dead ball line. True, the Luke Burt Deathriders would have crucified him for doing so anyway, but given the sheer perfection of the kick and the quality of the chasing pack, it would have probably been the safest course of action. But he just stood and watched as it bounced, and he stood and watched as Over-rated-as-hell-ow scored under the sticks.

Hope I shed some extra light.

And for the record, I am not Burt's biggest fan but I definitely do see his worth when he is fit and in form.
 

lingard

Coach
Messages
11,360
Burt needs to pull the finger out if he is going to stay in 1st grade.

1. He always misses bombs when teh defence is running through and he will have to take a hit. Last week end was embaressing to watch.
2. He has no urgency returning kicks and his metres gained each week is the lowest of all fullbacks.
3. He hardly ever takes the next hit up after a kick has been returned by the wingers and teh forwards are struggling to get back.
4. His support play is just not there for all the talk aboout it. So many times have Mateo and others turned with their arms free and no one is there. Follow Mateo around the park Burt it is not rocket science.
5. Last week when Souths made a break down the wing and Hindmarsh ran across to help push the bloke into touch Burt was standing about 3-5 metres closer to the play and made no effort to get there in cover. Hindy had to run past him to get there.
6. Where is his kicking game? He can kick a good long ball but is hardly ever doing so? (Glad he no longer does the kick offs though Inu is going gr8)

I would rather see Inu at fullback and TT in the centres. Leave Hayne at pivot he will get better and his defence on teh fringes is great. Hayne and Inu are two players I want to see with the ball in their hands as often as possible.

Whinge, whinge, whinge, whinge, whinge. SHUT UP!
 

ParraAds

Juniors
Messages
1,694
I was at the Telstra Dome for the Eels semi against Melbourne in 07...

Some of the bombs put up by Inglis had to be seen to be believed, and I never once thought Hayne was going to drop one, and he didn't.
 
Messages
2,376
Ross Conlon.

Suity

I have a hazy memory of Eric Grothe once smashing him into to touch and dislocating his hip?? Is this true?? (coopers brewery are the main cause of the haziness)

I remember being stoked at the time 'cause I f**king hated him for no reason at all...


Or maybe I'm thinking of Luke Burt???:crazy:
 
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Bigfella

Coach
Messages
10,102
I am somewhere between OMC and Bazal's position here.

I thought the bomb was a difficult take. I take Colonel'spoint that not manyof fullbacks would have taken it. However I also don't believe anyone else would have come up with that apparent non-effort? ANd Burty has created a lot of baggage for himself by letting 3 or 4 (at least) bounce last year.

I also thought he was very good after that. I think he is playing smart by linking up if he line isn't broken. He is acknowledging his limitations. He has done some good things so far. He is still a good ball player and we certainly need that, and more of it, in our backline with these halves. I also think in game pressure situations he is more likely to land the big kicks than Inu.

I think Bazal makes a good point about his positional play.

He has offered two howlers, one in each game. Otherwise he has looked pretty sharp.

Would like to see more penetrating runs, more active support, more kicking. But he is going OK IMO.

The not contesting bombs cannot last though. And if someone gets a crack at 1 I'd like to see it be Joel. The most improved player in the comp and not even oplaying in his position?
 

jk13

First Grade
Messages
6,177
thought his kick returns against souffs were alot stronger than usual. didn't cower like a submissive dog into the tackle. he's got my support a bit longer
 
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