Rank the Brisbane bids

[The Great Dane]

I think that is the point. It is very RARE for any expansion club, heartland or new frontier, to be an overnight success. Its part of the games problem. It hasnt set up its systems, or set aside the money, that is needed to invest in a new club over the first 5 plus years to make sure it is successful long term. We bring them in and leave them to flounder. I mean look at the games history in this:

Perth - set up to fail with travel costs
NZ - survived first decade by skin of teeth at times
Cowboys - only survived when News Ltd bought in and propped them up
Storm - required extra funding to keep them afloat, begrudgingly given to get News ltd out of the club
Titans - left to flounder and had to be taken over by NRL to keep them afloat

Our track record of supporting new clubs isnt great!

I agree, but at the same time a second Brisbane club should be the easiest to make an overnight success of all the NRL's expansion options (simply copy the formula that has been successful elsewhere).

The problem in Brisbane seems to be, as it always is with RL, infighting, conflicting agendas, and a refusal to learn from the past.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

I'm not against Brisbane2 (Ive always said its nuts historically the games second biggest city only has one club) but the overwhelming support for it, particularly at the expense of genuine expansion of the game, has to be tempered by some of the realities. We are going to spend $13mill plus a year of the games money on it with no signs TV are going to cover it. You'd want to see some big gains for the sport other than a local derby twice a year.
1. Kids are already growing up playing RL in Brisbane, I dont see another club doing much in that regards UNLESS it creates a massive rivalry that further grows the hype and interest around the game. To do that the new club is going to need massive fiancial backing to market itself and to build a strong on the field team.
2. Sydney hasnt put the Warritahs or Swans to the sword with nine clubs so I dont see adding another will impact much on AFL or Union in Brisbane. They attract different fans and sponsors generally.
3. Yes it has worked well in Perth, largely because the second club was set up well as a point of difference from the Eagles, but I also concede that the fact that you simply could not actually go to an eagles game as every seat was sold 7-8 years in advance also plays a big part in people following the Dockers. For the first decade dockers were seen as a bit of a joke and had plenty of financial stress. The first 7 years they had some of the smallest crowd avg's in the AFL.
4. Having introduced GC and with Storm reliant (though less so at moment) on Qland talent it would be fool hardy to think another Qland club isnt going to eat into those clubs recruitment options
5. GC are still in a precarious infancy. We'd want to be very sure that adding another Brisbane club isnt goign to tip them over again into insolvency. It probably wont but geez we'd want to be sure.
6. The $ value of expansion is in extra content, adding Brisbane2 on their own is going to cost the NRL money, not make it. Id rather we waited until we were ready to bring in a ninth game than add one team at great expense, especially now given the games financial problems.

You make some good points.

I definately think that Brisbane 2 will pay benefits in the longer term rather than immediately but I guess that point would apply to any reasonable expansion option).

 

[titoelcolombiano]

For every argument you've made there an almost identical one was made about the Titans. . .

If done right a second Brisbane club is a great idea, but one wrong move and it'll end up an expensive long term investment similar to the Titans when, like the Titans, it should have been an overnight success, and the NRL can't afford that right now.

Agreed that it has to be done right (which is the case for any expansion team from now on). The Titans got off to a good start but have been poorly managed since. Hopefully for the sake of not turning the GC over to AFL in the long-term they can turn things around.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

You make some good points.

I definately think that Brisbane 2 will pay benefits in the longer term rather than immediately but I guess that point would apply to any reasonable expansion option).

Broncos' average was 16,000 in 1988, but jumped to 35,000 by the mid-1990s. It will take a few years for Brisbane 2 to carve out a suppprter base.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Broncos' average was 16,000 in 1988, but jumped to 35,000 by the mid-1990s. It will take a few years for Brisbane 2 to carve out a suppprter base.

Yes, agreed and it is well worth the short and long term benefits to the game.

 

[taipan]

Think having two Brisbane sides offers casual RL fans(that may like other codes) an alternative,when as is happening ATM one only Brisbane side is playing like crap.
Bandwagonners then jump onto other Brisbane sides that are doing well.
Comparing 9 NRL teams in Sydney and its lack of effect on the Swans ,bears no relation to Brisbane with one NRL team.The Swans get ordinary TV ratings in Sydney still, after 38 years.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Think having two Brisbane sides offers casual RL fans(that may like other codes) an alternative,when as is happening ATM one only Brisbane side is playing like crap.
Bandwagonners then jump onto other Brisbane sides that are doing well.
Comparing 9 NRL teams in Sydney and its lack of effect on the Swans ,bears no relation to Brisbane with one NRL team.The Swans get ordinary TV ratings in Sydney still, after 38 years.

This! Yes, the Lions have their own market but at the moment they are also benefiting from picking up the casual sports fan or fans that want to go to live sport each weekend and the Lions / Reds are the only other option.

Make no mistake, the Lions and Reds will be put under pressure by a second NRL side in Brisbane and the AFL and ARU will be shitting their pants at the prospect of it being even half as successful as the Broncos.

 

[Perth Red]

What should have happened is rather than let News Ltd set up the Broncos the license should have gone to the BRL and they should have decided who has it and get some kick back from it in the same way the WAFL owns the two AFL licenses in WA and gets money from Eagles and Dockers for their use of the licenses. Should never have let a media partner own a club, such a massive conflict of interest from day one. Just another frick up by RL administrators.

 

[Perth Red]

This! Yes, the Lions have their own market but at the moment they are also benefiting from picking up the casual sports fan or fans that want to go to live sport each weekend and the Lions / Reds are the only other option.

Make no mistake, the Lions and Reds will be put under pressure by a second NRL side in Brisbane and the AFL and ARU will be shitting their pants at the prospect of it being even half as successful as the Broncos.

Are there really many casual sports fans? At $50 a pop to go to a game I doubt there are many who dont follow the club who juts turn up as a neutral to watch a bit of live sport.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Are there really many casual sports fans? At $50 a pop to go to a game I doubt there are many who dont follow the club who juts turn up as a neutral to watch a bit of live sport.

You can definately see it with the sudden bandwagon surge of support when the Reds or Lions play well. There are those out there that want to go to an event. Usually that's the Broncos in Brisbane but they are a swinging 5 - 10k that will follow the trends.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Think having two Brisbane sides offers casual RL fans(that may like other codes) an alternative,when as is happening ATM one only Brisbane side is playing like crap.
Bandwagonners then jump onto other Brisbane sides that are doing well.
Comparing 9 NRL teams in Sydney and its lack of effect on the Swans ,bears no relation to Brisbane with one NRL team.The Swans get ordinary TV ratings in Sydney still, after 38 years.

The other beauty about Bris 2 and 3 is there are plenty of New South Welshmen in the area. Having 3 teams will give them more opportunities to watch their team play in Brisbane. Sydney clubs could start selling 4 game QLD memberships to fans living in SE QLD to see their team play Broncos, Bris 2, Bris 3 and GC. I can really see the Sydney clubs profiting from this.

 

[taipan]

The other beauty about Bris 2 and 3 is there are plenty of New South Welshmen in the area. Having 3 teams will give them more opportunities to watch their team play in Brisbane. Sydney clubs could start selling 4 game QLD memberships to fans living in SE QLD to see their team play Broncos, Bris 2, Bris 3 and GC. I can really see the Sydney clubs profiting from this.

Having so many New South Welshmen in the area, also raises the I.Q. of the area.
Remember Kempsey is in Queensland.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

What should have happened is rather than let News Ltd set up the Broncos the license should have gone to the BRL and they should have decided who has it and get some kick back from it in the same way the WAFL owns the two AFL licenses in WA and gets money from Eagles and Dockers for their use of the licenses. Should never have let a media partner own a club, such a massive conflict of interest from day one. Just another frick up by RL administrators.

That's a fair point

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

This! Yes, the Lions have their own market but at the moment they are also benefiting from picking up the casual sports fan or fans that want to go to live sport each weekend and the Lions / Reds are the only other option.

Make no mistake, the Lions and Reds will be put under pressure by a second NRL side in Brisbane and the AFL and ARU will be shitting their pants at the prospect of it being even half as successful as the Broncos.

14 years ago I attended my one and only AwFuL game at the Gabba. The women sitting to my right were Canadian uni students.

If we had 2 or 3 NRL clubs in Brisbane then that would provide more opportunities for tourists to attend an RL game.

At the moment, tourists view fumbleball as an exotic Australian game and attend a match while here so they can experience the "culture". They don't know about RL and our game does nothing to draw them to it. The ARLC should be spending money advertising the game at air ports and on travel packages.

 

[Pippen94]

I agree, but at the same time a second Brisbane club should be the easiest to make an overnight success of all the NRL's expansion options (simply copy the formula that has been successful elsewhere).

The problem in Brisbane seems to be, as it always is with RL, infighting, conflicting agendas, and a refusal to learn from the past.

Must pick Dolphins then

 

[The Great Dane]

Must pick Dolphins then

That would be refusing to learn from the past.

 

[Brothers Old Boy]

1 Brisbane Firehawks. Main reason being, ideally situated home/training base at Langlands Park being approximately 7 klms from Suncorp Stadium, where they will play out of. Historically a strong established Southside club (Brisbane/Eastern Suburbs Tigers) which will give balance to a North side v South side Derby rivalry. The one thing I would like to see though is a collaboration with the Western Corridor bid and call themselves Brisbane Jagera Firehawks. It gives them a different idenity to the already named "Brisbane" Broncos, they could also play a couple of home games at Ipswich.
2. Moreton Bay Dolphins. Whilst probably the strongest bid in terms of infrastructure and financial strength, a drawback could be their home base being approximately 40 klms from Suncorp Stadium (even though they've stated they will play the bulk of their home games at Suncorp) Eventually members and supporters are going to want more games at Dolphin Oval. It would also result in 2 North side based NRL clubs.
3. Brisbane Bombers - Pass.

 

[T-Boon]

I prefer Brisbane Firefighters. That is a cool name. Everybody loves fire fighters. They are super hero ish.

 

[steeden.]

What should have happened is rather than let News Ltd set up the Broncos the license should have gone to the BRL and they should have decided who has it and get some kick back from it in the same way the WAFL owns the two AFL licenses in WA and gets money from Eagles and Dockers for their use of the licenses. Should never have let a media partner own a club, such a massive conflict of interest from day one. Just another frick up by RL administrators.

Good points on ownership, but News Corp didn’t take control of the Broncos until the 1990s. The original owners were ex BRL players.

One of the bids for the licence was somewhat QRL-backed (Ron McAullife was involved) and that bid was going to do a percentage back to the QRL from memory. The winning bid - Morgan/Maranta bid - was a lump sum.

It’s covered in more detail in ‘Brisbane Broncos: The Team To Beat’ by Jack Galloway.

 

[Vee]

I prefer Brisbane Firefighters. That is a cool name. Everybody loves fire fighters. They are super hero ish.

Hose Fairies. One reason we have Police is that firemen need heroes too