Redcliffe put their hand up

[The Great Dane]

"There was no failing [with the Crushers]. They were actually kicked out of the competition with money in the bank," Gould said on his Six Tackles with Gus podcast last year.​

"They were financially viable, that was just political. That was the fact that the Brisbane Broncos were owned primarily by the media company; (News Corp) just flushed them out of town, they didn't want them there as competition.

https://wwos.nine.com.au/nrl/expans...edcliffe/dab74d5d-8553-4cbf-b9f6-a7b801725ef7​

I tried telling TGD that a few months ago, but he claimed it was all untrue.

"We picked up the first million-dollar sponsor, XXXX Gold, nobody had a million-dollar sponsor at that time. They were heady days, good days and I really enjoyed it.

https://wwos.nine.com.au/nrl/expans...edcliffe/dab74d5d-8553-4cbf-b9f6-a7b801725ef7​

Broncos were probably jealous of this.

You just love cherry picking and misrepresenting stuff don't you. From your own source-

The Crushers had debts when they were liquidated, reportedly about $3 million. Crowds had dwindled along with the on-field results. They were far from a Broncos-style powerhouse, yet the club was not at death's door. It was a fledgling organisation still establishing roots, which were instead torn from the Brisbane soil.

So according to this article the Crushers somehow both had money in the bank and were $3mil in debt when they were wrapped up. That doesn't make much sense does it!?

I think what has happened is that Gus or the columnist has confused the South Queensland Crushers with the Gold Coast Chargers.

The Chargers had money in the bank when they folded and looked like they were on the up.
The Crushers on the other hand were drowning in debt with no obvious way to pay it off, and the only justifications given for them not being at deaths door by the columnist are Gould's quote (which we've already established is shonky) and the fact that they had a good crop of juniors coming through, when it's a massive assumption to think that A. those juniors would have been successful at the club and B. that it would have made much of a difference to the clubs financial issues even if they were.

In other words it's a massive stretch to suggest that they weren't at deaths door, and realistically the only way they were getting out of the position they were in was if something unpredictable happened, like Eric Watson saving the Warriors in 2000 or Rusty buying the Rabbitohs in 06.

 

[Perth Red]

You just love cherry picking and misrepresenting stuff don't you. From your own source-
So according to this article the Crushers somehow both had money in the bank and were $3mil in debt when they were wrapped up. That doesn't make much sense does it!?

I think what has happened is that Gus or the columnist has confused the South Queensland Crushers with the Gold Coast Chargers.

The Chargers had money in the bank when they folded and looked like they were on the up.
The Crushers on the other hand were drowning in debt with no obvious way to pay it off, and the only justifications given for them not being at deaths door by the columnist are Gould's quote (which we've already established is shonky) and the fact that they had a good crop of juniors coming through, when it's a massive assumption to think that A. those juniors would have been successful at the club and B. that it would have made much of a difference to the clubs financial issues even if they were.

In other words it's a massive stretch to suggest that they weren't at deaths door, and realistically the only way they were getting out of the position they were in was if something unpredictable happened, like Eric Watson saving the Warriors in 2000 or Rusty buying the Rabbitohs in 06.

yeh it was very contradictory!

 

[titoelcolombiano]

The two News Ltd clubs, Broncos and Storm, have been disastrous for RL in Australia.

Mate, I'm with you on some of your ideas but the Broncos and the Storm (and I guess roosters) are the benchmark of what all NRL clubs should aspire to. yes, there were politics back in the day but I wish there were 16 NRL clubs run like these. They have high ratings, turn a profit, have quality sponsors, high memberships and attendances.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Mate, I'm with you on some of your ideas but the Broncos and the Storm (and I guess roosters) are the benchmark of what all NRL clubs should aspire to. yes, there were politics back in the day but I wish there were 16 NRL clubs run like these. They have high ratings, turn a profit, have quality sponsors, high memberships and attendances.

They draw high ratings and attendances, especially in southeast Queensland, because they're more successful than the other clubs and Brisbane is under served. Their success is tied to them having better funding than everyone else and close links with the game's primary broadcaster. The amount of favourable onfield calls these two clubs get is bewildering and makes a mockery of the competition.

Broncos weren't very popular this year as they had a shit season. The same will happen when Storm have a year from hell. Roosters and Storm should be drawing better attendances given their onfield success.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

They draw high ratings and attendances, especially in southeast Queensland, because they're more successful than the other clubs and Brisbane is under served. Their success is tied to them having better funding than everyone else and close links with the game's primary broadcaster. The amount of favourable onfield calls these two clubs get is bewildering and makes a mockery of the competition.

Broncos weren't very popular this year as they had a shit season. The same will happen when Storm have a year from hell. Roosters and Storm should be drawing better attendances given their onfield success.

I don't disagree that the Broncos and Storm have had a leg-up in the past stemming from News and the end of the SL war, and it was political. But the more clubs we have around the game that are successful on and off the field like them the better and I think it is critical for RL's standing in the Australian sporting landscape that we have those two flagship clubs to point ot. Imagine the state of the NRL with no Melbourne presence at all. Brisbane you could argue would fall on it's feet because it's a RL city.

I really hope Parra and the Dogs can get their shit together because they should be behemoths of Australian sport... ditto the Dragons. I just want our clubs to reach their potential and I say that as someome that doesn't follow an NRL club at all. I just love the game.

 

[Perth Red]

Mate, I'm with you on some of your ideas but the Broncos and the Storm (and I guess roosters) are the benchmark of what all NRL clubs should aspire to. yes, there were politics back in the day but I wish there were 16 NRL clubs run like these. They have high ratings, turn a profit, have quality sponsors, high memberships and attendances.

Hes batsht crazy to want to get rid of the two biggest clubs in the world of rugby league lol. He'd rather have 4 Brisbane suburban clubs financially struggling and drawing 13k like Sydney!

 

[mongoose]

Hes batsht crazy to want to get rid of the two biggest clubs in the world of rugby league lol. He'd rather have 4 Brisbane suburban clubs financially struggling and drawing 13k like Sydney!

yep the aim should be 2 Brisbane clubs for now playing most games out of Suncorp. Broncos averaging 35-40k per game and Brisbane 2 getting 25-30k per game. Give both teams enough Sunday afternoon games and they will achieve the higher end of those crowds numbers with ease.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Hes batsht crazy to want to get rid of the two biggest clubs in the world of rugby league lol. He'd rather have 4 Brisbane suburban clubs financially struggling and drawing 13k like Sydney!

Broncos, Storm and Roosters are the benchmark. Hopefully there are more to follow. Parra, Dogs, Saints and Souths all should be sporting and financial powerhouses of Australian sport.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Hes batsht crazy to want to get rid of the two biggest clubs in the world of rugby league lol. He'd rather have 4 Brisbane suburban clubs financially struggling and drawing 13k like Sydney!

You're a willfully ignorant blowhard with a shit understanding of Australian RL history and culture. Instead of trying to see things from our point of view, you sit there on your high horse and tell us how we should change to suit you because you're not a fan of our system.

Your stupidity would kill the game if it were embraced by the ARLC.

I never said to get rid of the Storm. I'm just sick of the concessions they're given to ensure they're always at the top.

You're such a loony you once said Brisbane should only have one team to keep the Storm strong.

If the Storm are as strong ad you say, why did News Ltd and the ARLC need to fund $92M to $100M into their coffers over 20 years?

Despite all of your bluster about how great and necessary Melbourne is for the game, they're yet to produce local player that can cut it in the NRL.

Neither you, mongoose or TGD have answered my question about why you think Brisbane should only have 2 teams. The current population of Brisbane's metro area is 2.4M. Three teams spread across 2.4M is 800,000 people per team. If you're going to pretend that's not enough for 3 teams, then explain how Adelaide can handle 2 AwFuL teams with a population of 1.3M, which is 650,000 per team?

Go on!

To argue that 4 teams in Brisbane by 2050 will only average 13k each is BS that you're pulling from your arse. You don't know how many they will average, so STFU. The population of Brisbane will be what, 4.5M by 2050?

You're also stark raving mad to think Perth is comparable to Brisbane. Brisbane is the world's second largest RL city. Despite all the lies you sprout about WA RL, Perth is, and always has been, a dyed in the wool fumbleball city that hates RL. The game found that out the hard way between 95-97. Crowds for games in Perth have not been strong enough to warrant them having their own team. You lie about them, too.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

yep the aim should be 2 Brisbane clubs for now playing most games out of Suncorp. Broncos averaging 35-40k per game and Brisbane 2 getting 25-30k per game. Give both teams enough Sunday afternoon games and they will achieve the higher end of those crowds numbers with ease.

That's your aim, and it makes zero sense.

You prattle on about how vital the Melbourne market is, yet all the sources you've provided have shown their high TV ratings come from southeast Queenslanders adopting them as a quasi-Brisbane team. Up until this year they only averaged 17k on Melbourne FTA.

The Lions draw higher ratings in a city half the size of Melbourne, despite spending the bulk of the last 15 years at the foot of the ladder. Melbourne are always in the top 4 because they've been handed all sorts of concessions from day one. Then you present your misinterpreted opinion as proof that teams in Perth and Adelaide will draw the same as Melbourne, despite not having the connections with Queensland and on field success that made the Storm popular in Brisbane. It's really bizarre logic and the reason why the ARLC will never do what you say.

We still don't know how much the Storm's support, both in Brisbane and Melbourne, will nosedive when the NRL stop giving them concessions to ensure they're on top. Bris 2 will definitely hurt the Storm. As will Bris 3, which is far closer to getting the nod than you, PR and TGD realise.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

I don't disagree that the Broncos and Storm have had a leg-up in the past stemming from News and the end of the SL war, and it was political. But the more clubs we have around the game that are successful on and off the field like them the better and I think it is critical for RL's standing in the Australian sporting landscape that we have those two flagship clubs to point ot. Imagine the state of the NRL with no Melbourne presence at all. Brisbane you could argue would fall on it's feet because it's a RL city.

I really hope Parra and the Dogs can get their shit together because they should be behemoths of Australian sport... ditto the Dragons. I just want our clubs to reach their potential and I say that as someome that doesn't follow an NRL club at all. I just love the game.

The problem I have with the Broncos and Storm models is its foundations are not rock solid. Their whole business is based around being the sole team in their cities and having a massive off field advantage over every other club to ensure they succeed on field.

Ratings in Brisbane took a hit when the mighty Broncos played like a pub team. Ratings in Melbourne are dreadful and lightyears behind the Lions. We still don't know how much support the Storm will have when they're no longer winning every year. It will dry up in Brisbane when Bris 2 is introduced. Once Bris 3 comes along the Storm will become the Canberra Raiders of RL in Brisbane.

I do think it is concerning that the Lions were getting 30k when they were winning, yet Melbourne only average 16k at Melbourne Rectangular Stadium, despite being the benchmark team for 15 years.

 

[mongoose]

That's your aim, and it makes zero sense.

You prattle on about how vital the Melbourne market is, yet all the sources you've provided have shown their high TV ratings come from southeast Queenslanders adopting them as a quasi-Brisbane team. Up until this year they only averaged 17k on Melbourne FTA.

The Lions draw higher ratings in a city half the size of Melbourne, despite spending the bulk of the last 15 years at the foot of the ladder. Melbourne are always in the top 4 because they've been handed all sorts of concessions from day one. Then you present your misinterpreted opinion as proof that teams in Perth and Adelaide will draw the same as Melbourne, despite not having the connections with Queensland and on field success that made the Storm popular in Brisbane. It's really bizarre logic and the reason why the ARLC will never do what you day.

We still don't know how much the Storm's support, both in Brisbane and Melbourne, will nosedive when the NRL stop giving them concessions to ensure they're on top. Bris 2 will definitely hurt the Storm. As will Bris 3, which is far closer to getting the nod than you, PR and TGD realise.

what does the Storm have to do with me saying Brisbane should have 2 largish teams mostly playing out of suncorp?

 

[mongoose]

The problem I have with the Broncos and Storm models is its foundations are not rock solid. Their whole business is based around being the sole teams in their cities and having a massive off field advantage over every other club to ensure they succeed on field.

Ratings in Brisbane took a hit when the mighty Broncos played like a pub team. Ratings in Melbourne are dreadful and lightyears behind the Lions. We still don't know how much support the Storm will have when they're no longer winning every year. It will dry up in Brisbane when Bris 2 is introduced. Once Bris 3 comes along the Storm will become the Canberra Raiders of RL in Brisbane.

I do think it is concerning that the Lions were getting 30k when they were winning, yet Melbourne only average 16k at Melbourne Rectangular Stadium, despite being the benchmark team for 15 years.

your arguments are so all over the place, it's actually difficult to address them.... you criticize the Broncos and Storm for being 1 city teams (huh, why is that a bad thing?) then you praise the Lions who are a one city team. I don't even know what you are arguing...

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

your arguments are so all over the place, it's actually difficult to address them.... you criticize the Broncos and Storm for being 1 city teams (huh, why is that a bad thing?) then you praise the Lions who are a one city team. I don't even know what you are arguing...

Maybe you should work on your reading skills.

The Lions are a fumbleball club in RL heartland, punching well above their weight despite having an AwFuL club competing with them for fans just an hour drive down the road. The Suns are relevant because the Lions always had a large contingent of fans based on the Gold Coast. When the Suns came in they took about 1/3 of their fans.

The Broncos are an RL club in RL heartland. The Titans are no threat to them as Brisbane RL and Gold Coast RL have always been at each other's throats.

Melbourne Storm are an RL club in a fumbleball city with no other NRL club competing with them for fans. There are twice as many people in Melbourne than Brisbane, but despite this, the Lions draw higher attendances and ratings in Brisbane than the Storm in Melbourne. Storm are well behind, despite having the most successful pro sports team in Australia of the modern era, whereas the Lions have been battling to avoid the spoon between 2005 and 2018. If you cannot see the relevance of this then there's no hope for you and explains why you have such weird beliefs.

I never criticised the Storm for being a one city team. I criticised them for having such a tiny fanbase in a city they hold all to themselves, with 5 times as many supporters in southeast Queensland! The Storm average 150k in Brisbane and 30k in Melbourne on TV. Last year they only got 17k.

If you think it is wise to have just 1 team in RL's second largest city then it's probably best we stop talking, as we will never see eye to eye.

 

[mongoose]

Maybe you should work on your reading skills.

The Lions are a fumbleball club in RL heartland, punching well above their weight despite having an AwFuL club competing with them for fans just an hour drive down the road. The Suns are relevant because the Lions always had a large contingent of fans based on the Gold Coast. When the Suns came in they took about 1/3 of their fans.

The Broncos are an RL club in RL heartland. The Titans are no threat to them as Brisbane RL and Gold Coast RL have always been at each other's throats.

Melbourne Storm are an RL club in a fumbleball city with no other NRL club competing with them for fans. There are twice as many people in Melbourne than Brisbane, but despite this, the Lions draw higher attendances and ratings in Brisbane than the Storm in Melbourne. Storm are well behind, despite having the most successful pro sports team in Australia of the modern era, whereas the Lions have been battling to avoid the spoon between 2005 and 2018. If you cannot see the relevance of this then there's no hope for you and explains why you have such weird beliefs.

I never criticised the Storm for being a one city team. I criticised them for having such a tiny fanbase in a city they hold all to themselves, with 5 times as many supporters in southeast Queensland! The Storm average 150k in Brisbane and 30k in Melbourne on TV. Last year they only got 17k.

If you think it is wise to have just 1 team in RL's second largest city then it's probably best we stop talking, as we will never see eye to eye.

AFL is more popular in brisbane than League is in Melbourne, is that what you are trying to say? you sure you're not an AFL troll?

How is having multiple suburban clubs in Brisbane going to change any of this?

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

what does the Storm have to do with me saying Brisbane should have 2 largish teams mostly playing out of suncorp?

You believe the world's second largest RL city, Brisbane, should be limited to no more than 2 teams can so that the ARLC can waste hundreds of millions of dollars propping up 2 unwanted teams in fumbleball wadtelands.

You still haven't explained why you are deadset against Brisbane's 2.4 million having 3 teams, at roughly 800k each, while Adelaide's 1.3 million have 2 AwFuL clubs, at roughly 650k each.

Let me do the maths for you. Since Brisbane is almost twice as large as Adelaide, it's in a better position to support 3 teams than Adelaide can with 2.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

AFL is more popular in brisbane than League is in Melbourne, is that what you are trying to say? you sure you're not an AFL troll?

How is having multiple suburban clubs in Brisbane going to change any of this?

Fumbleball is more popular in Brisbane and Sydney than RL is in Melbourne.

That's a fact!

No matter which metric you use, it has the wood on us. There's 20,000 registered fumblers in Queensland, most of them in Brisbane, and just 3,000 RL players in Melbourne. TV ratings favour the Lions over the Storm in their respective markets.


How does pointing out these facts make a person an AwFuL troll, FFS?

What are you, the blasphemy police?

If you cannot see how an extra 2 NRL clubs will increase RL's profile in Brisbane then you're incredibly narrow minded. The extra media coverage and money the 3 clubs will attract from advertisers will make life off the field much more difficult for the Lions. There will never be a weekend where Lang Park is empty while the Lions are fumbling a ball around the Gabba and dodging flying Cavendish bananas as they run near the boundary. TV ratings will improve in Brisbane, which means more clout for the ARLC at broadcast negotiations.

 

[mongoose]

Fumbleball is more popular in Brisbane and Sydney than RL is in Melbourne.

That's a fact!

No matter which metric you use, it has the wood on us. There's 20,000 registered fumblers in Queensland, most of them in Brisbane, and just 3,000 RL players in Melbourne. TV ratings favour the Lions over the Storm in their respective markets.


How does pointing out these facts make a person an AwFuL troll, FFS?

What are you, the blasphemy police?

If you cannot see how an extra 2 NRL clubs will increase RL's profile in Brisbane then you're incredibly narrow minded. The extra media coverage and money the 3 clubs will attract from advertisers will make life off the field much more difficult for the Lions. There will never be a weekend where Lang Park is empty while the Lions are fumbling a ball around the Gabba and dodging flying Cavendish bananas as they run near the boundary. TV ratings will improve in Brisbane, which means more clout for the ARLC at broadcast negotiations.

- AFL is popular in Sydney and Brisbane
- League shouldn't bother expanding outside QLD/NSW
- NRL's 2 biggest clubs Broncos and Storm should fold
- Raiders should fold- where GWS is trying to get a foothold

sounds like a fumbleball troll to me...

 

[reanimate]

Sounds like we should be putting extra NRL clubs in Melbourne to boost those Melbourne numbers.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

- AFL is popular in Sydney and Brisbane
- League shouldn't bother expanding outside QLD/NSW
- NRL's 2 biggest clubs Broncos and Storm should fold
- Raiders should fold- where GWS is trying to get a foothold

sounds like a fumbleball troll to me...

Now you're being ridiculous.

I've said on numerous occasions that Adelaide and Perth should be considered as an option for a struggling Sydney club.

How is that not expanding?

Only a simpleton would think that new licences should be wasted on unwanted teams in Adelaide and Perth when it would be far more practical to relocate a struggling team from Sydney that is squeezed out of that market.

The Swans are a relocated AwFuL team from Melbourne. Bears were created from scratch but failed miserably, so AwFuL merged them with a struggling Melbourne club. Suns and Giants are new teams that are failing miserably and there's talk of them being cut.

What sort of person would say we should do the one thing that has failed 3 times in the AwFuL and, ignore the one thing that has worked twice for them?

I never said Raiders should fold, so don't put words in my mouth. I said if "suburban" clubs, as you call them, are to be avoided, then how can you advocate for a small regional city of 420,000 to have a team but deny Brisbane from having a 3rd team, even though the population in Brisbane is so large, 2.4M, that with 3 teams in it, each team's catchment area would have twice as many people than all of Canberra combined?

I've said Canberra should relocate to Perth if it's such a necessity to have a team in Western Australia. You just don't like it because I am using your own reasoning to show that Brisbane 3 is more important than Canberra and to prove you don't care about expansion as much as you claim.

I never said Storm should fold. Stop putting words in my mouth.

You make zero sense and lie through your teeth.

When I pointed out that Brisbane is an RL city that hates fumbleball a few months back you ran in to defend AwFuL and talk about how many inroads it has made.