Bret Stewart >Josh Dugan & Hayne

[sarahk]

BS Jarryd Hayne is the worst player to play for Parramatta since Paul Carige.

Lol yeah ok good one.

 

[Patsy]

Tries scored

Stewart 98 from 118 - 83%

Slater 112 from 179 - 62%

Dugan 14 from 39 - 35%

Hayne 60 from 107 - 56%

As for tries assists all pretty equal - Hayne maybe slightly ahead but not by much.

Slater probably ahead as best cause he has done it for longer i.e. been at the top for 179 games.

 

[Garts]

Tries don't matter Patsy, it's not like they add points to the scoreboard and win games. Idiot.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Stewart, Patten and Wesser are the only fullbacks in the NRL who have won a premiership at fullback. There's also Hodgson in the UK.

Lockyer won two premierships at fullback (but hasn't played fullback since 2003). Titans fullback Preston Campbell won a premiership in 2003 but played five-eighth. Minichiello won in '02 but played on the wing, as did Boyd in '06.

But Premierships are more about the quality of a player's teammates than individual ability - Shane Perry is a premiership-winning halfback while both Cooper Cronk (never won a premiership) and Johnathan Thurston (won from the interchange bench) are far better players.

So the best indicator is individual awards - the Dally M.

Darren Lockyer has won Dally M Fullback of the Year three times (he's also won Five-Eighth of the Year three times). Other Dally M Fullback winners still playing are Boyd ('10), Hayne ('09), Slater ('08), Bowen ('07), Schifcofske ('06), Hodgson ('05) and Minichiello ('04).

No Stewart, no Dugan, no Patten, no Wesser (though he was top tryscorer in 2003 and probably would have won Dally M Fullback if there had been Dally Ms that year.

Of current fullbacks only Jarryd Hayne has won the Dally M Medal whilst playing fullback. Lockyer has never won it (despite his 6 positional awards at 2 different positions) and Campbell won it while playing halfback in 2001. Hayne also won Dally M Winger in '07 and Rookie of the Year in 2006.

Last year Hayne ran for an NRL-best 4429 metres. Sam Perrett came second with 3401. Hayne ran for a kilometre further than the next guy.

No wonder people think he was crap this year.

This year he did a lot more ball-playing and less support running, so he came second with 3682m (Gallen came first with 4056m).

Did I mention he also made the most try saves in the NRL this year? Hayne's the king. Daylight second.

 

[Raiders_Premiers]

So the best indicator is individual awards - the Dally M.

fail.

 

[Razor]

Stewart and Minichiello are both better than Hayne, Dugan, and Slater.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

As for tries assists all pretty equal - Hayne maybe slightly ahead but not by much.

Linebreak assists are the true measure of a playmaker because they discount all the hoax playmakers who are only useful inside the 20m zone (Tim Smith, Walsh, Soward, Wallace, Mullen, Foran, Maloney, Seymour, Hodkinson) - ie. tactical kickers. Certainly very useful, especially to teams without a 'real' playmaker, but not in the Thurston/Marshall/Johns class.

Here's how they fare (over 2 years because one year could be an anomaly):

Thurston 23
Marshall 23 (to show how the top playmakers went this year)
Slater 18
Hayne 17
Boyd 17
Farrar 13
Dugan 9
Wesser 9
Patten 8
Bowen 7
Hohaia 6

Because one year could be an anomaly, here's how they went last year:

Marshall 26 (again, just to show how the top playmaker went)
Slater 19
Hunt 17
Boyd 11
Gidley 10
Bowen 9
Hayne 7
Patten 6
Dugan 2

Slater is the best playmaker of the lot.

Line breaks?
2010
Uate 29 (top of the NRL, just for comparison to the fullbacks)
Dugan 20
Hayne 17
Wesser 16
Slater 13
Gardner 12
Hoffman 12

2009
Hayne 32
Tuiaki 24
Morris 24 (once again, for comparison - these guys came equal second)
Slater 22
Moltzen 18
Hunt 13
Patten 12
Dugan 9

For Parra's sake I hope they find a halfback so Hayne can go back to running the ball instead of having to throw the pass. Last year he had 32 line breaks and only 7 linebreak assists.

This year he had 17 of each and is widely considered to have sucked arse, along with the rest of the team.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

fail.

If you don't like individual awards have a look at the stats. They don't lie.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Stewart and Minichiello are both better than Hayne, Dugan, and Slater.

Has-beens mate, who were lucky enough to win premierships by playing in a good team against poor opposition (Mini against the '02 Warriors and Stewart against the '08 Storm who didn't bother turning up after they lost their captain to suspension).

 

[Razor]

Has-beens mate, who were lucky enough to win premierships by playing in a good team against poor opposition (Mini against the '02 Warriors and Stewart against the '08 Storm who didn't bother turning up after they lost their captain to suspension).

Stewart and Minichiello were amongst the stars at the clubs. They wouldn't have won the comps if they didn't play. Minichiello was the Australian fullback until he was injured, and still would be.

And hardly has-beens. If you're injured, then comeback, you're not a has-been until you've shown yourself to be a has-been. Stewart is only 25.

 

[^_^]

Hayne & Stewart both great players, just makes me laugh when you say Stewart fluked it, top try scorer in 08, Premiership, had a brilliant yr & scored hatrick in WCC to bring trophy back to Aus.

 

[chefman21]

Mini had it over any fullback in the current game when he was at his peak. Shame injuries took it's toll. Hayne needs an attitude adjustment to be any good. I think Dugan will go down as one of the greats. Reminds me a bit of Belcher.

 

[typicalfan]

Stewart, Patten and Wesser are the only fullbacks in the NRL who have won a premiership at fullback. There's also Hodgson in the UK.

Lockyer won two premierships at fullback (but hasn't played fullback since 2003). Titans fullback Preston Campbell won a premiership in 2003 but played five-eighth. Minichiello won in '02 but played on the wing, as did Boyd in '06.

But Premierships are more about the quality of a player's teammates than individual ability - Shane Perry is a premiership-winning halfback while both Cooper Cronk (never won a premiership) and Johnathan Thurston (won from the interchange bench) are far better players.

So the best indicator is individual awards - the Dally M.

Darren Lockyer has won Dally M Fullback of the Year three times (he's also won Five-Eighth of the Year three times). Other Dally M Fullback winners still playing are Boyd ('10), Hayne ('09), Slater ('08), Bowen ('07), Schifcofske ('06), Hodgson ('05) and Minichiello ('04).

No Stewart, no Dugan, no Patten, no Wesser (though he was top tryscorer in 2003 and probably would have won Dally M Fullback if there had been Dally Ms that year.

Of current fullbacks only Jarryd Hayne has won the Dally M Medal whilst playing fullback. Lockyer has never won it (despite his 6 positional awards at 2 different positions) and Campbell won it while playing halfback in 2001. Hayne also won Dally M Winger in '07 and Rookie of the Year in 2006.

Last year Hayne ran for an NRL-best 4429 metres. Sam Perrett came second with 3401. Hayne ran for a kilometre further than the next guy.

No wonder people think he was crap this year.

This year he did a lot more ball-playing and less support running, so he came second with 3682m (Gallen came first with 4056m).

Did I mention he also made the most try saves in the NRL this year? Hayne's the king. Daylight second.

This is all very good but at the end of the day stats don't tell the entire story. For starters the Dally M is a media driven award with less prestige than the old Rothmans medal and probably less accurate than the Players Player awards.

Hayne is a very good attacking weapon, he is big and strong but while he may have the most try saves he is also among the worst fullbacks in the NRL in terms of his positioning, a mile away from Slater, Stewart and Dugan. He is also worse than all 3 under the high ball.

Hayne has never won an origin match from fullback either. He has a LONG way to go to become the king. Slater and Minichiello both have origin players of the year, Slater a CC medalist (another medal with more prestige than the Dally M).

 

[Eels Dude]

Stewart and Minichiello were amongst the stars at the clubs. They wouldn't have won the comps if they didn't play. Minichiello was the Australian fullback until he was injured, and still would be.

And hardly has-beens. If you're injured, then comeback, you're not a has-been until you've shown yourself to be a has-been. Stewart is only 25.

Other players shone, Stewart included, when Minichiello was out injured and that's why he's not been able to reclaim a rep jersey. Same could go for Stewart. Slater, Gidley and Hayne are the incumbents for the fullback jerseys at rep level and he's going to have to play catch up to win the spots back off them.

 

[typicalfan]

Mini had it over any fullback in the current game when he was at his peak. Shame injuries took it's toll. Hayne needs an attitude adjustment to be any good. I think Dugan will go down as one of the greats. Reminds me a bit of Belcher.

The thing about Dugan is how good he is already but how much he has left to do in the game. Starred in the C v C this year, a sign that he has the ability to lift in bigger games.

Dugan really shouldn't be part of this until he has had his time in the sky blue. Otherwise he hasn't achieved enough to make a fair comparison.

 

[typicalfan]

Also it is a bit much calling someone a hasbeen when he is playing in the Grand Final on Sunday.

 

[chefman21]

The thing about Dugan is how good he is already but how much he has left to do in the game. Starred in the C v C this year, a sign that he has the ability to lift in bigger games.

Dugan really shouldn't be part of this until he has had his time in the sky blue. Otherwise he hasn't achieved enough to make a fair comparison.

I agree with that.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Stewart and Minichiello were amongst the stars at the clubs. They wouldn't have won the comps if they didn't play. Minichiello was the Australian fullback until he was injured, and still would be.

And hardly has-beens. If you're injured, then comeback, you're not a has-been until you've shown yourself to be a has-been. Stewart is only 25.

I was joking mate. Even Mini has shown he's still a quality first grader. At his peak I'd say he was as good as Hayne, though Hayne is far from his peak. Stewart was still one of the game's top fullbacks early last year.

But neither is as good as Hayne or Slater.

 

[1 Eyed TEZZA]

I was joking mate. Even Mini has shown he's still a quality first grader. At his peak I'd say he was as good as Hayne, though Hayne is far from his peak. Stewart was still one of the game's top fullbacks early last year.

But neither is as good as Hayne or Slater.

Im sorry mate, but apart from Lockyer, Mini is the best fullback this decade.

Stats dont tell the whole story, its what that player does for his team. The only thing that matters when judging on players is if that team can win with that player in that position. I dont see any full back hindering a teams chances to winning a comp.

For Origin, I think selections should be made on a teams style. If a Jarryd Hayne style suits the way the team is to play, then he gets picked. If its a Josh Dugan style thats needed, then he gets picked. Sometimes you will have a player so good that you should make a style that suits them, but I believe that should only be for a halfback or hooker.

For Australian selection, I think it should totally be based on reward for efforts throughout the season and previous rep matches.

 

[Big Pete]

Im sorry mate, but apart from Lockyer, Mini is the best fullback this decade.

Slater has overtaken Mini now.