4 Nations Final - Australia vs England

[Rastus_in_Melbourne]

30 odd years

England v Australia = NO SERIES WINS

Exactly.

The English can fist themselves as much as they like, but if they were any match for the Aussies then in the last 30+ years they should have won at least one series at home.

Superleague quality doesn't even rival Queensland Cup. And the International results for 30 long years back this up.

 

[Boganater]

No, wrong again, wind your neck in a learn to read clown, you said our pack was "powder puff"..... possibly the stupidest thing I have heard on here for quite some time. Our pack, like yours is very good and i hope we see a good battle in the forwards, its our best hope to stop you guys getting a roll on out wide.





And I was saying that origin was months ago and in the context of these 80 minutes, means nothing.

Do you honestly think that these England players havent played in big games, 80% of the side will have played in either the G/F, cup final or the playoffs, probably not at the intensity of origin, but regardless, in big games, with big crowds and big expectations




An Aussie win is a huge prediction nostradamus :roll:

You have 3 good forwards-Burgess, Crabtree and Ellis the rest are average. As for the "powder puff" thing well maybe it was a bit harsh but that's my opinion. They haven't done enough to be beating their chests just yet . If you guys can beat us on Sat and then come to Aus and beat us next time IN A SERIES then I will give some credit.
They have played in big matches but you can't compare the two. If you can only go off what we've seen for the last 30 years. The Poms don't cut it when it counts most.
If England win on Saturday then I'll be eating my words I suppose, but knowing the real difference in class it's hard to see us losing if we're switched on.

 

[Simo]

England do have a good pack, better and bigger than anyone in the world.
I too was glad senior, wellens and mcguire have been dropped as they are too old, or not good enough (mcguire).
Andy Farrell overated? dont make me laugh! any team in world rugby of both codes would have signed him from wigan and he could have named his price.
You dont know much about our youngsters, but you will after the game on saturday.

From watching the nrl and superleague week in and week out, i can honestly say there is no difference in quality. The aussies want us all to believe there is, but as world club challenge results down the years show your best teams compete on a level with our best teams.
And also your worst teams play some shocking rugby, just like ours.
So, if england and australia both show up on saturday we will have a great game, and thats what we all want.

wiganjohn, I appreciate talking to someone who is not trolling, so will be civil.

We agree right up to Andy Farrell,he was such a constant disapointment at international level (vs Aus anyway) that for someone of his stature should have dominated. He went into his shell and rarely stood up to the challenge of playing Aus.

Tough man, played great SL footy but at Int level was a huge disapointment.

The youngsters I have hope for in the future, invest in them and have a long term plan but the backling on display against us in the first match was terrible, hopefully becasue it was in its infancy.

As for the SL v NRL quality, well crap teams are indeed crap teams from both comps, but the top NRL side are far better in my opinion than the SL sides and the quality of footy is indeed higher.

The WCC as has been pointed out is seriously never that more than a pre season trial, if the clubs were so much better or equal to the NRL side there would not be such an enourmous gulf at International level.

Its played every year IN the SL season and IN England and in the NRL off season/pre season to which chunks of the NRL premiers have been on extended holiday due to travelling OS for the rep season.

 

[Joker's Wild]

2008 Super League Dream Team

1. Clint Greenshields (Catalans Dragons) – debut
2. Scott Donald (Leeds Rhinos) - 2007
3. Matt Gidley (St Helens) - debut
4. George Carmont (Wigan Warriors) – debut
5. Ade Gardner (St Helens) - debut
6. Leon Pryce (St Helens) - debut
7. Rob Burrow (Leeds Rhinos) – 2005 and 2007
8. James Graham (St Helens) – debut
9. Keiron Cunningham (St Helens) - 1996, 2000, 2001,2002 , 2005, 2006
10. Jamie Peacock (Leeds Rhinos) - 2000, 2001, 2002,2003, 2005, 2007
11. Gareth Ellis (Leeds Rhinos) – 2003, 2006, 2007
12. Ben Westwood (Warrington Wolves) - debut
13. Kevin Sinfield (Leeds Rhinos) – 2005, 2006

The 2 in bold are fringe FGers in the NRL yet were considered the best in their positions in SL. Speaks volumes about the gap between the 2 competitions really.

 

[Teddyboy]

wiganjohn, I appreciate talking to someone who is not trolling, so will be civil.

We agree right up to Andy Farrell,he was such a constant disapointment at international level (vs Aus anyway) that for someone of his stature should have dominated. He went into his shell and rarely stood up to the challenge of playing Aus.

Tough man, played great SL footy but at Int level was a huge disapointment.

The youngsters I have hope for in the future, invest in them and have a long term plan but the backling on display against us in the first match was terrible, hopefully becasue it was in its infancy.

As for the SL v NRL quality, well crap teams are indeed crap teams from both comps, but the top NRL side are far better in my opinion than the SL sides and the quality of footy is indeed higher.

The WCC as has been pointed out is seriously never that more than a pre season trial, if the clubs were so much better or equal to the NRL side there would not be such an enourmous gulf at International level.

Its played every year IN the SL season and IN England and in the NRL off season/pre season to which chunks of the NRL premiers have been on extended holiday due to travelling OS for the rep season.

Sadly the term Aussie Rules means Rugby League as the England is becoming a backwater for the 13 man code.

Maybe Super League Europe is becoming like NFL Europe

 

[Pierced Soul]

loove how the poms always talk themselves up before games despite their woeful record.

only way england beat australia is if the poms continue their dirty tactics and the ref keeps handing them penalties.

i hope white knocks out a pom, he's already taken out 2 qlders

 

[ozenzud]

One of the things that needs to be put in perspective, is the relative playing strength of Oz v England and NZ.

Oz has something like 450,000 players
England I dont think has 50,000
NZ has about 25,000.

In fact, Oz has more RL players than England and South Africa has Rugby union players combined. I' nearly be tempted to throw in England, SA and NZ combined but would have to check my figures. But it would be close.

So when England or NZ beats Australia, its a better achievement than when Ireland/Scotland beats the All Blacks in Rugby. And that has simply never happened.

 

[Shorty]

LOL Surely you poms must be taking the p*ss, how can a fan of a team so pathetic be so arrogant?!
I can't wait for the weekend!

 

[Billythekid]

2008 Super League Dream Team

1. Clint Greenshields (Catalans Dragons) – debut
2. Scott Donald (Leeds Rhinos) - 2007
3. Matt Gidley (St Helens) - debut
4. George Carmont (Wigan Warriors) – debut
5. Ade Gardner (St Helens) - debut
6. Leon Pryce (St Helens) - debut
7. Rob Burrow (Leeds Rhinos) – 2005 and 2007
8. James Graham (St Helens) – debut
9. Keiron Cunningham (St Helens) - 1996, 2000, 2001,2002 , 2005, 2006
10. Jamie Peacock (Leeds Rhinos) - 2000, 2001, 2002,2003, 2005, 2007
11. Gareth Ellis (Leeds Rhinos) – 2003, 2006, 2007
12. Ben Westwood (Warrington Wolves) - debut
13. Kevin Sinfield (Leeds Rhinos) – 2005, 2006

The 2 in bold are fringe FGers in the NRL yet were considered the best in their positions in SL. Speaks volumes about the gap between the 2 competitions really.

The only thing this really shows is that England have a real weakness in their 1-5 positions. Everywhere else they are fairly strong.

The other problem with using this method is that these lists are often very wrong. I know pretty much every year i disagree with a lot of the dally m's and some are just plain stupid.

 

[morgan123]

Super League is weaker than the NRL. Only a fool would deny that. That is because fewer people play the game here. In parts of Australia League is a major sport that people actually care about.

In England Rugby League is a very minor sport, which is victimised and prejudiced by the media, who actively promote and support rugby union.

England has Greg Inglis' and Billy Slaters and Jonathon Thurstons. But unless they live in a very specific area they will never play the game. Even if they were born in an area the sport is played in, the chances are they would be off chasing the Premier League football dream because of their athletic ability and again, never even pick up a ball.

Having said that, there are individuals in SL and the England team who are as good or better than anything in the NRL.

 

[morgan123]

You have 3 good forwards-Burgess, Crabtree and Ellis the rest are average.

If England win on Saturday then I'll be eating my words I suppose, but knowing the real difference in class it's hard to see us losing if we're switched on.

You don't rate James Graham? Never misses a tackle, is the most dangerous prop forward for passing before the line and makes more metres than any prop in world rugby league. Only in his early 20s too. Another, like Burgess and Ellis who would make the jump to the NRL with ease.

And your second point is just laughable. When did Australia last win an international series? You will win, I have no doubt, but thats due to the weakness of the England backs and our mental deficiencies. NZ would have won the final were they in it.

 

[Joker's Wild]

The only thing this really shows is that England have a real weakness in their 1-5 positions. Everywhere else they are fairly strong.

The other problem with using this method is that these lists are often very wrong. I know pretty much every year i disagree with a lot of the dally m's and some are just plain stupid.

Yet neither of these 2 would even come anywhere near a Dally M award while playing in the NRL.

The fact that Dobson got the nod for the SL halfback dream team '09 suggests that they have issues in the 6 and 7 as well.

Any way you want to spin it, the SL is still a much weaker competition than the NRL.

 

[morgan123]

Yet neither of these 2 would even come anywhere near a Dally M award while playing in the NRL.

The fact that Dobson got the nod for the SL halfback dream team '09 suggests that they have issues in the 6 and 7 as well.

Any way you want to spin it, the SL is still a much weaker competition than the NRL.

It is weaker. But didn't Ryan Tandy recently win an NRL Grand Final? The same Ryan Tandy who was and is an absolute joke player who simply wasn't up to playing in the Championship in England, let alone Super League?

The NRL has a lot of average players, a lot of which end up in SL because of their NRL pedigree. The NRL just has more numbers in the system, meaning more top quality athletes can be identified. The fact that you play in decent weather the majority of the time helps massively too.

 

[Joker's Wild]

It is weaker. But didn't Ryan Tandy recently win an NRL Grand Final? The same Ryan Tandy who was and is an absolute joke player who simply wasn't up to playing in the Championship in England, let alone Super League?

The NRL has a lot of average players, a lot of which end up in SL because of their NRL pedigree. The NRL just has more numbers in the system, meaning more top quality athletes can be identified. The fact that you play in decent weather the majority of the time helps massively too.

:lol: What? That arguement is nothing short of rediculous as is suggesting that the NRL is stronger because of the weather.

BTW, Tandy did play for Hull KR too ;-)

 

[Rastus_in_Melbourne]

SL = Sucks Lots.

 

[typicalfan]

Ryan Tandy is one of the many nuffies that the Storm have on their books so they can pay their superstars like Smith, Slater, Inglis, Blair, Cronk, White, Hoffman and Lima. The Melbourne Storm is a better side on paper than the ESL dream team alone

 

[morgan123]

:lol: What? That arguement is nothing short of rediculous as is suggesting that the NRL is stronger because of the weather.

BTW, Tandy did play for Hull KR too ;-)

No, the weather is an important part (One of many) of why rugby league isn't a big sport in this country. Amateur league is still played in winter, meaning kids who play league often train in the pitch dark often when it's raining/snowing/foggy or its below freezing. Can you say the Aussie rugby league juniors face such problems? It's not easy to practice expansive passing drills when you can't see three feet in front of your eyes and you can't feel your fingers or toes. You can't underestimate the benefit your climate has on your development. English people are a strange gray white colour because we never see the sun, it's dark when the kids finish school for half the year.

 

[morgan123]

Ryan Tandy is one of the many nuffies that the Storm have on their books so they can pay their superstars like Smith, Slater, Inglis, Blair, Cronk, White, Hoffman and Lima. The Melbourne Storm is a better side on paper than the ESL dream team alone

True, but a few SL sides would devour the 'Dream Team' too. The DT isn't a collection of the best players in the competition as you would think.

It's simply a team picked based on how well they've done that season. So if a player has a much improved season based on his previous standards he'll probably get in, where a much better player who isn't as outstanding as previous seasons won't.

 

[Rastus_in_Melbourne]

No, the weather is an important part (One of many) of why rugby league isn't a big sport in this country. Amateur league is still played in winter, meaning kids who play league often train in the pitch dark often when it's raining/snowing/foggy or its below freezing. Can you say the Aussie rugby league juniors face such problems? It's not easy to practice expansive passing drills when you can't see three feet in front of your eyes and you can't feel your fingers or toes. You can't underestimate the benefit your climate has on your development. English people are a strange gray white colour because we never see the sun, it's dark when the kids finish school for half the year.

But the sun shines out of Superleague's arse. :lol:

 

[Billythekid]

Ryan Tandy is one of the many nuffies that the Storm have on their books so they can pay their superstars like Smith, Slater, Inglis, Blair, Cronk, White, Hoffman and Lima. The Melbourne Storm is a better side on paper than the ESL dream team alone

Tandy was one of the main reasons we won this year. His form over the last few weeks of the season was fantastic, in fact i think he was our best prop.