State of Aussie RU

[Polynesian Warrior]

I agree with all the post above but why dont we wait and see how Perth and Cheeters go before we go off the rails ?
If there wasnt a big market for rugby players in UK, Ireland , France, Italy and France then I sure the talents will all be there for all SANZAR countries .

Taipan the grassroots in Australian rugby is alot better than it was ten years ago . Its the next level where theres no directions .

 

[playdaball]

Campese was on Murray Deakers show last week saying that Aust. does not have the depth to handle another side. He also complained that club rugby was suffering in Sydney especially his Randwick side, as players miss out on club rugby going straight into S12. He made the comment that RU will have to poach from RL due to the fact that the traditional breeding ground of club rugby has gone.

 

[Garts]

Campo was a great player but he is also a great big tool.

He is the man who blasted Rogers for making comments about how bad club rugby is then he does the same :roll:

It is the best thing for Australian Rugby in the long run, I can not wait to see a home grown WA player play for the Wallabies. Wont be in the near future though!!!

 

[taipan]

PW>agree that rugby union has increased its grassroots base,but there is still a long way to go before they get the junior playing numbers needed to provide a continual flow of talent to the 4 S14 Oz sides.
Garts .We all agree about Campese whose comments sometimes are a hamburger short of a bun,but he knows the club scene and he knows talent generally.
There is nothing wrong with expansion in fact its a coup for rugby union,however
if a team gets constantly thrashed(and Perth may not)then the fans go walking mlook at what is happening with the Reds.
The big problem for rugby union is that while international tests are the tops and they are increasing the number of them,then you have the S12 now s14.Trying to add a national club comp with the local club comp and expect to retain interest which at club level is few is a big ask IMO.

 

[Polynesian Warrior]

With 164,000 rugby players in OZ I can't believe thats not enough to supply four S14 teams .



ARU report record growth
April 28, 2005

THE Australian Rugby Union (ARU) enters the second decade of professionalism of the code on the up today after reporting a year of record growth.

Figures tabled at the ARU's annual general meeting showed player numbers, Super 12 crowds, Tri-Nations television audiences, funding allocations and interest in the game in 2004 all at record levels.

After distributing $8.4 million to state and member unions around the country, the national body recorded an operating surplus of $1.8 million over the 12 months.

ARU managing director and chief executive Gary Flowers said the performance represented another exciting chapter in rugby's success story since the game went professional in 1995.

"We are in very good shape for the challenges ahead," Flowers said today.

"Not only has rugby seized the opportunities provided by hosting the Rugby World Cup in 2003, we have laid the foundations for future growth.

"There is no reason why this momentum cannot continue."

Highlights for the year included: player numbers at 164,000; six million viewers for Tri-Nations matches; and cumulative Super 12 crowds up 22 per cent on 2003.

The ARU have also pointed to a bright future through a new five-year broadcast deal with News Corp for the expanded Super 14 and Tri Nations, the establishment of the Western Force and a new Collective Bargaining Agreement with its players.

The AGM heard $18 million had been allocated for grassroots development from the RWC surplus while $20 million had been set aside for a capital management strategy.

"As those participation numbers continue to grow, the ARU must keep pace with the resources required to accommodate a game that just keeps getting bigger," Flowers said.

He paid tribute to outgoing chairman Bob Tuckey and president Peter Crittle who finished their terms today.

 

[taipan]

You can have all the money in the world as you have stated in the past and its no guarantee of player quality,it sure helps with development.
With player numbers at 164,000 as quoted,the Reds season has been ordinary ,and the Brumbies 4 losses in a row (allowing for injuries) indicates there still is not the depth.The Waratahs have been the success story,but they had to rely in part on purchasing Lote and Rogers for their success,without them I dont know where the Tahs would be placed.
The ARU figures are impressive,then again the other codes continue to show huge increases in TV ratings and junior growth-its across the board in all the major codes.

 

[Polynesian Warrior]

You talk about grassroots etc . Then I show you the ARU playing numbers and you talk about the best S12 team in OZ or even SANZAR (Brumbies) and the No 1 rank team in the S12 (Waratahs) at the moment.

 

[taipan]

Read what I said I am saying regardless of the playing numbers,the Reds have either gone backwards and still at the tail end,the Brumbies have gone backwards.Only the Waratahs have gone forward despite the growth in numbers at grassroots.Its all related- increase in playing numbers,yet only 1 Oz team has gone forward.It cant be any clearer than that. #-o
Am fully aware of the playing numbers,it has been advised before in the newspapers,after the 2004 registrations. Good on em.

 

[bayrep]

The Brumbies have been a very good team for the last 10 years as the old gaurd start leaving the young ones come in which means that the team will take time to rebuild it happens to all teams no matter how good the grassroots are. AKL Blues are a classic example dominated through the 90's now struggling to put a competitive team on the park. Raiders are another dominated in the late 80's to early 90's then went through a down patch, Liverpool Soccer again dominated through the 80's and are still struggling.

The Reds are just stuffed they really need to ditch the current managment or review their current structures becuase they arent working and again it will not matter how good the grass roots are they will always be on the losing end of the table.

The Tahs have under achieved for the last 10 years have always had great players but never put it together ont he field team of stars.

All this from a person looking from the out side in of course

 

[rugged]

Read what I said I am saying regardless of the playing numbers,the Reds have either gone backwards and still at the tail end,the Brumbies have gone backwards.Only the Waratahs have gone forward despite the growth in numbers at grassroots.Its all related- increase in playing numbers,yet only 1 Oz team has gone forward.It cant be any clearer than that. #-o
Am fully aware of the playing numbers,it has been advised before in the newspapers,after the 2004 registrations. Good on em.

Mmm, so should they try to decrease the number of players in Australia?

Also, Taipan, should the NRL not bother with expension because the Rabbitohs and some other teams are doing consistently poorly?

 

[taipan]

Read what I said I am saying regardless of the playing numbers,the Reds have either gone backwards and still at the tail end,the Brumbies have gone backwards.Only the Waratahs have gone forward despite the growth in numbers at grassroots.Its all related- increase in playing numbers,yet only 1 Oz team has gone forward.It cant be any clearer than that. #-o
Am fully aware of the playing numbers,it has been advised before in the newspapers,after the 2004 registrations. Good on em.

Mmm, so should they try to decrease the number of players in Australia?

Also, Taipan, should the NRL not bother with expension because the Rabbitohs and some other teams are doing consistently poorly?

A pathetic comment Rugged inferring a reduction in player numbers,as an alternative.
Hmm :roll: the expansion of the NRL in 1995 was proof positive that whilst expansion is great for the area involved,there are too many easy beat teams as the quality players are stretched too far.That is why the bleeding Super league war started in the 1st place.Even now the NRL is not rushing into expansion mainly the money aspect,however there has been a large increase not only in the numbers of quality players but competitive teams,as a result of careful development over many years.
The development system of young league players has been acknowledged as being excellent by none other than the Qld ru development manager.You should note union has only been officially pro for less than 10 years things dont happen overnight.
If you read South's CEO Shane Richardson's comments in todays telegraph,he is worried that if the Gold Coast get in there will be an inflationary jump in the salaries of ordinary players(stretching the quality perhaps.
Dont get me wrong eventually all codes should have teams in every mainland states city,otherwise you cant really call yourself national.
To expand for expansions sake,and by doing so weaken another club or clubs is a quick fix.Ask the Gold Coast chargers when they first came in were they a success ?,they now have a huge junior base,with high quality development programmes and are in better knick to form a new club.

 

[rugged]

Read what I said I am saying regardless of the playing numbers,the Reds have either gone backwards and still at the tail end,the Brumbies have gone backwards.Only the Waratahs have gone forward despite the growth in numbers at grassroots.Its all related- increase in playing numbers,yet only 1 Oz team has gone forward.It cant be any clearer than that.

You are expecting the increase in the playing numbers to have an immediate effect on the top tier??? #-o

 

[taipan]

Read what I said I am saying regardless of the playing numbers,the Reds have either gone backwards and still at the tail end,the Brumbies have gone backwards.Only the Waratahs have gone forward despite the growth in numbers at grassroots.Its all related- increase in playing numbers,yet only 1 Oz team has gone forward.It cant be any clearer than that.

You are expecting the increase in the playing numbers to have an immediate effect on the top tier??? #-o

No ,thats the point of my argument in it takes time in developing players.You can have 300,000 players,but if they are not developed skillwise it means nothing.However whilst you have a better chance with larger numbers,still it hasnt helped the Reds or the Brumbies and the Waratahs have relied on 2 class league players.- to get the real impact,and they are thinking of Anasta a current league player due to the lack of class 10s.If they havent got sufficient quality 10s in 3 teams with increased playing numbers,will they manufacture one for the 4th team.

 

[Polynesian Warrior]

Two league players ? I think I saw 15 rugby players playing for the Tahs in the last couple of games .
It was the only first two games that Rogers and Tuqiri play above the rest . Signing league players is a risk but it also has its ups and downs .

 

[Iafeta]

With 164,000 rugby players in OZ I can't believe thats not enough to supply four S14 teams .



ARU report record growth
April 28, 2005

THE Australian Rugby Union (ARU) enters the second decade of professionalism of the code on the up today after reporting a year of record growth.

Figures tabled at the ARU's annual general meeting showed player numbers, Super 12 crowds, Tri-Nations television audiences, funding allocations and interest in the game in 2004 all at record levels.

After distributing $8.4 million to state and member unions around the country, the national body recorded an operating surplus of $1.8 million over the 12 months.

ARU managing director and chief executive Gary Flowers said the performance represented another exciting chapter in rugby's success story since the game went professional in 1995.

"We are in very good shape for the challenges ahead," Flowers said today.

"Not only has rugby seized the opportunities provided by hosting the Rugby World Cup in 2003, we have laid the foundations for future growth.

"There is no reason why this momentum cannot continue."

Highlights for the year included: player numbers at 164,000; six million viewers for Tri-Nations matches; and cumulative Super 12 crowds up 22 per cent on 2003.

The ARU have also pointed to a bright future through a new five-year broadcast deal with News Corp for the expanded Super 14 and Tri Nations, the establishment of the Western Force and a new Collective Bargaining Agreement with its players.

The AGM heard $18 million had been allocated for grassroots development from the RWC surplus while $20 million had been set aside for a capital management strategy.

"As those participation numbers continue to grow, the ARU must keep pace with the resources required to accommodate a game that just keeps getting bigger," Flowers said.

He paid tribute to outgoing chairman Bob Tuckey and president Peter Crittle who finished their terms today.

I'd be interested to see those players numbers contrasted with New Zealand, and even more so, South Africa.

 

[Iafeta]

Read what I said I am saying regardless of the playing numbers,the Reds have either gone backwards and still at the tail end,the Brumbies have gone backwards.Only the Waratahs have gone forward despite the growth in numbers at grassroots.Its all related- increase in playing numbers,yet only 1 Oz team has gone forward.It cant be any clearer than that. #-o
Am fully aware of the playing numbers,it has been advised before in the newspapers,after the 2004 registrations. Good on em.

Mmm, so should they try to decrease the number of players in Australia?

Also, Taipan, should the NRL not bother with expension because the Rabbitohs and some other teams are doing consistently poorly?

In regards to the NRL, the 14 Australian rugby league sides would be all amongst the top 20 rugby league sides in the world.

The top 3 rugby union sides in Australia would struggle to all be in the top 20 rugby union sides of the world. I believe some of the NPC second division sides could defeat the Queensland Reds, they have the worst scrum I've ever seen and an incapability to get the ball to their highest (and most overpaid) player in Wendall Sailor. Their whole structure is a joke.

So it shows the NRL is a strong entity as opposed to its overseas counterparts, whereas the same cannot be said of the 3 Australian super 12 sides as a whole over the history of the Super 12 as opposed to the rest of the provincial/club sides around the globe.

How does not putting another unjustified super 12 team in decrease numbers? You play because you want to play, there's no reason why the WARU couldn't have a club rugby competition over there without the Force's involvement.

 

[rugged]

So it shows the NRL is a strong entity as opposed to its overseas counterparts, whereas the same cannot be said of the 3 Australian super 12 sides as a whole over the history of the Super 12 as opposed to the rest of the provincial/club sides around the globe.

Now you are showing up league's weakness - total domination of Australia at international level.

 

[taipan]

So it shows the NRL is a strong entity as opposed to its overseas counterparts, whereas the same cannot be said of the 3 Australian super 12 sides as a whole over the history of the Super 12 as opposed to the rest of the provincial/club sides around the globe.

Now you are showing up league's weakness - total domination of Australia at international level.

A weakness maybe,then again 40,000 turned up to watch the so called weakness friday week plus great TV ratings in Brisbane and Sydney.Americans dominated basketball for decades,when the teams travelled they still drew crowds to see the best.They turned up in their thousands for the league ashes in 2003 and tri series 2004 in the UK.
No one is pretending that rugby league has a strong international competition,its getting there at least.

 

[taipan]

Two league players ? I think I saw 15 rugby players playing for the Tahs in the last couple of games .
It was the only first two games that Rogers and Tuqiri play above the rest . Signing league players is a risk but it also has its ups and downs .

mate Lote has been the dominant player in the Tahs this year,and Rogers when he is not out injured is not far behind,the remaining players dont bring the crowd to their feet like these 2.

 

[Te Kaha]

Two league players ? I think I saw 15 rugby players playing for the Tahs in the last couple of games .
It was the only first two games that Rogers and Tuqiri play above the rest . Signing league players is a risk but it also has its ups and downs .

mate Lote has been the dominant player in the Tahs this year,and Rogers when he is not out injured is not far behind,the remaining players dont bring the crowd to their feet like these 2.

Not even close. Lote hasn't outplayed ANY New Zealand winger this year. The best player for the tahs against the NZ sides has been Peter Hewat. Evan last night against the Highlanders he didn't show anything special.