2nd Test: Australia v Pakistan at Melbourne on Dec 26-30, 2016

[Tommy Smith]

Let me start by saying I rate Moeen. I lived in Worcester for six months and count myself a Rapids fan. But there is a serious issue with Moeen which was highlighted in a recent cricinfo article which is basically this - Moeen ads zero to the English cricket team. Literally zero. Because he's picked not just as a batsman, but also the front line spinner. All runs he scored on the India tour were cancelled out by his lack of wickets and the runs he leaked.

There are better options in the top five with the bat, and his bowling is getting actively worse. He is at best adding zero on the balance.

I don't disagree.

I certainly don't think he should
be anywhere near the team in Australia where he'll struggle to take a wicket and his batting won't be nearly as productive as it was in India.

 

[Sphagnum]

Australia really don't seem to be going in for the kill. Can't really understand why.

 

[Pete Cash]

Is anything ever Nathan Lyon's fault. He bowled a turd of an over oh but he lost rhythm.

The merkin is the most experienced player in the team. He should be the bloke who holds his nerve

 

[Sphagnum]

I don't disagree.

I certainly don't think he should
be anywhere near the team in Australia where he'll struggle to take a wicket and his batting won't be nearly as productive as it was in India.

He doesn't like short stuff either.

 

[Timbo]

I don't disagree.

I certainly don't think he should
be anywhere near the team in Australia where he'll struggle to take a wicket and his batting won't be nearly as productive as it was in India.

I would not be surprised if you played four quicks + Stokes and Moeen as your attack here.

When you consider one of the quicks will almost certainly be (deservingly) Woakes, who has a first class batting average of 40, England's recent obsession with all-rounders is getting a bit weird.

 

[Bazal]

Ive said numerous times previously that Smith has no confidence, and with good reason.
And if the captain wont bowl him, we need to get another spinner.

But he has just taken 3 for 20 odd, gift wickets or not...
If he was ever going to show some positivity for Lyon after tea was the time.

I don't necessarily disagree, I'd have used Lyon myself and I'd probably ha e had a quick two over crack with a part timer to try and play on the fact that both Sarfraz and Amir would be itching.to get after them. But I can understand why Smith didn't, purely based on what Lyon has given him since he became captain compared to Starc and Haze.

He doesn't get the opportunity to because he doesn't bowl him enough. He got 3 wickets in 10 overs before tea so when play resumes he decides the best option is to go with someone else.

If Smith doesn't think he can win them the match they shouldn't pick him and go with someone else. Otherwise give him he opportunity to bowl at the right time

If Smith was a selector he might.I don't know. Maybe he's just not very good at using spinners either. We don't really have a huge captaincy career to go on tbh.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Haha, you're the one who seriously believes KTF said McGill always took more wickets that Warne and I said O'Keefe had never played Test cricket. And you want to talk about understanding the English language? Hah! You seriously think a bloke playing three tests over two years has been given a great chance in the side and should be an established star or he isn't good enough, and you wanna criticise syntax. Give me a break, haha

You remind me of Razor, except he was at least unintentionally funny

Syntax? That's not syntax moron. f**k me. Nothing like being schooled on the English language by a merkin who can't f**king use it.

You said he has NEVER had the chance. By any definition he f**king has, most recently in Sri Lanka a few months ago. And, as I said, the bloke you say isn't good enough took MORE wickets than him. Thus he has not "proved" he is "better". Pedantry doesn't make me right. Reality does.

 

[umina panther]

Almost getting to Smith/Warner time

 

[mave]

Gaz has got this !!

 

[Bazal]

Syntax? That's not syntax moron. f**k me. Nothing like being schooled on the English language by a merkin who can't f**king use it.

You said he has NEVER had the chance. By any definition he f**king has, most recently in Sri Lanka a few months ago. And, as I said, the bloke you say isn't good enough took MORE wickets than him. Thus he has not "proved" he is "better". Pedantry doesn't make me right. Reality does.

Neither has he proved he isn't better, you mangled aardvark...he hasn't ever had the chance to do either!

You clearly feel you year ten accredited English package qualifies you as some kind of authority despite not knowing what words mean and not understanding anything about context, so I'll give you a pass on that.

But you're the one saying players need to somehow prove they're better than Lyon to get a go, but they can't do it at FC level and they have to do it immediately upon getting a single game in the Test side...so if you want to talk about stupidity maybe you should think about the things you've been spewing out

 

[Bazal]

Almost getting to Smith/Warner time

I'd have done it earlier tbh. These two like to score, so play on that

 

[Pete Cash]

I think smith bowled Starc for 2 overs too long but I'd have opened up with Starc over Lyon for a few reasons.

The pitch isn't getting less flat so with the ball reversing a bit I feel Smith should try and get his frontline bowlers a crack with the ball doing something.

However starc bowled poorly and should have been taken out the attack. I think boof and Smith thought give haze and starc a crack for X amount of overs.

Where smith and a lot of captains go wrong is going against what the gameplan is when it's not working. Starc wasn't working by over 3 of his spell time to try something else.

 

[Tommy Smith]

I would not be surprised if you played four quicks + Stokes and Moeen as your attack here.

When you consider one of the quicks will almost certainly be (deservingly) Woakes, who has a first class batting average of 40, England's recent obsession with all-rounders is getting a bit weird.

It's very New Zealand like.

Moeen is a bit part player, which is a no-no in Tests.

I'd like to see us play Stokes + 4 pace bowlers and no Ali.

Mediocre spinners coming to Australia universally get thrashed. Even the good ones do sometimes so I wouldn't complain if we just used Root to roll his arm over and that's it for spin.

 

[East Coast Tiger]

Neither has he proved he isn't better, you mangled aardvark...he hasn't ever had the chance to do either!

You clearly feel you year ten accredited English package qualifies you as some kind of authority despite not knowing what words mean and not understanding anything about context, so I'll give you a pass on that.

But you're the one saying players need to somehow prove they're better than Lyon to get a go, but they can't do it at FC level and they have to do it immediately upon getting a single game in the Test side...so if you want to talk about stupidity maybe you should think about the things you've been spewing out

Hahahaha. This from the big noting merkin who tried to be a smart arse with a word like "syntax" and used it in the wrong "context". You couldn't make up the level of genius in that. Here's another word for you to look up, hypocrisy.

You are the one advocating a bloke gets dropped. It's simple logic that you can't do that without a better replacement. And your man has not only not proven to be better, in the one recent chance he had to do so in the same game, in the same conditions and against the same batting lineup, he actually performed worse than the bloke you say isn't good enough.

Not only that, but compare how Lyon has gone compared to the Paki spinner who is supposed to be brilliant.

 

[Bazal]

Harvey Birdman strikes!

 

[_snafu_]

Bird is the word.

 

[Twizzle]

geez the Bird is in some decent form, he really is our third best seamer for mine

makes you wonder why he was dropped for Mennie

 

[Sphagnum]

Pretty good over that

 

[Bazal]

You are the one advocating a bloke gets dropped. It's simple logic that you can't do that without a better replacement. And your man has not only not proven to be better, in the one recent chance he had to do so in the same game, in the same conditions and against the same batting lineup, he actually performed worse than the bloke you say isn't good enough.

Not only that, but compare how Lyon has gone compared to the Paki spinner who is supposed to be brilliant.

You're the one saying that SOK has to somehow prove he's better without ever being able to do that by your brain-dead system of "proof". Us normal folk are simply saying he deserves a genuine chance because Lyon has been very poor for some time now. Its ok if that's too complicated for you

 

[Bazal]

Moving on from bashing my head against a wall, time to get Starc back now and see if he's gotten his radar back on.....he's the bloke who can clean up a tail seriously fast