Redcliffe put their hand up

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Okay, pretend 100% of South Africans and their descendants will never touch a game of RL once on our shores, the immigration from NZ and the Pacific Islands will increase the base we have to work with in Perth in the future.

NRL will make lots of money with Bris2 and 3. Zero money to be made from Perth as Western Australians hate the game.

It would be stupid to add teams in Adelaide and Perth. Neither city will ever be in a position to produce a net gain in players for the NRL, at least not in ratio to how many they take from Brisbane, New Zealand and Sydney. Even if they do produce the odd player or two, they won't improve the value of Origin and Test football. Teams in Brisbane and New Zealand strengthen Origin and Test football as they will draw more kids to the game in those markets.

In summary, Adelaide and Perth offer zero value to the broadcasters and representative football, but will require hundreds of millions of dollars just to stay afloat.

 

[reanimate]

NRL will make lots of money with Bris2 and 3. Zero money to be made from Perth as Western Australians hate the game.

You’re ignoring immigration trends. People from the Pacific Islands and NZ generally see through AFL for the awful sport that it is. Perth has around 2 million people now and will increase by at least another million in the next 20-30 years, that won’t be achieved through births, it will reach that number by immigration.

It would be stupid to add teams in Adelaide and Perth. Neither city will ever be in a position to produce a net gain in players for the NRL, at least not in ratio to how many they take from Brisbane, New Zealand and Sydney. Even if they do produce the odd player or two, they won't improve the value of Origin and Test football. Teams in Brisbane and New Zealand strengthen Origin and Test football as they will draw more kids to the game in those markets.

In summary, Adelaide and Perth offer zero value to the broadcasters and representative football, but will require hundreds of millions of dollars just to stay afloat.

Perth will be a city of over 3 million in the future, that number of people plus a new time zone for broadcasters is very much deserving of at least one team. Brisbane definitely deserves at least 1 more team, probably 2, but Perth (and potentially Adelaide) will pay off in the long term.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

You’re ignoring immigration trends. People from the Pacific Islands and NZ generally see through AFL for the awful sport that it is. Perth has around 2 million people now and will increase by at least another million in the next 20-30 years, that won’t be achieved through births, it will reach that number by immigration.

Perth will be a city of over 3 million in the future, that number of people plus a new time zone for broadcasters is very much deserving of at least one team. Brisbane definitely deserves at least 1 more team, probably 2, but Perth (and potentially Adelaide) will pay off in the long term.

I still reckon that a relocated team would be a better chance of succeeding in Adelaide and Perth.

 

[greenBV4]

I still reckon that a relocated team would be a better chance of succeeding in Adelaide and Perth.

if they fully commited yes - but its unlikely any club would put their hand up for this, they would likely rather go bust than relocate, and the NRL doesnt have the means/balls to push in the right direction

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

I love the double standards from certain posters with regards to Brisbane. They think it is okay for Sydney clubs to average 15k, Storm 12k-16k, Canberra 12k-15k and Perth 8k-14k, but Brisbane Broncos must average 44k!

Thank God these people aren't running the ARLC. They just want to stifle growth in Brisbane because they're worried there won't be any spots or players left for an unwanted team in Perth, which the ARLC has no inclination of ever adding.

 

[Perth Red]

Hang on dckhead you asked why Adelaide with 1.3mill can have 2 AFl teams but Brisbane with 3mill cant have 3. They can have two because the city backs them, massively! If the first AFL club in Adelaide was backed at same level as NRL clubs they would never have got a second same as Perth. Unless Brisbane 2 can be in the top 4 NRL supported clubs we shouldnt even be talking about Brsibane3. Which we shouldnt anyway given its decades away, if ever. Lets see if we get Brisbane2 and if they can be succesful before we worry about what might happen in 30 years time!

Broncos are not even close to the largest sports club in the country, on any metric and how are you measuring influential, beyond being owned by News ltd who also own the NRL chairman? Lets be honest considering they are a one city club, wealth to pss away, amazing stadium in the games absolute heartland Broncos fanbase is pretty avg. and well below the likes of WC Eagles and Adelaide Crows in smaller cities with two clubs to split the fans. If the new club cannibalizes their support in any way then they are going to look even more avg.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

Hang on dckhead you asked why Adelaide with 1.3mill can have 2 AFl teams but Brisbane with 3mill cant have 3. They can have two because the city backs them, massively! If the first AFL club in Adelaide was backed at same level as NRL clubs they would never have got a second same as Perth. Unless Brisbane 2 can be in the top 4 NRL supported clubs we shouldnt even be talking about Brsibane3. Which we shouldnt anyway given its decades away, if ever. Lets see if we get Brisbane2 and if they can be succesful before we worry about what might happen in 30 years time!

Broncos are not even close to the largest sports club in the country, on any metric and how are you measuring influential, beyond being owned by News ltd who also own the NRL chairman? Lets be honest considering they are a one city club, wealth to pss away, amazing stadium in the games absolute heartland Broncos fanbase is pretty avg. and well below the likes of WC Eagles and Adelaide Crows in smaller cities with two clubs to split the fans. If the new club cannibalizes there support in any way then they are going to look even more avg.

Brisbane Broncos are the most watched RL club on TV and draw higher ratings nationwide than the West Coast Eagles, Fremantle Dockers, Adelaide Crows and Port Adelaide Power, so they are backed massively up here you simpleton. The problem is most of their games are played in a timeslot that prevents families from attending and RL is best enjoyed watching on TV.

David Gyngel said when the Broncos play Ch9 make 100 cents on the dollar, whereas for everyone else it is only 40 cents. More teams in Brisbane will mean more content for southeast Queensland, bringing money into the game, both for the ARLC and its broadcasters.

You don't know that Bris 3 is decades away, so stop presenting your biased opinions as facts. Colin Smith listed Bris 2, NZ 2 and Bris 3, in that order, as priorities for expansion and said to forget about Adelaide and Perth. He has worked with the ARLC on previous broadcast deals and is a highly respected figure. Colin Smith's opinion holds more sway at ARLC HQ than some brain-dead soapdodger grom Perth who cannot even speak English, despite being from that country.

What we do know is there will never be a team in Perth, regardless of how much you bitch and moan.

Get ready for Bris 3, as it will come sooner than you realise. We've got 2 powerhouse bids from the greater Brisbane area that make some NRL teams look small. There's a good chance that both bids will get in at some stage. One will cover the southeast part of Brisbane. The other covers the north. Both bids will add more to the NRL than some shit team from Perth that'll be reliant on the ARLC, QRL, NZRL and NSWRL for money and players.

 

[Perth Red]

lol of course they are, bless. Memberships, attendances, revenue, sponsorships. The real metrics that matter to a business, the WC Eagles pss all over Broncos from a great height.

Yeh so valuable to Ch9 that they have done nothing in the last 20 years to push for a second club to be introduced, hmmmm.

Brisbane 2 is years away imo, Brisbane 3 will probably never happen or if it does it wont be for a very very long time. Colin Smith? never heard of the fcker!

Your right abut Perth, not because it wont work but because RL is a small minded sport run by weak leaders. Probably get a third AFL Qlnd club before the NRL grows enough balls to become national.

 

[mongoose]

Hang on dckhead you asked why Adelaide with 1.3mill can have 2 AFl teams but Brisbane with 3mill cant have 3. They can have two because the city backs them, massively! If the first AFL club in Adelaide was backed at same level as NRL clubs they would never have got a second same as Perth. Unless Brisbane 2 can be in the top 4 NRL supported clubs we shouldnt even be talking about Brsibane3. Which we shouldnt anyway given its decades away, if ever. Lets see if we get Brisbane2 and if they can be succesful before we worry about what might happen in 30 years time!

Broncos are not even close to the largest sports club in the country, on any metric and how are you measuring influential, beyond being owned by News ltd who also own the NRL chairman? Lets be honest considering they are a one city club, wealth to pss away, amazing stadium in the games absolute heartland Broncos fanbase is pretty avg. and well below the likes of WC Eagles and Adelaide Crows in smaller cities with two clubs to split the fans. If the new club cannibalizes their support in any way then they are going to look even more avg.

I agree with what you are saying but the Broncos are in a market with an AFL and Rugby Union side, which both have a decent following. Perth is just AFL in winter, other sports may aswell not exist.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

lol of course they are, bless. Memberships, attendances, revenue, sponsorships. The real metrics that matter to a business, the WC Eagles pss all over Broncos from a great height.

Yeh so valuable to Ch9 that they have done nothing in the last 20 years to push for a second club to be introduced, hmmmm.

Brisbane 2 is years away imo, Brisbane 3 will probably never happen or if it does it wont be for a very very long time. Colin Smith? never heard of the fcker!

Your right abut Perth, not because it wont work but because RL is a small minded sport run by weak leaders. Probably get a third AFL Qlnd club before the NRL grows enough balls to become national.

How would you know whether Ch9 have or haven't pushed for a second team within the last 20 years?

For all we know they could have presented their case and News Ltd and the 16 clubs might have voted it down. Contrary to your whinging, Ch9 don't always get their way. The NRL wanted a fixed draw, to Ch9's angst, and got it. Ch9 wanted to keep the Sunday arvo game on delay. They had to televise it live.

The West Coast Eagles all time average is 34,087. Their averages have hovered between 28k and 40k until they moved into that nice ground in 2018. We don't know if they'll continue to pull 55k once the novelty wears off. There have been seasons where the Broncos averaged more than the Eagles. That's despite the fact Broncos have to compete with RU and AwFuL, whereas the Eagles' only real competition has come from the Dockers. In fact, the Eagles averages didn't improve until the Dockers were introduced. They only averaged more than 30k twice before the Dockers were introduced. The competition from 'little brother' has been great for them.

When the Crushers were introduced a combined total of 56,000 attended ARL games at Lang Park and QEII Stadium. It makes a mockery of your claim that more teams in Brisbane will lead to averages of 13k.

https://afltables.com/afl/crowds/westcoast.html

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

WC Eagles vs Brisbane Broncos

1988 - 21,009 vs 16,111
1989 - 18,691 vs 18,217
1990 - 24,448 vs 22,709
1991 - 31,756 vs 19,463
1992 - 27,723 vs 21,687
1993 - 33,675 vs 43,200
1994 - 26,450 vs 37,705
1995 - 32,120 vs 35,902
1996 - 32,448 vs 23,712
1997 - 32,582 vs 19,298
1998 - 34,199 vs 20,073
1999 - 30,868 vs 22,763
2000 - 33,136 vs 21,239
2001 - 32,669 vs 19,710
2002 - 35,929 vs 20,131
2003 - 38,077 vs 24,326
2004 - 39,037 vs 28,667
2005 - 40,267 vs 30,331
2006 - 40,744 vs 31,208
2007 - 40,791 vs 32,868
2008 - 37,653 vs 33,426
2009 - 36,377 vs 34,587
2010 - 34,931 vs 35,032
2011 - 37,436 vs 33,309
2012 - 37,636 vs 33,777
2013 - 36,051 vs 30,480

WC Eagles Premierships
1992, 1994, 2006, 2018

Brisbane Broncos Premierships
1992, 1993, 1997, 1998, 2000, 2006

Broncos were beating Eagles in 93, 94 and 95. Then the Super League War erupted and fans revolted. It's funny how you never mention that little fiasco, which is something the Eagles never had to deal with. It took the Broncos more than a decade to get back to where they were before Super League caused more than 15k of their fans to revolt.

 

[The Great Dane]

WC Eagles vs Brisbane Broncos

1988 - 21,009 vs 16,111
1989 - 18,691 vs 18,217
1990 - 24,448 vs 22,709
1991 - 31,756 vs 19,463
1992 - 27,723 vs 21,687
1993 - 33,675 vs 43,200
1994 - 26,450 vs 37,705
1995 - 32,120 vs 35,902
1996 - 32,448 vs 23,712
1997 - 32,582 vs 19,298
1998 - 34,199 vs 20,073
1999 - 30,868 vs 22,763
2000 - 33,136 vs 21,239
2001 - 32,669 vs 19,710
2002 - 35,929 vs 20,131
2003 - 38,077 vs 24,326
2004 - 39,037 vs 28,667
2005 - 40,267 vs 30,331
2006 - 40,744 vs 31,208
2007 - 40,791 vs 32,868
2008 - 37,653 vs 33,426
2009 - 36,377 vs 34,587
2010 - 34,931 vs 35,032
2011 - 37,436 vs 33,309
2012 - 37,636 vs 33,777
2013 - 36,051 vs 30,480

WC Eagles Premierships
1992, 1994, 2006, 2018

Brisbane Broncos Premierships
1992, 1993, 1997, 1998, 2000, 2006

Broncos were beating Eagles in 93, 94 and 95. Then the Super League War erupted and fans revolted. It's funny how you never mention that little fiasco, which is something the Eagles never had to deal with. It took the Broncos more than a decade to get back to where they were before Super League caused more than 15k of their fans to revolt.

Let me finish those stats for him. Don't want him weaseling out of the facts.

2014 - 34198 vs 33354
2015 - 35987 vs 33595
2016 - 36586 vs 33692
2017 - 36751 vs 31394
2018 - 53250 vs 31234
2019 - 53513 vs 29516

So even if we ignore every other statistic and focus solely on average attendance, the Broncos have only out averaged the WCE 4 times in the last 31 years, and somehow that's a win for the Broncos... Alright...

Let's also keep in mind that the only reason the WCE haven't had an even higher average over the years is because before they moved into Optus stadium they'd been selling out their ticketed memberships at Subiaco Oval and there was a huge waiting list for memberships.
So the idea that their jump in attendance is just the novelty effect of a new stadium is a pretty big stretch considering that thousands of people have been sitting on a waiting list for those tickets for years now.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

You had to add a juvenile anti-PVL comment in your post.

He's not owned by News Ltd. You just don't like it because he told the cold hard truth about RL in Perth. Peter Beattie is applauded by you, just because he said something positive about Perth. It doesn't matter to you that Beattie knows SFA about the game and is regarded as a charlatan by many people in QLD.

It's been explained to you why some RL fans in Brisbane are against the Broncos. You refuse to listen.

 

[Perth Red]

I agree with what you are saying but the Broncos are in a market with an AFL and Rugby Union side, which both have a decent following. Perth is just AFL in winter, other sports may aswell not exist.

The two Perth AFL clubs would have a bigger active following than the three clubs in Brisbane, and in a smaller city.
AFL in Perth: Avg combined Att 94.5k and combined memberships of 152k
Winter sports in Brisbane avg att 71.4k combined membership 73k

 

[Perth Red]

Let me finish those stats for him. Don't want him weaseling out of the facts.

2014 - 34198 vs 33354
2015 - 35987 vs 33595
2016 - 36586 vs 33692
2017 - 36751 vs 31394
2018 - 53250 vs 31234
2019 - 53513 vs 29516

So even if we ignore every other statistic and focus solely on average attendance, the Broncos have only out averaged the WCE 4 times in the last 31 years, and somehow that's a win for the Broncos... Alright...

Let's also keep in mind that the only reason the WCE haven't had an even higher average over the years is because before they moved into Optus stadium they'd been selling out their ticketed memberships at Subiaco Oval and there was a huge waiting list for memberships.
So the idea that their jump in attendance is just the novelty effect of a new stadium is a pretty big stretch considering that thousands of people have been sitting on a waiting list for those tickets for years now.

Haha conveniently fails to mention subiaco oval capacity of 43k limited their crowds until couple of years ago! Eagles have basically sold out every game for nearly 15 years and had a 7 year wait list for a full ticketed membership. They moved from 35k to 60k couple of years ago and still there's a waitlist for a membership! When's last time Broncos came close to an avg sell out of Suncorp?

They've just hit over 100k members this year despiet Covid and have 9,000 people and growing every year sat waiting for a ticketed membership! Broncos are minnows in comparison.

I am amused that we have managed to get someone who hates the Broncos to become their cheerleader though lol!

 

[Perth Red]

ReCh9, last tv deal they massively upped their financial commitment from $100mill to $185mill a year. If they were desperate for another Brisbane team they would have demanded it as part of this massive increase in price they paid. The other 16 clubs would have had no say. There wasn't even a murmur that Ch9 have asked for this in any Tv deal in the last 15 years. What TV wants, TV gets.

 

[T-Boon]

ReCh9, last tv deal they massively upped their financial commitment from $100mill to $185mill a year. If they were desperate for another Brisbane team they would have demanded it as part of this massive increase in price they paid. The other 16 clubs would have had no say. There wasn't even a murmur that Ch9 have asked for this in any Tv deal in the last 15 years. What TV wants, TV gets.

I would imagine that when the Gold Coast were admitted channel nine would have argued for it to be another Brisbane team instead or would have preferred that.

 

[Pippen94]

I would imagine that when the Gold Coast were admitted channel nine would have argued for it to be another Brisbane team instead or would have preferred that.

TV wasn't dying in 2005-06 when announced

 

[Pippen94]

How would you know whether Ch9 have or haven't pushed for a second team within the last 20 years?

For all we know they could have presented their case and News Ltd and the 16 clubs might have voted it down. Contrary to your whinging, Ch9 don't always get their way. The NRL wanted a fixed draw, to Ch9's angst, and got it. Ch9 wanted to keep the Sunday arvo game on delay. They had to televise it live.

The West Coast Eagles all time average is 34,087. Their averages have hovered between 28k and 40k until they moved into that nice ground in 2018. We don't know if they'll continue to pull 55k once the novelty wears off. There have been seasons where the Broncos averaged more than the Eagles. That's despite the fact Broncos have to compete with RU and AwFuL, whereas the Eagles' only real competition has come from the Dockers. In fact, the Eagles averages didn't improve until the Dockers were introduced. They only averaged more than 30k twice before the Dockers were introduced. The competition from 'little brother' has been great for them.

When the Crushers were introduced a combined total of 56,000 attended ARL games at Lang Park and QEII Stadium. It makes a mockery of your claim that more teams in Brisbane will lead to averages of 13k.

https://afltables.com/afl/crowds/westcoast.html

In history of expansion existing teams never see decrease in crowds, members - that is myth because clubs don't want competition without realizing it actually helps

 

[Pippen94]

lol of course they are, bless. Memberships, attendances, revenue, sponsorships. The real metrics that matter to a business, the WC Eagles pss all over Broncos from a great height.

Yeh so valuable to Ch9 that they have done nothing in the last 20 years to push for a second club to be introduced, hmmmm.

Brisbane 2 is years away imo, Brisbane 3 will probably never happen or if it does it wont be for a very very long time. Colin Smith? never heard of the fcker!

Your right abut Perth, not because it wont work but because RL is a small minded sport run by weak leaders. Probably get a third AFL Qlnd club before the NRL grows enough balls to become national.

I think they will push through Brisbane team quick, while Ipswich must be favorite for future expansion after that. Of course NRL has fooled us before!