Edwards or DWZ for fullback next year

[betcats]

Sorry to rehash this but I just read this on 0tackle:

The Sharks relied heavily on Barba’s ability to set up tries as well as score them in their title winning season.

IMO, this is important for any team wanting to win the comp and I think that Edwards has more ability in this area than DWZ. Not that I think either player can achieve what Barba did in 2016, but I think we need some sort of dual-option threat at FB.

Edwards was pretty poor last season when he got the ball in those ball playing situations. Threw some terrible chance killing passes. Neither has much ability in that area.

 

[TheFrog]

neither Whare or Blake have completed a full season without injury.

Blake only missed 3 games in 2017, the two finals from injury and the Souths game due to being stood down. Whare played all 26 games in 2014.

 

[franklin2323]

Edwards was pretty poor last season when he got the ball in those ball playing situations. Threw some terrible chance killing passes. Neither has much ability in that area.

He was a half in juniors atleast. That hopefully sees him improve

 

[franklin2323]

Sorry to rehash this but I just read this on 0tackle:

The Sharks relied heavily on Barba’s ability to set up tries as well as score them in their title winning season.

IMO, this is important for any team wanting to win the comp and I think that Edwards has more ability in this area than DWZ. Not that I think either player can achieve what Barba did in 2016, but I think we need some sort of dual-option threat at FB.

I think a ball playing FB is a must. Teams defend with the FB in the line so halves have no space. A FB has no such problems

 

[betcats]

He was a half in juniors atleast. That hopefully sees him improve

Yeah I hope he improves also but I think at this point he is what he is, a strong running fullback with great attitude and fitness and the ability to break a tackle better than most. I think both he and Dallin can improve their ball playing with more experience in the position and building combinations with the players around them, but neither will ever be a ball playing fullback, they both lack the vision.

We used to have a ball playing fullback and everyone wanted a fullback who would return kicks stronger, now we have two fullbacks who return kicks as well as just about anyone and we now it seems everyone wants a ball player back there again.

I don't think we need a Moylan like FB, both Edwards and Dallin offer plenty at the back, we just need more out of our halves. Ivan has a good record at getting good form out of his halves though so I think we will see improvement from them both.

 

[franklin2323]

Yeah I hope he improves also but I think at this point he is what he is, a strong running fullback with great attitude and fitness and the ability to break a tackle better than most. I think both he and Dallin can improve their ball playing with more experience in the position and building combinations with the players around them, but neither will ever be a ball playing fullback, they both lack the vision.

We used to have a ball playing fullback and everyone wanted a fullback who would return kicks stronger, now we have two fullbacks who return kicks as well as just about anyone and we now it seems everyone wants a ball player back there again.

I don't think we need a Moylan like FB, both Edwards and Dallin offer plenty at the back, we just need more out of our halves. Ivan has a good record at getting good form out of his halves though so I think we will see improvement from them both.

Both are very raw. DWZ wasn't fullback in NYC. Came to FG early has had less then 30 games there. Edwards the same plenty of time on the wing in lower grades. So both just need to get a style.

I never was against Moylan being there I still think he is one of the top in the comp. Given the wingers we had it worked well. We have better halves now so don't need anyone to dominate just be an extra ball player.

 

[Matthew Ellis]

"57 – Kick-return metres per game averaged by Penrith fullback Dylan Edwards, the most in the NRL, before his season was cut short by shoulder surgery."
https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/12/12/100-1-the-stats-that-defined-the-2018-nrl-season/

 

[OldPanther]

"57 – Kick-return metres per game averaged by Penrith fullback Dylan Edwards, the most in the NRL, before his season was cut short by shoulder surgery."
https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/12/12/100-1-the-stats-that-defined-the-2018-nrl-season/

I'm so glad I wasn't imagining him being a good fullback.

 

[MrBlack]

Something outside the box would be

1. Blake
2. Edwards
4. DWZ

Imagine Blake doing the kick returns......

Would be outstanding. We would start every set inside the oppositions half.

 

[mxlegend99]

"57 – Kick-return metres per game averaged by Penrith fullback Dylan Edwards, the most in the NRL, before his season was cut short by shoulder surgery."
https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/12/12/100-1-the-stats-that-defined-the-2018-nrl-season/

Yet we had 2 players exceed it once they had a chance at fullback, for 3 of the top 6 averages to be Panthers. Remarkable considering Dallins average is greatly reduced by his games on the wing.

His kick return metres as a winger were 22, 34, 0, 56, 8, 9, 36 and 38. For an average of 25.75 metres. Removing those 8 games from his stats.

Dallin played 12 games for 1,042 kick return metres as a fullback for an average of 86.83 kick return metres. In 5 of his 12 games he exceeded 100 metres.

Its a huge reason I want him at fullback for kick returns. He more than triples his output by playing there. That's not a small change. But doesnt matter as we are unlikely to have to decide for long. If both were fit all season it wouldnt matter who was picked anyway. I wouldn't be surprised if they missed 10+ games between them.

 

[mxlegend99]

Something outside the box would be

1. Blake
2. Edwards
4. DWZ

Imagine Blake doing the kick returns......

Would be outstanding. We would start every set inside the oppositions half.

My imagination has a different outcome.

Blake would score untouched off his kick return, Cleary would nail the goal from directly infront and we would be receiving the ball from a kick off.

 

[OldPanther]

My imagination has a different outcome.

Blake would score untouched off his kick return, Cleary would nail the goal from directly infront and we would be receiving the ball from a kick off.

The NRL wouldn't allow it. We'd win every game by 50.

 

[Luke Bowden]

Our of interest, how do there errors compare?

 

[mxlegend99]

Surprisingly errors are now an option... NRL have really improved the stats section.

Average errors per game for us (in order they appear on list):
Jimmy - 1.3
Luai - 1.3
Blake - 1.3
Edwards - 1.1
DWZ - 1.1

Total errors per game for us
Jimmy - 28
DWZ - 22
Kikau - 22

As for breaking it down to wing/fullback I dont know how to find a breakdown of errors per game on the NRL site. The game by game stats are very limited under each players profile. But there's f**k all separating them. Surprisingly.

Btw the breakdown is the top 50 players. So we had 5 players in the top 50 for average errors and 3 in top 50 for total errors.

 

[Matthew Ellis]

Surprisingly errors are now an option... NRL have really improved the stats section.

Average errors per game for us (in order they appear on list):
Jimmy - 1.3
Luai - 1.3
Blake - 1.3
Edwards - 1.1
DWZ - 1.1

Total errors per game for us
Jimmy - 28
DWZ - 22
Kikau - 22

As for breaking it down to wing/fullback I dont know how to find a breakdown of errors per game on the NRL site. The game by game stats are very limited under each players profile. But there's f**k all separating them. Surprisingly.

Btw the breakdown is the top 50 players. So we had 5 players in the top 50 for average errors and 3 in top 50 for total errors.

NRL.com isn't as accurate as Fox Sports Lab mate. It's good as a generalization but it isn't an accurate measurement. You how people complain why didn't they record player x's try assist or try in super coach? That's down to dodgy NRL.com counting.

 

[mxlegend99]

"57 – Kick-return metres per game averaged by Penrith fullback Dylan Edwards, the most in the NRL, before his season was cut short by shoulder surgery."
https://www.nrl.com/news/2018/12/12/100-1-the-stats-that-defined-the-2018-nrl-season/

NRL.com isn't as accurate as Fox Sports Lab mate. It's good as a generalization but it isn't an accurate measurement. You how people complain why didn't they record player x's try assist or try in super coach? That's down to dodgy NRL.com counting.

So you're trying to say that post is not an accurate measurement? NRL.com articles use their stats.

It's not about dodgy counting. It's about them each having a different rule set for how stats are measured. Nearly all stats measured are not black and white. Try assists and linebreak assists especially. Does simply throwing the last pass entitle you to either one if the player who received it made it happen? Ie. Blakes try against Eels in Round 1, Kikau multiple times off nothing passes forcing his way through. Does anyone deserve an assist for these? Does the last pass before a barge over try deserve an assist? In a team try where lots of players arr involved how do they decide who gets what in the stats?

So if different sources apply a different rule for how they measure these areas. Both would be accurate under their own rule set despite having a different figure and if you decided to personally measure these areas you might get a different result to both.

At the end of the day so long as youre using the same rules to compare players it's about as fair as you can get.

Edit
Even simple things like running metres wouldnt be 100% definitive. We see every week they can't tell exactly where players are on the field even in relation to each other. So how do they accurately say exactly what position on the field he was in when he received the ball to when tackled? Where is the running metre count stopped? If a fullback is running back to receive the ball and travels 5m backwards while turning does do his first 5 metres in returning thr kick count as metres gained?

I wouldnt mind seeing how each source measures their stats. They would no doubt have complicated systems which still cant cover all grey areas. But they wouldnt have the same exact systems.

 

[Buzzard Breath]

Returning Edwards ready to battle star teammate for Panthers' No.1
By Steve Zemek
16 December 2018 — 10:14am
A fearless Dylan Edwards has thrown himself head-first into training following a shoulder reconstruction as he prepares to battle Golden Boot finalist Dallin Watene-Zelezniak for Penrith's No.1 jumper.

The pair are set to wage an off-season battle for the fullback spot with both possessing strong claims for the coveted role.

Edwards is on the comeback trail and back in full contact training, having been limited to just eight NRL appearances this year after tearing cartilage in his shoulder.

In his absence, Watene-Zelezniak made the No.1 jersey his own before taking his game to another level when handed the New Zealand Test captaincy and earning a Golden Boot nomination.

While some players can be understandably tentative and nervous coming back from shoulder surgery, Edwards has dived in since getting back on the paddock knowing that his jumper is under threat.

"I was good to go straight up," Edwards said of his shoulder. "I just thought to myself 'if it's going to go, it's going to go'. I just chucked myself into it and didn't really worry about it too much."
It hasn't gone unnoticed by returning Penrith coach Ivan Cleary, who has described the 22-year-old as leading from the front.

Edwards has the inside running, standing at fullback during match simulation since the start of the pre-season.

However there will be some telling moments once Watene-Zelezniak returns after Christmas.

"I think we will battle it out," Edwards said.

"It's a good little challenge, it just shows the depth of our squad and that's a strength in this comp.

"But I'm looking forward to the challenge. Dallin played really, really good footy for the Kiwis."
Edwards made his first two NRL appearances on the wing, but believes he can get the best out of himself at fullback.

And Cleary has laid down the challenge to the pair, urging them to demand the spot.

"They'll decide that," he said when asked how he will separate the two.

"There's a few positions that are going to be difficult. It's a good problem to have and those boys can both play other positions as well."
https://www.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/re...ammate-for-panthers-no-1-20181216-p50mj7.html

 

[nick87]

Bump - a few different spots have suggested the Raiders are keen on Edwards... the story goes DWZ is the preferred option at fullback, so there could be a move worked out before the 2019 season kick off

Anyone in Panther land heard anything like that?
I'd personally be very stoked to land Dylan Edwards

 

[PANTHERMIKE]

Bump - a few different spots have suggested the Raiders are keen on Edwards... the story goes DWZ is the preferred option at fullback, so there could be a move worked out before the 2019 season kick off

Anyone in Panther land heard anything like that?
I'd personally be very stoked to land Dylan Edwards

Will not happen.

 

[franklin2323]

Bump - a few different spots have suggested the Raiders are keen on Edwards... the story goes DWZ is the preferred option at fullback, so there could be a move worked out before the 2019 season kick off

Anyone in Panther land heard anything like that?
I'd personally be very stoked to land Dylan Edwards

If DWZ is FB I don't see Edwards being kept. Cap wise better off getting a cheap winger. I don't know how DWZ could be preferred so soon given he was away with NZ. Maybe a mid season move but too soon atm