Rumoured and Confirmed Signings and TheRam's whinging XXVIII

[El Diablo]

The Da Vinci Code.

Yes it would be a fantastic signing as long as it is at the right price after the expected initial 2016 discount rate.

and what is the right price so we know what figure will upset you?

But I also expect Watmough to probably retire after this season, so that could effectively free up upwards of $600k. If Watmough doesn't retire after the 2016 season we will be stuffed on a couple of levels.

so our future depends on whether or not Watmong retires? :crazy:

 

[Obscene Assassin]

Id rather keep morgan the toutau but Morgan's probably on more

Clubs would be more interested in Morgan than they are Toutau...whoever that is.

 

[Bigfella]

It's lucky el d has never whinged about anything so he's an obvious lieutenant of the whinge police

 

[Avenger]

Not surprisingly you missed the joke.

OMC did quite well I thought.

Are you warming to the Jennings signing Colonel?

 

[woddy]

Is there anything really happening with morgs to tits?

 

[Twizzle]

rumour only at this stage

 

[TheRam]

and what is the right price so we know what figure will upset you?



so our future depends on whether or not Watmong retires? :crazy:

Around $500k is about the right price for a proven performer at the height of his prowess.


May very well do, considering the quality players that we have coming into the peak of their careers or needing upgrades from junior level salaries.

But any half arsed League supporter should be able to work that out.

But then again if you're just a massive tosser who want to score points because you just don't like a certain poster who follows him around this forum like a bad hag, then you'll ask such silly questions.

 

[El Diablo]

so you expect him to take a $300k pay cut next year? lol

 

[Avenger]

so you expect him to take a $300k pay cut next year? lol

No. What we will probably do is give him a 3 or 4 year deal. The Roosters chip in for 2016. In 2017 we take on the whole contract and entice him with a longer contract and provide security from 2017 onwards.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Exactly. Older players will take less per year for a longer contract. Young players certainly f**king won't unless they're shit.

 

[lingard]

The Da Vinci Code.

Yes it would be a fantastic signing as long as it is at the right price after the expected initial 2016 discount rate.

But I also expect Watmough to probably retire after this season, so that could effectively free up upwards of $600k. If Watmough doesn't retire after the 2016 season we will be stuffed on a couple of levels.

So if you sign a player to a four year deal and they retire after two years, you just pay them out and it's salary-cap exempt? Is that right? Or do they have to take up some sort of paid position at the club (coaching or whatever)?

 

[Poupou Escobar]

I believe you have to come to an agreed payout and whatever that is counts under the cap.

 

[lingard]

The Da Vinci Code.

Yes it would be a fantastic signing as long as it is at the right price after the expected initial 2016 discount rate.

But I also expect Watmough to probably retire after this season, so that could effectively free up upwards of $600k. If Watmough doesn't retire after the 2016 season we will be stuffed on a couple of levels.

I agree. I think Whatmough was a ridiculous purchase for four years. I really don't think he can play at any decent level for the next three years.
Jennings, I think, is a good buy. We have desperately needed a quality centre for a long time. The centre position is very under-rated IMO.

 

[Bandwagon]

Around $500k is about the right price for a proven performer at the height of his prowess.


May very well do, considering the quality players that we have coming into the peak of their careers or needing upgrades from junior level salaries.

But any half arsed League supporter should be able to work that out.

But then again if you're just a massive tosser who want to score points because you just don't like a certain poster who follows him around this forum like a bad hag, then you'll ask such silly questions.

500k would be good buying for a centre of Jennings quality IMO, and at 27 odd he should have a good couple of years left at the top of his game.

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

So if you sign a player to a four year deal and they retire after two years, you just pay them out and it's salary-cap exempt? Is that right? Or do they have to take up some sort of paid position at the club (coaching or whatever)?

It depends.....on a lot of things. If they simply decide to retire, the pay out is whatever is negotiated. And then, if it's a consequence of injury, then part of that is covered by insurance etc.. A terminal payout accruing to the club would have to judged according to the particular circumsatnces.

In the case of Watmough, I would think that if he chucked it in, and we agreed to give him a well paid post-retirement job there'd be bugger all on our cap. This is part of the point of the longer term deals for old players....it signals a credible commitment that the player won't be sent to the dogs if their knee explodes. The player knows that the club have a strong incentive to offer them a decent post-retirement position (at least for a little while).

 

[lingard]

I believe you have to come to an agreed payout and whatever that is counts under the cap.

So let's say that a bloke like Whatmough signs for $500,000 per season. Let's say we don't back or front-load anything. We've paid him $500, 000 last year and another $500,000 this year. We owe him $1mil.
Now, we obviously aren't going to say, okay, you retire and we'll pay you $1mil and that will come out of our cap next year. So an agreement has to be reached. What if we said, we'll make it $400,000 all up because we aren't getting the benefit of having you play for us anymore? What would be the incentive for Whatmough to retire? Wouldn't he be better off playing reserve grade for two years and collecting a million dollars?

 

[lingard]

It depends.....on a lot of things. If they simply decide to retire, the pay out is whatever is negotiated. And then, if it's a consequence of injury, then part of that is covered by insurance etc.. A terminal payout accruing to the club would have to judged according to the particular circumsatnces.

In the case of Watmough, I would think that if he chucked it in, and we agreed to give him a well paid post-retirement job there'd be bugger all on our cap. This is part of the point of the longer term deals for old players....it signals a credible commitment that the player won't be sent to the dogs if their knee explodes. The player knows that the club have a strong incentive to offer them a decent post-retirement position (at least for a little while).

So if, instead of paying them their pay-out figure, we give them their money as a salary for some coaching position or something - then it's not counted in the cap? Is that right?

 

[strider]

I believe you have to come to an agreed payout and whatever that is counts under the cap.

I don't think it counts under the cap (not that I really know for sure)

If you can convince them to legitimately retire and they don't play at all (ie not some fake retirement) then I don't think any of it is under the cap.

I believe thats why Rusty tried his hardest to convince joe gulavao to retire and go into ministry some years back - would be very good for you joe, ohh and souths cap position

 

[Barry O'Speedwagon]

So if, instead of paying them their pay-out figure, we give them their money as a salary for some coaching position or something - then it's not counted in the cap? Is that right?

Within reason, I think so.

If you pay a fitness coach $500,000 I suspect there'd be a problem. If you paid em $150-$200k, it'd probably go through.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

So let's say that a bloke like Whatmough signs for $500,000 per season. Let's say we don't back or front-load anything. We've paid him $500, 000 last year and another $500,000 this year. We owe him $1mil.
Now, we obviously aren't going to say, okay, you retire and we'll pay you $1mil and that will come out of our cap next year. So an agreement has to be reached. What if we said, we'll make it $400,000 all up because we aren't getting the benefit of having you play for us anymore? What would be the incentive for Whatmough to retire? Wouldn't he be better off playing reserve grade for two years and collecting a million dollars?

Yeah agreed. That's why you get comments from past-it players (e.g. Ben Smith) saying how they would prefer to hang around and help their mates. Even though it would help their mates more if they retired for zero payout, it sounds better than saying "I have zero other employment options, so I'll hang around and milk the final year(s) of my contract for all it's worth."

This is probably where trust between the player and administration comes into it. Do we trust Watmough to retire (and take a reduced payout) when it suits the club? I'd say only if he trusts us to look after him in other ways. Not every player is suitable for a job after he's finished playing.