Stalled and stagnant Sydney clubs

[Iamback]

Ahh, but Newcastle has a fraction of the population of Perth, and Perth offers the NRL a new timezone, something Newcastle wouldn't give AFL.

Your comparison is ridiculously desperate & flawed.

The timezone is about all a Perth bid has. NZ 2 should be team 18.

 

[Get Rid of The Donkeys]

One bonus of a Perth based team is it allows the NRL to screen a match live into Perth, China, Singapore, Philippines and Indonesia at 7.30pm GMT+8. Getting that fortnightly match screened into these countries, which all share the same time zone, could open up money for the West Coast Pirates and NRL.

 

[siv]

Was that written in 1976? No one cares where little Johnny played his U10's cup. Whose taking 16/17 year old and turning them into NRL players, thats all that matters from an NRL competition point of view.
Getting more little Johnnys playing RL is the ARLC and state bodies jobs. Turning the best teenage Johnny into a NRL player is the NRL clubs job.
Even Penrith no longer fund any Jnr RL beyond their own elite age pathways programs in their region.

Doesnt change the definition of a junior

Bringing somone into your system from outside of your district doesnt make them a junior, they are a poached player unless they were a unwanted junior looking for a opportunity

What you are focusing on is already covered in the salary cap

- Long serving player allowance

A development allowance should only ever apply to players who started as juniors

 

[Iamback]

One bonus of a Perth based team is it allows the NRL to screen a match live into Perth, China, Singapore, Philippines and Indonesia at 7.30pm GMT+8. Getting that fortnightly match screened into these countries, which all share the same time zone, could open up money for the West Coast Pirates and NRL.

Rather open up to the pacific and that pool of untapped players that NZ 2 would bring

 

[flippikat]

The timezone is about all a Perth bid has. NZ 2 should be team 18.

You shouldn't shrug off a factor like that - it offers a lot more programming flexibility for TV.

Besides, the timezone is NOT the only thing WA has going for it - it has a stronger local league than Melbourne (who have a team), and a bigger population in one city than anything NZ or the Pacific can offer.

If the NRL even gets a fraction of that population engaged in the new team (and there's plenty of ex-pat Kiwis & East Coasters there), it'll be well worth it.

Your anti-Perth bias is clear to see.

 

[Wb1234]

You shouldn't shrug off a factor like that - it offers a lot more programming flexibility for TV.

Besides, the timezone is NOT the only thing WA has going for it - it has a stronger local league than Melbourne (who have a team), and a bigger population in one city than anything NZ or the Pacific can offer.

If the NRL even gets a fraction of that population engaged in the new team (and there's plenty of ex-pat Kiwis & East Coasters there), it'll be well worth it.

Your anti-Perth bias is clear to see.

So because they have more juniors than the storm that’s a positive for them ?

the nrl doesn’t want another Melbourne storm type club, especially one that will need probably a hundred million on top of the grant to work

im sure the nrl are looking for clubs with a high roi
and Perth doesn’t have a bigger population than png. Last time I checked that’s in the pacific

the reality is the nrl doesn’t need a club in Perth. It’s just a dot in map excercise. It’s why they weren’t even considered this time and have next to no chance next time either

 

[Iamback]

You shouldn't shrug off a factor like that - it offers a lot more programming flexibility for TV.

Besides, the timezone is NOT the only thing WA has going for it - it has a stronger local league than Melbourne (who have a team), and a bigger population in one city than anything NZ or the Pacific can offer.

If the NRL even gets a fraction of that population engaged in the new team (and there's plenty of ex-pat Kiwis & East Coasters there), it'll be well worth it.

Your anti-Perth bias is clear to see.

I have no anti Perth bias at all.

NZ solves the 6pm Friday problem. Not sure a game starting at 9.30pm finishing at around midnight would rate that well

How much do you reckon a NZ Derby would draw?

There is already a want of Rugby codes over there. Sponsors like ANZ, Westpac etc that are involved in kiwi sport but not. It opens up to the Pacific nations and improves the International game

If Redcliffe are struggling for players. Even less would want to move across the country. NZ has plenty of players that come to Aust for games. Another NZ team opens up 36 more spots for these locally

Melbourne use the QLD and NSW 2nd tier comps for their junior development.
20 teams seems like a good number and will include Perth but they need to get the pathways in place 1st and is a 5-10 year thing.

Lets say they have a QLD Cup team along with the junior sides to go with that. that is something to assist the player development issue and get locals ready to hopefully take the next step to make the player issue not so great in 2030 or whenever the next round of expansion is

 

[Colk]

So because they have more juniors than the storm that’s a positive for them ?

the nrl doesn’t want another Melbourne storm type club, especially one that will need probably a hundred million on top of the grant to work

im sure the nrl are looking for clubs with a high roi
and Perth doesn’t have a bigger population than png. Last time I checked that’s in the pacific

the reality is the nrl doesn’t need a club in Perth. It’s just a dot in map excercise. It’s why they weren’t even considered this time and have next to no chance next time either

You really have no idea about economics if you are comparing PNG to Perth or even pushing the idea of Pacific expansion. One is the wealthiest part of Australia and the other is a third world country. The former has no commercial value at all because advertisers can’t sell anything to them and people (or not many of them) can consume the product - afford to go to games, buy merchandise etc.

I’ll rephrase Flippikat’s statement that you can understand - Perth has the largest single population in Australia/NZ/Pacific without a side that is first world. There are also a lot of businesses from Western Australia that could see the opportunity to sell products to the East Coast. Therefore, besides the TV time slot, the advertising potential is quite significant. This is why Perth will be considered - money.

This doesn’t mean they will be picked. I still think NZ 2 would be the favourite due to the access of player development but it shouldn’t be discounted particularly if investors from the West want to pump money into it.

 

[Perth Red]

I like how the suburbanites have turned the conversation from stalled Sydney clubs to the value of Perth lol. Top work guys.

You can have the wealthiest state in the country with a city of 2.2million a reasonable grass roots footprint, a ready fanbase of 20k active fans and millionaires waiting to back a club. Or a NZ club in a city of 300k where at this point there is no money behind them and where the only existing NZ club is a basketcase on the field Hmmm. Tough choices.

 

[Wb1234]

You really have no idea about economics if you are comparing PNG to Perth or even pushing the idea of Pacific expansion. One is the wealthiest part of Australia and the other is a third world country. The former has no commercial value at all because advertisers can’t sell anything to them and people (or not many of them) can consume the product - afford to go to games, buy merchandise etc.

I’ll rephrase Flippikat’s statement that you can understand - Perth has the largest single population in Australia/NZ/Pacific without a side that is first world. There are also a lot of businesses from Western Australia that could see the opportunity to sell products to the East Coast. Therefore, besides the TV time slot, the advertising potential is quite significant. This is why Perth will be considered - money.

This doesn’t mean they will be picked. I still think NZ 2 would be the favourite due to the access of player development but it shouldn’t be discounted particularly if investors from the West want to pump money into it.

Buddy let’s no questions each other’s credentials bc it will make you look silly

You really have no idea about economics if you are comparing PNG to Perth or even pushing the idea of Pacific expansion. One is the wealthiest part of Australia and the other is a third world country. The former has no commercial value at all because advertisers can’t sell anything to them and people (or not many of them) can consume the product - afford to go to games, buy merchandise etc.

I’ll rephrase Flippikat’s statement that you can understand - Perth has the largest single population in Australia/NZ/Pacific without a side that is first world. There are also a lot of businesses from Western Australia that could see the opportunity to sell products to the East Coast. Therefore, besides the TV time slot, the advertising potential is quite significant. This is why Perth will be considered - money.

This doesn’t mean they will be picked. I still think NZ 2 would be the favourite due to the access of player development but it shouldn’t be discounted particularly if investors from the West want to pump money into it.

I’m going to dumb this down for you

Perth maybe rich but it’s afl territory. It’s not like nrl can capture more than a small slice of the market there just like they have in Melbourne

as the storm have shown, the club won’t add much in the way of new tv viewers or growing tv audiences. In terms of adding new juniors it’s won’t be much either.

it’s literally just a pin in a map. And someone has to pay 100 million for that pin to srurvive and it won’t be the arlc.

like I said the team will have a terrible roi

rather than copying afl and putting teams into place that aren’t wanted the arlc should look at place where they can expand too that will actually grow the sport meaningfully

 

[Iamback]

I like how the suburbanites have turned the conversation from stalled Sydney clubs to the value of Perth lol. Top work guys.

You can have the wealthiest state in the country with a city of 2.2million a reasonable grass roots footprint, a ready fanbase of 20k active fans and millionaires waiting to back a club. Or a NZ club in a city of 300k where at this point there is no money behind them and where the only existing NZ club is a basketcase on the field Hmmm. Tough choices.

Where do the 2nd tier guys at Perth play?

 

[Perth Red]

Where do the 2nd tier guys at Perth play?

Currently in NSW and Qlnd cup teams. Think there's about 20 that have graduated from SG Ball into clubs in those comps.

 

[Iamback]

Currently in NSW and Qlnd cup teams. Think there's about 20 that have graduated from SG Ball into clubs in those comps.

There lies the issue.

No 18 year old is going to move over to Perth only to fly 4 hours each way to Sydney or Brisbane to play games.

They need to get those pathways in place now. for next round of expansion

 

[Perth Red]

Buddy let’s no questions each other’s credentials bc it will make you look silly

I’m going to dumb this down for you

Perth maybe rich but it’s afl territory. It’s not like nrl can capture more than a small slice of the market there just like they have in Melbourne

as the storm have shown, the club won’t add much in the way of new tv viewers or growing tv audiences. In terms of adding new juniors it’s won’t be much either.

it’s literally just a pin in a map. And someone has to pay 100 million for that pin to srurvive and it won’t be the arlc.

like I said the team will have a terrible roi

rather than copying afl and putting teams into place that aren’t wanted the arlc should look at place where they can expand too that will actually grow the sport meaningfully

haha yeh it would be terrible if Perth ended up another Storm! Most successful club on the field in the modern era, top five supported clubs in attendance and membership, top three most watched club on TV, playing in a state of art stadium, prodiucing some of the all time great players of the game, making a profit. God forbid Perth should end up like them lol

 

[Perth Red]

There lies the issue.

No 18 year old is going to move over to Perth only to fly 4 hours each way to Sydney or Brisbane to play games.

They need to get those pathways in place now. for next round of expansion

but they do. We already had kids moving to Perth from East coast and NZ for a shot at the SG Ball side. When you say get those pathways what do you mean? We have elite Jnr programs in place. We wont get a NSW or Qlnd cup team until we are sure there will be an NRL club as its too expensive and NRL wont invest in it.

There's some easy short term fixes that would help not end up with another Dolphins scenario (who despite having all you are asking Perth for are still building a first team squad by signing from other clubs) but it will take the NRL to shift its thinking.

 

[Iamback]

but they do. We already had kids moving to Perth from East coast and NZ for a shot at the SG Ball side. When you say get those pathways what do you mean? We have elite Jnr programs in place. We wont get a NSW or Qlnd cup team until we are sure there will be an NRL club as its too expensive and NRL wont invest in it.

There's some easy short term fixes that would help not end up with another Dolphins scenario (who despite having all you are asking Perth for are still building a first team squad by signing from other clubs) but it will take the NRL to shift its thinking.

Melbourne are from a Non League state

Have u19's, u21's sides in NSW
Have Sunshine Coast and Easts in QLD. With that flows down to their u19's and 17's teams.

Plenty of places to put their 2nd tier guys as well as to farm the elite Victorian guys too.

Should be a bare minimum to get a side in. Mounties in NSW Cup aren't aligned to anyone. Capras in QLD Cup aren't aligned to anyone. A feeder arrangement with those sides could work short term

 

[siv]

We already had kids moving to Perth from East coast and NZ for a shot at the SG Ball side

But Perth, Adelaide or Darwin dont have SG Ball teams

 

[Menaiduck]

I like how the suburbanites have turned the conversation from stalled Sydney clubs to the value of Perth lol. Top work guys.

You can have the wealthiest state in the country with a city of 2.2million a reasonable grass roots footprint, a ready fanbase of 20k active fans and millionaires waiting to back a club. Or a NZ club in a city of 300k where at this point there is no money behind them and where the only existing NZ club is a basketcase on the field Hmmm. Tough choices.

Billionaires not millionaires. Agree with the rest. WA is on the verge of massive developments as is North Queensland. These are the the places you want a club. Perth is easily the best next market imho.

 

[Wb1234]

I like how the suburbanites have turned the conversation from stalled Sydney clubs to the value of Perth lol. Top work guys.

You can have the wealthiest state in the country with a city of 2.2million a reasonable grass roots footprint, a ready fanbase of 20k active fans and millionaires waiting to back a club. Or a NZ club in a city of 300k where at this point there is no money behind them and where the only existing NZ club is a basketcase on the field Hmmm. Tough choices.

You make it sound like it’s a hard ch

haha yeh it would be terrible if Perth ended up another Storm! Most successful club on the field in the modern era, top five supported clubs in attendance and membership, top three most watched club on TV, playing in a state of art stadium, prodiucing some of the all time great players of the game, making a profit. God forbid Perth should end up like them lol

There’s a reason Perth are so far down the pecking order for new clubs to be admitted.

that’s the difference between league and afl. League has so many good places it can go to that will grow the game

At the bottom of that list is Perth

 

[Perth Red]

Melbourne are from a Non League state

Have u19's, u21's sides in NSW
Have Sunshine Coast and Easts in QLD. With that flows down to their u19's and 17's teams.

Plenty of places to put their 2nd tier guys as well as to farm the elite Victorian guys too.

Should be a bare minimum to get a side in. Mounties in NSW Cup aren't aligned to anyone. Capras in QLD Cup aren't aligned to anyone. A feeder arrangement with those sides could work short term

I have no doubts we would end up with same model with WA fielding Pirates teams in HM, SG and NSW cup as well as a partnership agreement with a Qlnd cup side or another NSW cup side. Below that we already have 26 WA clubs fielding Jnr sides and elite academies and Jnr rep sides playing each other.

Interestingly when the Reds joined in they went the other way and brought over dozens of young players to play in the WARL comp with the notion that they could strengthen the local comp to the level needed to be the feeder for the ARL team.