Sydney relocations

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

Im sure Im not the only one thinking merger between Canberra and Penrith. A new 24,000 all seater in Goulburn with games against out of state teams in Bargo.

The Hume Highway Cool Vikings Who Ride Cats

...But with horns!!!

 

[BuffaloRules]

THought this was an interesting set of figures from the Wookie about how much money the AFL put into their teams, including the small Melbourne ones with you would assume limited futures like Western Bulldogs and Melbourne...

Like I said before, they obviously feel the need to keep 9 teams dominating all opposition in their biggest market...

 

[flippikat]

Interesting that this thread has popped back up.

I was just thinking the other day about the NSW Cup arrangement between the Wyong Roos and Sydney Roosters.

Could the reason for ditching Newtown possibly be the Roosters hedging their bets against further rationalisation of Sydney clubs?

If the Bears expansion bid is overlooked in favour of Brisbane2 & Perth, could The Roosters eventually move (partially or fully) to the Central Coast instead?

Remember, in the early 1980s Newtown were hoping to move to Campbelltown to secure their future - only to go broke first. Then Wests went ahead and made the move. Could we see history repeat?

 

[TheFrog]

The Central Coast won't work if it's another side uprooted and plonked there. It was tried before with the Northern Eagles, remember. And Campbelltown can't be called a riproaring success whatever entity has tried to make a base there. With the troubles the Titans seem to be having I think we are going to see the NRL hastening very slowly indeed over the coming years.

 

[Perth Red]

THought this was an interesting set of figures from the Wookie about how much money the AFL put into their teams, including the small Melbourne ones with you would assume limited futures like Western Bulldogs and Melbourne...

Like I said before, they obviously feel the need to keep 9 teams dominating all opposition in their biggest market...

The afl are very fortunate that the successful clubs don't kick up a stink about subsidising the crap teams. I can tell you now if those clubs refused to support the ticket tax and the unequal grant distribution the afl would very much be looking at its unviable clubs. They were stupid not to relocate two of the melbourne clubs to GWS and GC instead of creating new ones. Only reason I can think of was the extra value of nine games over eight.

 

[Perth Red]

The Central Coast won't work if it's another side uprooted and plonked there. It was tried before with the Northern Eagles, remember. And Campbelltown can't be called a riproaring success whatever entity has tried to make a base there. With the troubles the Titans seem to be having I think we are going to see the NRL hastening very slowly indeed over the coming years.

The northern eagles were well received on the CC in the first season. The In fighting and negative relationship cost them. 2000 season they averaged over 15k on the CC making them them the 4th most watched team based on the CC attendances. Same year they drew less than 10k for games at Manly. 2001 they still had bigger crowds at Gosford than at manly. When the partnership fell apart manly should have dropped out of NRL and the license given to a new board to run the northern eagles permanent Gosford based.

 

[Hello, I'm The Doctor]

The northern eagles were well received on the CC in the first season. The In fighting and negative relationship cost them. 2000 season they averaged over 15k on the CC making them them the 4th most watched team based on the CC attendances. Same year they drew less than 10k for games at Manly. 2001 they still had bigger crowds at Gosford than at manly. When the partnership fell apart manly should have dropped out of NRL and the license given to a new board to run the northern eagles permanent Gosford based.

Sidenote: i still with the merge had been called "the Northern Silvertails"...

 

[flippikat]

The northern eagles were well received on the CC in the first season. The In fighting and negative relationship cost them. 2000 season they averaged over 15k on the CC making them them the 4th most watched team based on the CC attendances. Same year they drew less than 10k for games at Manly. 2001 they still had bigger crowds at Gosford than at manly. When the partnership fell apart manly should have dropped out of NRL and the license given to a new board to run the northern eagles permanent Gosford based.

15k crowd averages for a first season that wasn't exactly stellar is pretty damn good.

The question is whether people in Gosford supported the Northern Eagles specifically because Norths were a partner in the joint venture, or whether they were just happy to have top-flight footy in their town.

If it's the latter, then there's a chance that ANY team could win-over the area *IF* they do the hard yards to prove they want it.

Given that the Bears have been the preferred brand for the Coast's NRL aspirations, it's likely to be hard work for another club to win the community over.. but is it impossible? Maybe not, just that it'll take a lot of work.

 

[BuffaloRules]

The afl are very fortunate that the successful clubs don't kick up a stink about subsidising the crap teams. I can tell you now if those clubs refused to support the ticket tax and the unequal grant distribution the afl would very much be looking at its unviable clubs. They were stupid not to relocate two of the melbourne clubs to GWS and GC instead of creating new ones. Only reason I can think of was the extra value of nine games over eight.

The only reason?

I can think of a few others..

What about respecting the traditions of keeping 100 + yr old clubs in the competition?

What about avoiding the amatuer look of clubs going broke and having to relocate in the biggest sporting competition in Australia?

What about not pissing off fans of the two clubs by moving their team thousands of kms away?

What about keeping up the media and social domination by supporting 9 teams in your heartland and ensuring no other code can get a look in?

 

[papabear]

The only reason?

I can think of a few others..

What about respecting the traditions of keeping 100 + yr old clubs in the competition?

What about avoiding the amatuer look of clubs going broke and having to relocate in the biggest sporting competition in Australia?

What about not pissing off fans of the two clubs by moving their team thousands of kms away?

What about keeping up the media and social domination by supporting 9 teams in your heartland and ensuring no other code can get a look in?

Other codes have a look in already.

Easts fans will still go for easts if they are based out of the CC or Brisbane. Just watch em on tv like normal pants.

 

[BuffaloRules]

Other codes have a look in already.

Easts fans will still go for easts if they are based out of the CC or Brisbane. Just watch em on tv like normal pants.

So why dont the AFL move all their loser clubs out of Melbourne?

 

[flippikat]

The AFL already moved the Swans and merged/moved the Lions. Those clubs seem to have had some success after that. I think a major factor preventing any more AFL relocations is that there aren't that many markets that the AFL can expand to right now - they have pretty good coverage, and they'll want to "bed down" some success for the Giants and Suns before taking on new locations. The NRL on the other hand doesn't even have decent representation of it's heartland - having only one team from Brisbane and one team from New Zealand is crazy -it's seriously selling the game short. There's plenty of scope for relocation if that option is explored.

 

[BuffaloRules]

I agree that the AFL don't have as many options to expand to as the NRL, but as mentioned they have just added another two teams over the last couple of years.

They could have moved out two of the smaller Melbourne teams to accommodate these two new teams, but instead they continue to pump in many millions a year to keep them afloat, in addition to the tens of millions a year they spend on the Giants & Suns.

My point is that they wouldn't be peeing away these millions if there wasn't a benefit, and I think the main drivers are to keep their stranglehold on Melbourne, and they want to avoid the negative look of upsetting thousands of people when their hundred year old club folds/ moves.

They obviously think its better to spend the millions a year to keep everyone happy.

 

[elbusto]

I agree that the AFL don't have as many options to expand to as the NRL, but as mentioned they have just added another two teams over the last couple of years.

They could have moved out two of the smaller Melbourne teams to accommodate these two new teams, but instead they continue to pump in many millions a year to keep them afloat, in addition to the tens of millions a year they spend on the Giants & Suns.

My point is that they wouldn't be peeing away these millions if there wasn't a benefit, and I think the main drivers are to keep their stranglehold on Melbourne, and they want to avoid the negative look of upsetting thousands of people when their hundred year old club folds/ moves.

They obviously think its better to spend the millions a year to keep everyone happy.

What the AFL is doing, very successfully, is putting Clubs in our market and shrinking our share.

In response we are doing nothing but fighting in our own backyard - a sure recipe for failure.

 

[BuffaloRules]

What the AFL is doing, very successfully, is putting Clubs in our market and shrinking our share.

In response we are doing nothing but fighting in our own backyard - a sure recipe for failure.

True, and that needs to change. I don't think the AFL should be getting any further leg ups in Sydney though via more NRL mergers and/or relocations.

To be fair to the NRL though, they never had the money to compete with the AFL until the last TV deal.

For that we can blame Gallop and News Ltd.

 

[elbusto]

True, and that needs to change. I don't think the AFL should be getting any further leg ups in Sydney though via more NRL mergers and/or relocations.

To be fair to the NRL though, they never had the money to compete with the AFL until the last TV deal.

For that we can blame Gallop and News Ltd.

Totally agree about mergers and relocations - we need to expand. But the longer it takes us to take them on in their own back yard the more they will steal our spots like the Gold Coast.

 

[Lockyer4President!]

Totally agree about mergers and relocations - we need to expand. But the longer it takes us to take them on in their own back yard the more they will steal our spots like the Gold Coast.

Expand before we have a plan 100% mapped out and we'll just repeat mistakes we've made in the past and mistakes they and the A-League and S15 have made aswell.

A couple of more years isn't going to make a difference in the grand sceme of things, no matter what the News Ltd press say. ;-)

 

[elbusto]

Expand before we have a plan 100% mapped out and we'll just repeat mistakes we've made in the past and mistakes they and the A-League and S15 have made aswell.

A couple of more years isn't going to make a difference in the grand sceme of things, no matter what the News Ltd press say. ;-)

Not interested in what News Limited has to say. I am just pointing out the obvious. We are getting our asses smacked at the moment. AFL is growing in our markets quickly. We are crawling in theirs.

I live in one of the 'Affiliated States'. I can assure you our effort in these markets is pathetic.

 

[BuffaloRules]

Don't agree AFL is "growing quickly" in QLD and NSW.

The Swans were more popular 10 years ago.

GWS and the Lions are basket cases.

Gold Coast are improved but the AFL has to put their best player there.

It's a big price to pay for I think limited potential on the GC.

 

[Lockyer4President!]

Not interested in what News Limited has to say. I am just pointing out the obvious. We are getting our asses smacked at the moment. AFL is growing in our markets quickly. We are crawling in theirs.

I live in one of the 'Affiliated States'. I can assure you our effort in these markets is pathetic.

That you think AFL is popular or even growing in QLD tells me you're reading the wrong kind of news.