Round 5 vs Bulldogs

[soc123_au]

I'd go with that assessment.

Though a great coach can turn a plod squad good. Take Bellamy he has turned some plod players elite

Ivan is the plod master. Luke Brooks half back of the year ffs.

 

[Iamback]

Of course it's not. How many coaches have made three grand finals? 53% is only half the story. He coached a Panthers side that was trashed by ME. He coached a Tigers side that was rubbish. He coached the Warriors who were decimated by a salary cap scandal in 2006 and the death of Sonny Fai in 2009. All this context is never discussed and if he hadn't won a premiership then he would be consigned to history's dustbin as average. But he has 3 GF appearances and one win. There are six coaches out of sixteen in the NRL right now, who have won premierships. Average? Nah, by definition that is not average.

I was never a fan, but the last three years have shown that he has something a bit different going on. Not a super coach either, but then again he hasn't finished yet.

The whole picture tells a story.

He currently sits 11th in games coached. Will overtake Jack Gibson this year he isn't even in the same postcode as most of them. Although the worst 2 on the list Brian smith and Ricky both have coached in 4 GF's

He has coached more games than Chris Anderson and Gus who have had more success

 

[Iamback]

Ivan is the plod master. Luke Brooks half back of the year ffs.

Jerome Hughes was let go and NQ and CG.

Now is in the top 3 halves in the game

 

[Black Magik]

Us 32
Them 10

well damn I was close!!

 

[soc123_au]

Jerome Hughes was let go and NQ and CG.

Now is in the top 3 halves in the game

I'm not disputing Martina's ability to squeeze every drop from the lemon. Just that Ivan is pretty handy at polishing turds as well.

 

[The_Frog]

Ivan is the plod master. Luke Brooks half back of the year ffs.

Luke must despair over what has become of his promising career in the game, while counting his $800k a year or whatever ridiculous sum it is.

 

[Pomoz]

The whole picture tells a story.

He currently sits 11th in games coached. Will overtake Jack Gibson this year he isn't even in the same postcode as most of them. Although the worst 2 on the list Brian smith and Ricky both have coached in 4 GF's

He has coached more games than Chris Anderson and Gus who have had more success

But you have just mentioned coaches who were considered legends. I never said he was a legend. I just said he isn't average. Average coaches don't make grand finals with two different teams and build sides that break NRL records for defence.

 

[Iamback]

But you have just mentioned coaches who were considered legends. I never said he was a legend. I just said he isn't average. Average coaches don't make grand finals with two different teams and build sides that break NRL records for defence.

He has coached almost 400 games though. You need to put him with like for like.

Well certainly can't compare him to someone with 100 FG coached

 

[ColdWetPanther]

Gus had the greatest coach in the sports history lined up....

But the guy hasn’t coached a premiership winning team in what, 10 years. That is despite waking into favourable situations much of the time.

 

[ColdWetPanther]

Though a great coach can turn a plod squad good. Take Bellamy he has turned some plod players elite

Your man crush Yeo comes to mind.

 

[Iamback]

Your man crush Yeo comes to mind.

He does do well with Plodder forwards

 

[Smug Panther]

But the guy hasn’t coached a premiership winning team in what, 10 years. That is despite waking into favourable situations much of the time.

No one gave Souths a chance last year, he did great with that squad

 

[ColdWetPanther]

He does do well with Plodder forwards

It’s more than that though; look at our spine;
- Edwards has been maligned all over (including this forum). The whole league is now asking the question ‘is he elite?’ now.
- When Jimmy left (a guy who dominated our side) left many on here wanted Burton over Luai. Luai is now a SOO half.
- Api was a journeyman who was let go by Manly. People love to call him a dual premiership winner; how many games did he actually play for Souths that year?

Point being that if these people were developed through the Storm people would rave about the work done by Bellamy.

To be clear; I am not trying to say Ivan is as good as Bellyache. But it is an easy narrative to put Ivan down and talk Bellamy up.

 

[ColdWetPanther]

No one gave Souths a chance last year, he did great with that squad

What do you mean; they made the PF the year before and were a toe-over-the-line 40/20 from the GF?

 

[DinkyDi]

It’s more than that though; look at our spine;
- Edwards has been maligned all over (including this forum). The whole league is now asking the question ‘is he elite?’ now.
- When Jimmy left (a guy who dominated our side) left many on here wanted Burton over Luai. Luai is now a SOO half.
- Api was a journeyman who was let go by Manly. People love to call him a dual premiership winner; how many games did he actually play for Souths that year?

Point being that if these people were developed through the Storm people would rave about the work done by Bellamy.

To be clear; I am not trying to say Ivan is as good as Bellyache. But it is an easy narrative to put Ivan down and talk Bellamy up.

Unfortunately, Bellyache will also be remembered for salary cap rorting.

 

[Iamback]

It’s more than that though; look at our spine;
- Edwards has been maligned all over (including this forum). The whole league is now asking the question ‘is he elite?’ now.
- When Jimmy left (a guy who dominated our side) left many on here wanted Burton over Luai. Luai is now a SOO half.
- Api was a journeyman who was let go by Manly. People love to call him a dual premiership winner; how many games did he actually play for Souths that year?

Point being that if these people were developed through the Storm people would rave about the work done by Bellamy.

To be clear; I am not trying to say Ivan is as good as Bellyache. But it is an easy narrative to put Ivan down and talk Bellamy up.

Different circumstances.

Take Luai - has always been a half. In 10 years at the club he has played in 7 Grand Finals

That 2015 NYC team won 3 games in a row 72-10

We are reaping the rewards of an amazing crop of juniors

Compare that to Hughes and Cronk. From outside back plodders to elite 7

 

[Kilkenny]

No one gave Souths a chance last year, he did great with that squad

Bennett had plenty to work with at the Bunnies. They were stacked across there top 17.

 

[Pomoz]

He has coached almost 400 games though. You need to put him with like for like.

Well certainly can't compare him to someone with 100 FG coached

How can you compare just based on the number of games? Madge won a premiership at Souths, gets his hands on the Tigers and it's all turned to custard. Your criteria rates him above Ivan, yet in reality , in his hands the Tigers stink like yesterday's prawns.

What about the quality of the teams they coached?

Gibson - Easts, Souths, Parramatta, St George, Newton, Cronulla
Gould - Dogs, Panthers, Easts
Cleary - Warriors, Panthers, Tigers

When Gould got his hand on the Dogs and the 91 Panthers they were already premiership quality. The Dogs team had already won two premierships in 84 and 85. When he got to Easts, Politis had started to bankroll them and they had began buying players and building a dynasty. Not the same as Ivan looking at Chris Armit, Cameron Ciraldo, Travis Burns and Luke Walsh.

Ivan is no super coach, but credit where it's due. He is not average and could be on the verge of creating something very special.

 

[The_Frog]

Api was a journeyman who was let go by Manly. People love to call him a dual premiership winner; how many games did he actually play for Souths that year?

Api played 14 games, 10 at hooker and 4 off the bench. Isaac Luke was the first choice hooker but missed a large chunk of games, presumably injured.

 

[Smug Panther]

Api is our best ever 9 and winning the comp this year will be it undeniable