Redcliffe put their hand up

[Pippen94]

No one cares if they dont rate in Melbourne, THEY ARE THE SECOND MOST WATCHED TEAM IN THE NRL lol.
If you dont think the second most viewed team aren't valuable in the TV contract then there's nothing we can help with you.

Storm hasn't grown game in Victoria but rather in qld. Smashes your argument that new qld team won't create fans!!

 

[T-Boon]

Yeah - we don't want Perth coming in and doing a Storm which is to ignore their own city and exploit Queensland. I would prefer the Panthers head over there and Perth can exploit western sydney talent.

 

[Perth Red]

Storm hasn't grown game in Victoria but rather in qld. Smashes your argument that new qld team won't create fans!!

It wont create fans, its the same fans watching more. Ive just given you the reason the FTA audience in Melbourne isnt growing, its called putting your product on the digital channel.

Read the report I posted, it will tell you all you need to know!

 

[Pippen94]

It wont create fans, its the same fans watching more. Ive just given you the reason the FTA audience in Melbourne isnt growing, its called putting your product on the digital channel.

Read the report I posted, it will tell you all you need to know!

Afl was on FTA in Sydney for decades & got shafted to secondary channel cause it doesn't rate. Vice versa ppl don't watch NRL in Melbourne. Your stats only prove ppl in Qld watch the sport & in greater numbers when there's qld content i.e. Storm

 

[Bring back John Fifita]

The Storm were pieced together with the freshly rotting remains of the Perth Reds, South Queensland Crushers and Hunter Mariners. They bought the best players from these three teams and had News Ltd as their sugar daddy until 2012. News Ltd had a 50% stake in the game, so they could, theoretically, set the agenda to suit their team. Over $100 million was spent on the Storm by News Ltd and the ARLC between 1998 and 2018 to ensure they had the resources required to identify the best talent in Queensland, NSW, NZ, Fiji and PNG, then bring them up to grade. It's no coincidence that the club has such a good strike rate with introducing juniors into first grade and turning them into stars. The players need to have the talent and the right coaches to make that transition.

Perth and Adelaide will have none of these advantages. News Ltd are no longer in control and don't have the money or desire to invest in these cities. The way the game has been run over the last 20 years has led to fewer playmakers who can organise their backline or read the situation and adjust accordingly coming through the ranks, so no Smiths or Cronks floating around in Queensland for Perth and Adelaide.

I'm not trying to be a naysayer, just pointing out that the unique situation that allowed Storm to rise to the top will not present itself for Adelaide and Perth. The best bet for both cities is to saddle up with a couple of Sydney teams that have strong junior nurseries and slowly build a fanbase in Adelaide and Perth to compliment what they have in Sydney. Over time they will become two of the stronger clubs in the competition and can shift more of their games to Adelaide and Perth. Keeping these teams based in Sydney will save them a lot of money, especially for their lower grade teams. It will make the clubs more attractive options for players who are already based in Sydney.

Yep absolutely agree with how they came to be, from the pieces of the others. And was a kick-starter for them in 98.. Good Post.

That said - they quickly built, and sustained, a successful club on and off the field. This could have been a disaster. And at the time, most pundits and so-called experts were shaking their heads and asking “ Why Melbourne?”, waiting for them to fail. But they didn’t.

Melbourne actually worked. Not because of the crumbs they picked off the table of the Reds & Mariners etc. I don’t know all the magic behind it but a lot I’d suggest would be lessons learnt from the issues of the previous clubs.

Thus I believe the Storm should be used as a blueprint for a club structure should Perth or Adelaide get another shot at the NRL. Melbourne proved you can have a successful Rugby League club outside NSW n QLD. In fact - you can have the most successful club outside NSW n QLD.

 

[Bring back John Fifita]

Port Adelaide have consistently been one of the strugglers in the AFL since their inception. They are not a model to emulate.

Redcliffe should be immediately dismissed by the NRL as a potential bid and be told to not waste their time and effort.

WHY KANE CORNES IS CONCERNED ABOUT THE FUTURE OF PORT ADELAIDE

Port Adelaide great Kane Cornes admits he’s “worried" about the future of his former club.

The Power battled back from a decline in crowds and revenue in 2011 to become an off-field force in the AFL but due to the coronavirus pandemic, all that good work could be undone.

Cornes recounted a story from his playing days where he thought Port Adelaide were on the verge of folding.

“My football club was in a perilous position in 2011,” he said on AFL Nation.

“One day we got an all staff email in our holidays saying that everyone was required down to the football club and I thought that was it. I thought they couldn’t pay us anymore, no one was turning up to our games, the coach had been paid out and the club’s financial position was on a knife’s edge.

“I’m really worried about my footy club because I’ve lived it, they are one of the struggling clubs who relied on AFL funding to keep them alive. Now there’s not that AFL funding – will the Port Adelaide footy club be around? It’s not that obvious of a question in two or three years and that’s what scared me a bit.”

https://www.sen.com.au/news/2020/03...-concerned-about-the-future-of-port-adelaide/

Haha! Kane Cornes... probably the most loathed AFL figurehead in the sport. Like Rothfield for the NRL.

Yes they’ve struggled on the field at times, and had financial issues.

But..

In becoming the 2nd team in a one-team town, where basically everyone followed the crows, they brought an immediate fanbase and created an instant rivalry with the main team in town. If they’d have tried to make a completely new team from the clouds... it wouldn’t have lasted a season or two..

They have won a title, now lead the comp, and have a huge following in a city of just over a million people.

My point being....

In Brisbane the broncos are the big show in town... huge following. So how do you bring another Brisbane side in that a rugby league fan will follow, convert to, be immediately passionate about?

Or more importantly, a significant initial and ultimately a large, sustainable fan base that will make it a success?

It may well be the Firehawks.. Or the Dolphins. Qlders will know better than I do here, but I’ve seen how big n successful the Power are in Adelaide by living here. Not by selected snippets of news that support a case against them. Hence why I asked the question.

Assume I’m gonna get Daned on this post, can’t wait..

 

[ash the bash]

https://www.nrl.com/news/2020/09/22/dolphins-bid-nrl-ready-with-new-stadium-complete/

This article gives us a better idea, couple of quotes.

"The Dolphins intend to play most of their games out of Suncorp Stadium with the new stadium to host a couple of games a year and to serve as the main training field for the NRL side"
- 9 @ Suncorp, 2 Dolphin Oval, 1 Sunshine coast potentially.

"One of the most attractive things about the Dolphins being the next Brisbane-based NRL team is that they already have in place and own what most expansion teams go bankrupt trying to achieve. The infrastructure is already here,"
- Valid point

"The bid will also engage with fans about the name to precede 'Dolphins', although the bid team has determined that it won't be Redcliffe in order to broaden its appeal in the south-east of Queensland"
- Moreton Bay Dolphins, North Brisbane Dolphins etc... Taking right steps here IMO.

"Another frequently-asked question is whether our colours will be the same as the Redcliffe Dolphins. Red and white is non-negotiable, that is the Dolphins' colours, but when you think about getting the public involved we will ask them what other colour they would like to see added to that."
- Personally would go for a grey/silver as the third colour.

 

[jim_57]

https://www.nrl.com/news/2020/09/22/dolphins-bid-nrl-ready-with-new-stadium-complete/

This article gives us a better idea, couple of quotes.

"The Dolphins intend to play most of their games out of Suncorp Stadium with the new stadium to host a couple of games a year and to serve as the main training field for the NRL side"
- 9 @ Suncorp, 2 Dolphin Oval, 1 Sunshine coast potentially.

"One of the most attractive things about the Dolphins being the next Brisbane-based NRL team is that they already have in place and own what most expansion teams go bankrupt trying to achieve. The infrastructure is already here,"
- Valid point

"The bid will also engage with fans about the name to precede 'Dolphins', although the bid team has determined that it won't be Redcliffe in order to broaden its appeal in the south-east of Queensland"
- Moreton Bay Dolphins, North Brisbane Dolphins etc... Taking right steps here IMO.

"Another frequently-asked question is whether our colours will be the same as the Redcliffe Dolphins. Red and white is non-negotiable, that is the Dolphins' colours, but when you think about getting the public involved we will ask them what other colour they would like to see added to that."
- Personally would go for a grey/silver as the third colour.

Good to see they're taking steps to broaden their appeal, right moves in my opinion and looking very strong.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Haha! Kane Cornes... probably the most loathed AFL figurehead in the sport. Like Rothfield for the NRL.

Yes they’ve struggled on the field at times, and had financial issues.

But..

In becoming the 2nd team in a one-team town, where basically everyone followed the crows, they brought an immediate fanbase and created an instant rivalry with the main team in town. If they’d have tried to make a completely new team from the clouds... it wouldn’t have lasted a season or two..

They have won a title, now lead the comp, and have a huge following in a city of just over a million people.

My point being....

In Brisbane the broncos are the big show in town... huge following. So how do you bring another Brisbane side in that a rugby league fan will follow, convert to, be immediately passionate about?

Or more importantly, a significant initial and ultimately a large, sustainable fan base that will make it a success?

It may well be the Firehawks.. Or the Dolphins. Qlders will know better than I do here, but I’ve seen how big n successful the Power are in Adelaide by living here. Not by selected snippets of news that support a case against them. Hence why I asked the question.

Assume I’m gonna get Daned on this post, can’t wait..

I put Dane on ignore weeks ago. Not seeing his contrarian opinions, which he pretends are facts, is great.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

https://www.nrl.com/news/2020/09/22/dolphins-bid-nrl-ready-with-new-stadium-complete/

This article gives us a better idea, couple of quotes.

"The Dolphins intend to play most of their games out of Suncorp Stadium with the new stadium to host a couple of games a year and to serve as the main training field for the NRL side"
- 9 @ Suncorp, 2 Dolphin Oval, 1 Sunshine coast potentially.

"One of the most attractive things about the Dolphins being the next Brisbane-based NRL team is that they already have in place and own what most expansion teams go bankrupt trying to achieve. The infrastructure is already here,"
- Valid point

"The bid will also engage with fans about the name to precede 'Dolphins', although the bid team has determined that it won't be Redcliffe in order to broaden its appeal in the south-east of Queensland"
- Moreton Bay Dolphins, North Brisbane Dolphins etc... Taking right steps here IMO.

"Another frequently-asked question is whether our colours will be the same as the Redcliffe Dolphins. Red and white is non-negotiable, that is the Dolphins' colours, but when you think about getting the public involved we will ask them what other colour they would like to see added to that."
- Personally would go for a grey/silver as the third colour.

I reckon it will be a great addition to the NRL. Moreton Bay Dolphins has a great ring to it, and can represent Moreton Bay Region, Sunshine Coast, Brisbane bayside suburbs and Redlands. That way the coast from the Sunshine Coast right down to the NSW border is represented.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Yep absolutely agree with how they came to be, from the pieces of the others. And was a kick-starter for them in 98.. Good Post.

That said - they quickly built, and sustained, a successful club on and off the field. This could have been a disaster. And at the time, most pundits and so-called experts were shaking their heads and asking “ Why Melbourne?”, waiting for them to fail. But they didn’t.

Melbourne actually worked. Not because of the crumbs they picked off the table of the Reds & Mariners etc. I don’t know all the magic behind it but a lot I’d suggest would be lessons learnt from the issues of the previous clubs.

Thus I believe the Storm should be used as a blueprint for a club structure should Perth or Adelaide get another shot at the NRL. Melbourne proved you can have a successful Rugby League club outside NSW n QLD. In fact - you can have the most successful club outside NSW n QLD.

The Storm structure was based on annual grants of around $5 million from 98-12 from News Ltd, then another $27.5 million, if my memory is correct, from the ARLC until 2018. On top of that they were getting the annual grant that is given to all clubs.

I just cannot see how the Storm, Adelaide and Perth can raid juniors from the same junior leagues in QLD, NSW, NZ, Fiji and PNG without it diluting the quality of the competition. Surely it will lead to the Storm becoming an average team, as they will have 2 other competitors doing the same thing as them. It's only a winning strategy for them right now because they're the only ones doing it.

 

[LeagueXIII]

Adelaide will not be playing in the NRL for decades

 

[Bring back John Fifita]

The Storm structure was based on annual grants of around $5 million from 98-12 from News Ltd, then another $27.5 million, if my memory is correct, from the ARLC until 2018. On top of that they were getting the annual grant that is given to all clubs.

I just cannot see how the Storm, Adelaide and Perth can raid juniors from the same junior leagues in QLD, NSW, NZ, Fiji and PNG without it diluting the quality of the competition. Surely it will lead to the Storm becoming an average team, as they will have 2 other competitors doing the same thing as them. It's only a winning strategy for them right now because they're the only ones doing it.

I think the big well is the Pacific islands. Storm indeed got a kickstart - and they’ve kicked on.

 

[Bring back John Fifita]

Adelaide will not be playing in the NRL for decades

Thanks!

 

[flippikat]

https://www.nrl.com/news/2020/09/22/dolphins-bid-nrl-ready-with-new-stadium-complete/

This article gives us a better idea, couple of quotes.

"The Dolphins intend to play most of their games out of Suncorp Stadium with the new stadium to host a couple of games a year and to serve as the main training field for the NRL side"
- 9 @ Suncorp, 2 Dolphin Oval, 1 Sunshine coast potentially.

"One of the most attractive things about the Dolphins being the next Brisbane-based NRL team is that they already have in place and own what most expansion teams go bankrupt trying to achieve. The infrastructure is already here,"

"Another frequently-asked question is whether our colours will be the same as the Redcliffe Dolphins. Red and white is non-negotiable, that is the Dolphins' colours, but when you think about getting the public involved we will ask them what other colour they would like to see added to that."
- Personally would go for a grey/silver as the third colour.

For the home games split, I'd prefer 9-10 Suncorp & 1-2 Sunshine Coast *if* they have to take some games away from Suncorp. Keep Dolphin Oval as their training base & Qld Cup home ground, but maybe use it for a trial match for the NRL team. Focusing on engaging with the Sunshine Coast with a guaranteed game or 2 per year makes more sense to me than trying to use 3 grounds in the regular season.

As for the jersey, mostly red home (grey & white trim), mostly grey alternate ( red & white trim)

No NRL has a mostly red primary jersey, and I can't think of any with a grey alternate - though some clubs have used grey instead of white for alternates in the past.

 

[adamkungl]

South Queensland Dolphins.

Forget "Redcliffe", forget "Moreton Bay". New teams have to have national and even international appeal. Queensland has to be in the name. Brisbane could do, but Brisbane-Redcliffe is a bit awkward/old-timey and North Brisbane has too much overlap with Norths Devils.
South Queensland has international recognition and is a nice counterpoint to North Queensland.

South Queensland. Red jerseys. Most games at Suncorp.
It's a very strong brand.

 

[Bring back John Fifita]

South Queensland Dolphins.

Forget "Redcliffe", forget "Moreton Bay". New teams have to have national and even international appeal. Queensland has to be in the name. Brisbane could do, but Brisbane-Redcliffe is a bit awkward/old-timey and North Brisbane has too much overlap with Norths Devils.
South Queensland has international recognition and is a nice counterpoint to North Queensland.

South Queensland. Red jerseys. Most games at Suncorp.
It's a very strong brand.

I like the Dolphins branding..

And

South Queensland compliments (and balances with) North Queensland

Thumbs up from me.

 

[The Great Dane]

Haha! Kane Cornes... probably the most loathed AFL figurehead in the sport. Like Rothfield for the NRL.

Yes they’ve struggled on the field at times, and had financial issues.

But..

In becoming the 2nd team in a one-team town, where basically everyone followed the crows, they brought an immediate fanbase and created an instant rivalry with the main team in town. If they’d have tried to make a completely new team from the clouds... it wouldn’t have lasted a season or two..

They have won a title, now lead the comp, and have a huge following in a city of just over a million people.

My point being....

In Brisbane the broncos are the big show in town... huge following. So how do you bring another Brisbane side in that a rugby league fan will follow, convert to, be immediately passionate about?

Or more importantly, a significant initial and ultimately a large, sustainable fan base that will make it a success?

It may well be the Firehawks.. Or the Dolphins. Qlders will know better than I do here, but I’ve seen how big n successful the Power are in Adelaide by living here. Not by selected snippets of news that support a case against them. Hence why I asked the question.

Assume I’m gonna get Daned on this post, can’t wait..

You want me to bite, fine I'll bite.

Everything you say is at best built on your own anecdotal experience (i.e. literally the least reliable form of evidence in existence), what we are saying is supported by the observed and repeated behaviour of humans across the world not only in sport but in any from of tribal environment, and that is that it's extremely hard to get members of one tribe to willingly join another en masse that they have been in conflict with or even just loath or hate.

You are the supporter of a Sydney club, do you remember how fans in Sydney respond to the original Super League plan (or any of the other similar plans), which was to effectively create a new competition that would come in on top of the NSWRL/ARL, and that only X amount of Sydney clubs would be promoted into, while the rest of the clubs supporters would be folded into those clubs support base?
I do, 99% of them came out and basically said "I'll not be caught dead supporting anyone other than my club". But here you are, in a situation that is extremely analogous (basically the same) suggesting that supporters in Brisbane won't have a similar reaction. . . It's totally illogical.

I also note that you totally ignored my last post where I presented an undeniable and recent example of the phenomena we are talking about in a sporting environment, where a huge portion of the broader RU community in Canberra outright revolted against the Tuggeranong/Canberra Vikings, simply because they refused to support a hated rival, which instantly killed any commercial potential that the team had. . . If you copy what the Vikings did you'll get the same result that they did.

 

[greenBV4]

I just cannot see how the Storm, Adelaide and Perth can raid juniors from the same junior leagues in QLD, NSW, NZ, Fiji and PNG without it diluting the quality of the competition. Surely it will lead to the Storm becoming an average team, as they will have 2 other competitors doing the same thing as them. It's only a winning strategy for them right now because they're the only ones doing it.

You think Storm are the only team recruiting from outside there area and in the PIs? not many teams would have a roster filled with majority local juniors, even in the heatland, and Kiwis and other Islanders make up a LARGE percentage of the playing pool - they are noones local juniors and all would of been scouted

Also, local juniors should have no bearing on a clubs success in the NRL nor the location of new teams. Like it or not the NRL is (supposed to be) corporate and nation-wide - like top tier competitions from all around the world signings also come from everywhere. A local junior making it for a local club is still a great story, I'd like to see Young Tonumaipea come back to Melbourne (the club apparently has shown interest and he turned down an extension at the Titans), but should not be the pillarstone for sucess, sucess should be the pillarstone for sucess.

It IS NOT an NRL club's role to invest in local juniors, it's that of the leagues clubs, local leagues, the state leages and the NRL. Because some clubs are tied-in with a leagues club its seen as that team investing in juniors - it's not, it's the venue doing so, which is a seperate entity who's only legal reason to exists is to do just that, take away that leagues club and the pokie money and I can bet you that club will no longer support the local scene like they do.

Failure to engage local players in Melbourne is not a failure of the Storm's, its NRL Vic's failure, and so by extension the NRLs.


Also, great to see Redcliffe are making efforts to broaden their appeal, if they stick to this I can see them getting the nod - I also agree that the redcliffe stadium game would be better off shifted to the sunny coast and keeping dolphin stadium as a class training centre and home ground for the qld cup side

 

[flippikat]

Also, great to see Redcliffe are making efforts to broaden their appeal, if they stick to this I can see them getting the nod - I also agree that the redcliffe stadium game would be better off shifted to the sunny coast and keeping dolphin stadium as a class training centre and home ground for the qld cup side

Precisely. The Dolphins secondary market/"home away from home" has to be Sunshine Coast. 10 games at Suncorp, 2 on the Sunshine Coast. Redcliffe Stadium as a training base/Qld Cup venue.

Then in about a decade, introduce a West Brisbane/Ipswich club with a similar profile- Training & base at Ipswich, most games at Suncorp, 1 or 2 in Toowoomba to have the inland towns as secondary market.