Todd Greenberg has pretty much said one Sydney team will be relocated.

[The Great Dane]

I think we differ on what our definition of 'relocation' is. In its simplest form, at least to me, it means taking an existing team, keeping everything that makes them identifiable, retaining their history,and giving them a different home. I'm not saying this is right, but that's my thoughts when somebody says relocation.

I mean you can keep working on that definition if you want, I mean it's obviously completely wrong lol, but you do you.

I do have a question though, if e.g. the Houston Oilers relocating to Nashville and re-branding to the Tennessee Titans isn't a relocation what exactly is it?

I understand that others may take the alternative view that a team's identity and relocation don't have to be in lockstep with each other. However, I think if this happens, it is more likely to be perceived as the end of one team, and the birth of something new.

Firstly, taking the perception of the old fans out of the equation, why would that necessarily be a bad thing?

Secondly, that doesn't necessarily need to be the case. There's absolutely no reason why a team couldn't relocate and re-brand for the new market, but maintain the old identity in the old market for their local club and juniors system, as well as fielding a lower tier 'reserves' team in the NSW Cup (or whatever) in the old market under the old brand.
I can't think of any example where that has happened off the top of my head, I know plenty of relocated clubs have maintained a team in old the location, but I can't think of any that have re-branded and maintained a team under the old brand, but that's probably happened somewhere and even if it hasn't there's no reason why it couldn't be done.

By the way, I want to make it clear that outside of extreme circumstances I don't support relocation's (at least in the Australian context), they're dumb because people (more often than not including the people trying to implement them) don't really understand how and why relocation works when they are successful, so you end up with the clubs trying to do really dumb things that outside of very specific circumstances never work, like trying to get one team to maintain two markets, then fans get frustrated and it either ends in tears or at least not achieving the initial intentions set out by the club for the relocation.

It works well in America, but that is because the yanks understand that it's a brutal business decision, made by and for the business in the interest of the money involved, and that at the end of the day the old fans don't really come into that decision at all. But everywhere else where we put more emotional significance in the fan-base supporting the team they are at best a sketchy prospect, at worst commercial suicide, especially in extremely tribal and competitive markets like Australia, where with the exception of the Swans I can't think of a single successful relocation, and even then the Swans have completely failed in their initial goal of maintaining both the South Melbourne and Sydney markets (in fact they didn't start to become really successful until they gave up on that goal), so in that regard it is still a failure, and they required a shit ton of help from the AFL to pull it off (they basically had the comp rigged in their favour for years).

So yeah, I don't actually support relocation as such, it's just if the NRL is going to go down that route I would hope they know what they are getting themselves into and what is and isn't achievable with relocation.

 

[Perth Red]

The interesting thing hooper said, which made no sense, is the nrl are considering offering half the value of a ninth game to any team willing to move, ever if a team moves there wouldn’t be a ninth game sell!

 

[Noisy Parker]

Yeah....he was right though. How awkward for you.

Not at all.

 

[axl rose]

with the exception of the Swans I can't think of a single successful relocation, and even then the Swans have completely failed in their initial goal of maintaining both the South Melbourne and Sydney markets (in fact they didn't start to become really successful until they gave up on that goal), so in that regard it is still a failure, and they required a shit ton of help from the AFL to pull it off (they basically had the comp rigged in their favour for years).

Completely rigged. No question about it, they were getting 2 million dollar salary cap exemptions for 'living costs' as well as anyone they wanted in the draft. They were a spectacular failure for 15 odd years as well. Super League gave them a free shot in the arm. Id argue they are still a failure in many ways. All of their playing squad could walk around Sydney and never be recognized. Brisbane Lions are even more of a complete failure and still bleeding money every year.

 

[taipan]

Who knows, a non answerable question at this time. Brian Cumins has been pumping money into WA rugby league for over twenty years so I don’t think you can question his commitment. Laurie Puddy is willing to back a club and tony sage has shown interest in co owning a club. Until Greenberg sits down with them and makes an offer it’s hard to say which of these multi millionaires will be serious potential owners.
Estimated based an attendances over last few years, how could it be confirmed with no expansion lol?
How can they commit when there is nothing to commit to?
Nrl pays all clubs travel costs. $2.5million In 2018 in fact.
Don’t know, how does a storm v warriors game rate in Sydney?

Like I’ve said I believe this talk of relocation is a massive smoke and mirrors from Greenberg to try and get the clubs to sign license agreement. It will be 18 teams or no expansion.

But who are the big companies willing to back long term? Rio? BHP? Bank West?

Titans ATM have crowd averages and have so in the past bigger than memberships.Doesn't always equate.
You can commit over the years paying X minus ,hqwever committing 10 times X is a huge jump.
So estimating memberships surely on a public survey would be a better indicator.
How much more would a Perth club cost in addition?Air travel ain't cheap.to that side of the country.
Probably better than a Perth v Warriors would.

 

[franklin2323]

Plan is to enter a Pirates side in nsw Cup in 2020 or 2021

As for juniors, from little acorns:


Rugby league participation in Western Australia increased by 16.7 per cent in 2018. There was positive growth across all age groups with an 11.6 per cent growth in male rates and a
43.1 per cent increase in registered female participation.
NRL Western Australia worked tirelessly throughout the year to arrest the recent decline in male participation in particular, with increases across all
age groups. The highlight was a 59.5 per cent growth in females 19 years and over.
The second annual Harmony Cup was held in Port Kennedy with 43 men’s and women’s teams taking part in the event. The event coincided with the first-ever NRL Voice Against Violence program delivered in Western Australia.
The new Perth Stadium hosted the NRL Round One double-header in front of a crowd of 38,824. The stadium will host the second Origin match in 2019

https://www.nrl.com/siteassets/documents/nrl-gen19_6501-2018-annual-report-hr.pdf

Yet the Pirates get smashed almost every game in SG Ball. So still got work to do

Everything you say for Perth was the same for GC. They were good for the 1st few year but lack of 2nd tier development stopped them.

I am sure if say NRL was to say in 2023 you are in. It would be ready but if a club was to fall over and to take over would be a fail

 

[franklin2323]

But who are the big companies willing to back long term? Rio? BHP? Bank West?

Titans ATM have crowd averages and have so in the past bigger than memberships.Doesn't always equate.
You can commit over the years paying X minus ,hqwever committing 10 times X is a huge jump.
So estimating memberships surely on a public survey would be a better indicator.
How much more would a Perth club cost in addition?Air travel ain't cheap.to that side of the country.
Probably better than a Perth v Warriors would.

That is the sort of stuff that is overlooked. GC are the worst team in the comp if were to do a 'criteria'.

NQ up into 10 years ago were rubbish.

Warriors still underachieve.

Storm despite their success struggle off the field. Victorian's aren't stepping up to the NRL.

 

[taipan]

I would like to see what TV stations would give an indicative idea of what a Perth team would bring and a B2 one with 16 teams and with 18 teams.Bearing in mind Sydney is the biggest commercial market.

 

[morley101]

Would the people of Brisbane follow a relocated team ? The West Brisbane ( tigers,sharks or eagles etc).

 

[Walter sobchak]

Ottawa will be the 2nd Canadian franchise to join the English league structure at probably league 1 level. Any chance of a North American franchise from say the west coast joining the NRL??

 

[Timbo]

Would the people of Brisbane follow a relocated team ? The West Brisbane ( tigers,sharks or eagles etc).

I think Brisbane's likely to get an expansion franchise - be it Redcliffe or a new entity - for this reason alone.

Relocation to me seems to be the best bet for places who are little chance of getting their own team via expansion (Central Coast, Adelaide, Wellington, Sunny Coast).

Brisbane 2 and Perth expansion teams, and two Sydney teams re-located to spread the footprint.

As an additional carrot - guarantee the first two Sydney teams that move 5-6 games a season at the SFS, ANZ and BankWest and allow them to sell 'Sydney Memberships' which are ticketed for these games. You could also allow them to do an 11/1 split, with 11 games in their new home, and one 'Old Boys' day where they come back to Sydney and play at one of the main stadiums, wear a throwback jersey and are once again ticketed for their Sydney fanbase.

 

[mongoose]

Would the people of Brisbane follow a relocated team ? The West Brisbane ( tigers,sharks or eagles etc).

everyone has an opinion but who really knows for sure.

If a team did relocate I think it would be a gradual process.

Take Manly for example

Year 1&2 - 3 or 4 games in Brisbane, 9 - 8 in Sydney
Year 3&4 - Half games in Brisbane, half in sydney
Year5&6 - 8 or 9 in Brisbane, 3-4 games in Sydney (maybe keep this going for several years before eventually moving all games to Brisbane.

 

[Perth Red]

But who are the big companies willing to back long term? Rio? BHP? Bank West?

Titans ATM have crowd averages and have so in the past bigger than memberships.Doesn't always equate.
You can commit over the years paying X minus ,hqwever committing 10 times X is a huge jump.
So estimating memberships surely on a public survey would be a better indicator.
How much more would a Perth club cost in addition?Air travel ain't cheap.to that side of the country.
Probably better than a Perth v Warriors would.

Probably? Lol whose speculating now.
Not privy to the corporate interest but have heard numerous times over the years that sponsorship won’t be an issue. Fan base? well we’ve seen some great turn outs for oneRL one offs so we know the fans are there. It will be up to the new club to turn those fans into pirates, or whatever name ends up being,regular attending fans and members.
Travel? I’d estimate it will cost nrl about $250-300k a year. Big sports like netball, baseball, water polo, second tier union, ice hockey etc etc manages it so I’m sure the nrl will be ok lol

Reality is until the nrl set a commitment to expansion and either invite bids or work with preferred locations its all speculation.

 

[Perth Red]

Yet the Pirates get smashed almost every game in SG Ball. So still got work to do

Everything you say for Perth was the same for GC. They were good for the 1st few year but lack of 2nd tier development stopped them.

I am sure if say NRL was to say in 2023 you are in. It would be ready but if a club was to fall over and to take over would be a fail

There wont be any expansion until 2022/23.
No one is falling over, there is a bail out fund and clubs are now getting $5mill a year extra grant. You’d have to be very incompetent not to be able to make ends meet now.

 

[Perth Red]

I would like to see what TV stations would give an indicative idea of what a Perth team would bring and a B2 one with 16 teams and with 18 teams.Bearing in mind Sydney is the biggest commercial market.

Well tv paid $52mill a year extra for the in demand suns and giants so you be the judge lol

Not to mention that’s not how it works, the ninth game will feature a variety of clubs over the course of the season. The different time slot Perth offers plus opening up Australia’s 4th biggest city (and possibly to be third in years to come) to sponsors etc is where the nrl see the value. Brisbane 2 is a no brainer. Games featuring a Q’land v nsw team rate best generally.

 

[Perth Red]

Ottawa will be the 2nd Canadian franchise to join the English league structure at probably league 1 level. Any chance of a North American franchise from say the west coast joining the NRL??

New York will be joining soon after taking Over Hemel Hempstead license this week.

 

[Perth Red]

The story Kent “broke” on nrl360
https://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nr...e/news-story/5496817855eab310fa6973d8c8941adb

 

[franklin2323]

There wont be any expansion until 2022/23.
No one is falling over, there is a bail out fund and clubs are now getting $5mill a year extra grant. You’d have to be very incompetent not to be able to make ends meet now.

I am fine with new teams provided they get plenty of notice

 

[Miller was a legend]

There wont be any expansion until 2022/23.
No one is falling over, there is a bail out fund and clubs are now getting $5mill a year extra grant. You’d have to be very incompetent not to be able to make ends meet now.

Agree PR.

If Perth can be brought in with B2 and the extra game generate additional $50m as an example, then the NRL can fund them.

As everyone has raised, is there sufficient talent across the game for two more teams? I personally believe that it will take time but we can develop extra clubs and players

 

[TheFrog]

Imagine, if you will, the NRL offers the Penn family x million dollars (whatever it takes) to move their NRL franchise to the Brisbane area. It doesn't have to be the Sea Eagles, they can call it whatever they want (Moreton Bay Dolphins perhaps). Meanwhile, the Roosters, ever the vultures, slink in and take over the northern beaches/central coast.

Would they accept the offer? I think I would.