Rumours and Stuff

[TheRam]

Hasn't hurt DCE hurt Manly though, since he signed that big deal they haven't really been fighting for a title.

They have a decent team. They aren't a development club though and as such need to recruit quality at a higher price. Also they are paying the two Turbo brothers collectively more the 2 million combined. Still they have managed to make semis and play well.

We are a much bigger and better club all round. We should be able to do way better then them and pay our marquee players close to market value and still be competitive and contenders for GF's. Powerful development clubs like us should almost always be contender and at least jag a premiership once or twice each and every decade on average. To do anything less is to under achieve. What the Sea Egles have been doing for the last 2-3 decades is over achieving, because of superior coaching, recruitment and retention and management.

Lets hope we have turned to corner.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

They won premierships.

So they don't want to win any more? If you miss your window are you forced to ruin your cap out of desperation? That happened to us after the Hagan years. It's not worth it.

 

[TheRam]

You're missing Gutherson's leadership value. A strong club isn't just about the total player talent in the group. There is an essential element of leadership that can be impossible to replace. If you've ever worked in good teams and bad teams you would've seen this clearly. Leadership is a real thing, separate from management. People like TheRam, who've never been part of a team or experienced any success in life, fail to understand this.

I know how to take a great arse hole photocopy at the office Xmas party. Named Captain Clown Puller and the drunken office girls love me on the night. They don't know my name for the rest of the year though.

 

[lucablight]

So they don't want to win any more? If you miss your window are you forced to ruin your cap out of desperation? That happened to us after the Hagan years. It's not worth it.

That’s not what I’m saying. I’m saying fans are willing to understand why a premiership winning team has to shed players. They won’t be so forgiving of an early finals exit team. If your team is so good to the point of having to shed players (whilst not buying other superstars) then you should be going deep into the finals and winning premierships.

 

[King-Gutho94]

They have a decent team. They aren't a development club though and as such need to recruit quality at a higher price. Also they are paying the two Turbo brothers collectively more the 2 million combined. Still they have managed to make semis and play well.

We are a much bigger and better club all round. We should be able to do way better then them and pay our marquee players close to market value and still be competitive and contenders for GF's. Powerful development clubs like us should almost always be contender and at least jag a premiership once or twice each and every decade on average. To do anything less is to under achieve. What the Sea Egles have been doing for the last 2-3 decades is over achieving, because of superior coaching, recruitment and retention and management.

Lets hope we have turned to corner.

Its so frustrating Manly have basically won a premiership every decade since the 1970s.

While they train at a dump in narrabeen. Play at a shithole at Brookvale. Have fair weather fans.

And a smaller junior rugby league talent pool yet seem to get the right players into their system.

Manly just have always had winning DNA that Parramatta can never seem to get.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Real Estate….he has a massive portfolio

He obviously has options to make money after rugby league but does that show money is or isn't important to him? How many hundreds of thousands of dollars is he willing to leave on the table in his early thirties? That much money at that age is likely to impact the rest of his life. He would be well aware of this.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

When was the last time either let their primary playmaker go WITHOUT a ready made playmaker who was equal or better to take over?

So it looks like the trick is identifying a cheaper-but-effective replacement, not mortgaging the farm for one merkin.

 

[T-Boon]

This is why I don't think he will squeeze us for every last dollar and be happy to sign for a reasonable amount like last time.

I think we can thank his uncle Benny and his real estate savviness and guidance for that.

People who have a lot of money tend to have the tightest arses so don’t be too sure

 

[T-Boon]

Is Lui really rated that highly? He's either 19 or 20 this year and not even on a full time contract.

T-Boon hasn’t even heard of him.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

What the Sea Egles have been doing for the last 2-3 decades is over achieving, because of superior coaching, recruitment and retention and management.

Doesn't this mean they are/were a bigger club than us? If they could hire these people while we can't?

 

[hindy111]

I agree that Moses is just much harder to replace.

I don't agree that Gutherson is "very replaceable".

And stop shooting the messenger, ffs!

A lot can happen in 3yrs. And I a, happy for a poor season to rebuild and watch that happen.
3yrs ago we didn't have D.Brown or Mahoney. Do people not feel we won't produce another top shelf hooker or half in the next 3 or 4 seasons? Or fullback? I feel like our juniors have started to get much better in recent times and am confident by 2025 we will have produced a whole new spine capable of NRL. Wether it is with us or elsewhere.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

That’s not what I’m saying. I’m saying fans are willing to understand why a premiership winning team has to shed players. They won’t be so forgiving of an early finals exit team. If your team is so good to the point of having to shed players (whilst not buying other superstars) then you should be going deep into the finals and winning premierships.

It's possible to just be unlucky. It's also possible to be your best while not being quite as good as a couple of better-resourced clubs. What if we're a 20% chance of winning the comp this year? Are we failures if we don't win? It means we're an 80% chance of not winning, so hardly a failure if it doesn't happen.

Obviously you'd like to be a 20% chance (or better) of winning the comp every year but it doesn't seem possible for most clubs. Do you mortgage the future to get another year of being a solid chance (about 1 in 5, IMO) and then follow it with four or five years of almost zero chance (maybe 1 in 50)? If your 20% chance works out and you win the comp (like the 2016 Sharks) then yes, the fans will accept just making up the numbers in the following years.

But if you don't win (which is more likely even when your premiership chance is 20%) the recruitment/retention decisions won't have been any different than if you'd won. But idiot fans won't see it. Because they think there is no luck involved, even if they're punters and should know better.

 

[hindy111]

I bet if there is speculation to the effect that we wouldn't get into a bidding war for Moses it is probably based on thinking within the club (pushed by BA) that Jake Arthur is a legit talent and so we dont need to worry at that position.
Jake Arthur is not a legit talent. It is way more likely that he is just a product of nepotism than that he has anything up his sleeve that we haven't seen from him yet. He is way off the pace.

JA will go back to NSW cup and he will be watched. If his forms terrible he will drop behind the pecking order. Maybe the kid from under 20s will step up and over take him. Maybe JA will drop back down to jersey flegg also. Very silly to write him off as a 19yld with 5 games and a body that hasn't even developed enough tomplay NSW CUP. The poor merkin would be intimidated when you have 125kgs forwards running at you.
Let him settle. Give him 2yrs in NSW cup and at 21 maybe see if he is an NRL player.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Its so frustrating Manly have basically won a premiership every decade since the 1970s.

While they train at a dump in narrabeen. Play at a shithole at Brookvale. Have fair weather fans.

And a smaller junior rugby league talent pool yet seem to get the right players into their system.

Manly just have always had winning DNA that Parramatta can never seem to get.

They haven't won in 11 years. They're like us in 1997.

 

[hindy111]

I wasn’t aware of that. If he keeps up this vein of form then there’s very little chance he takes up the player option. He will have a lot of clubs after him.

Except he is a mummy's boy and how far can he be away from his muma? I think he needs to be close.

900k is a decent amount. I'm sure we would bump up another 100k. Yeah I can see another club maybe going 1.1 but that would start to be the end of it. And weak clubs.

He already turned down an extra 100k to remain in Sydney when Brisbane come knocking. The fact he has been on over 750k since he was about 20 also helps. By the time his next contract is coming he would of made 7-8 million already from NRL. You need to look at that figure. He would then face the possibility of another 4 mill at the eels a club he loves and doesn't have to move from or 4.7 mill to play in a new environment.

Meaning 12 mill vs 12.7 mill over his career. 700k is a lot more to people like us who battle then guys getting 1 mill a year and own multiple properties.

4yrs is a long time to be unhappy also for a few extra quid.

 

[hindy111]

No he's awesome. Easily our most important player, at least on the field. He would be very hard to replace, which is why we might pay overs to keep him. He will get offers of $1.2M+ from the likes of the Dragons. Maybe even the Tigers. How much less would he take to stay at Parra? The answer is we'll never know, but if the club looks like it's prioritising cap space over keeping every single off contract first grader, Moses could be a big part of why.

He already took 100k less to stay. I reckon they'd need to offer atleast 150k more. A lot would depend on his current finanicals.

He may of bought a few properties 5 or 6 yrs ago when he was already in huge dollars. Those would of double in value already.
There is a chance he has real estate worth over 5 mill since the boom or more. If he owned his own home had a 2 mill investment property paid off also then money isn't going to be as big a driving factor

 

[Oscarman]

Farts might change the game, but not for the better, I wouldn't think.

If Junior fell on the ball the whole stadium would stink.

 

[hindy111]

Jake is filling a hole in the roster, that’s all.

What he does have over both Moses and Brown but I reckon is awesome vision and game awareness. I noticed many times when he has seen a guy out of position and rolled the ball in. His execution needs work.
I also think he looks to have a more calm head in the Cleary mould.

Just seems to lack athletic ability. That would be his down fall.

 

[JokerEel]

They have a decent team. They aren't a development club though and as such need to recruit quality at a higher price. Also they are paying the two Turbo brothers collectively more the 2 million combined. Still they have managed to make semis and play well.

We are a much bigger and better club all round. We should be able to do way better then them and pay our marquee players close to market value and still be competitive and contenders for GF's. Powerful development clubs like us should almost always be contender and at least jag a premiership once or twice each and every decade on average. To do anything less is to under achieve. What the Sea Egles have been doing for the last 2-3 decades is over achieving, because of superior coaching, recruitment and retention and management.

Lets hope we have turned to corner.

How many times have they made the semis and played well since 2013..

 

[hindy111]

You're missing Gutherson's leadership value. A strong club isn't just about the total player talent in the group. There is an essential element of leadership that can be impossible to replace. If you've ever worked in good teams and bad teams you would've seen this clearly. Leadership is a real thing, separate from management. People like TheRam, who've never been part of a team or experienced any success in life, fail to understand this.

How do you know the Ram has had no success in life?