What's new
The Front Row Forums

Register a free account today to become a member of the world's largest Rugby League discussion forum! Once signed in, you'll be able to participate on this site by adding your own topics and posts, as well as connect with other members through your own private inbox!

F.O Kemp Society inc

Phillips

Referee
Messages
24,049
Nothing. Kemp is just a class above them, who is being entirely wasted at the warriors.

are you serious? Kemp is average, all he ever did at the broncos was catch the pass from lockyer and either run 2 metres and dive over the line.
 

Rich102

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
11,655
I've got to put my hand up. I think he is greatly over rated.I haven't seen him do anything at the Warriors that either of the U20's wingers couldn't do better. And his defence is pitiful. Locke is a class above him.
Whoever bought him should be forced to walk the plank.
 

Martli

Coach
Messages
11,564
I still think he was a good signing in the given situation. It's only hindsight that has turned it into such a dud so far.
 

badav

Bench
Messages
2,601
are you serious? Kemp is average, all he ever did at the broncos was catch the pass from lockyer and either run 2 metres and dive over the line.


Biggest load of sh*t ive read today. The thing that made him good was thats not the type of winger he was.
 

Sam_the_man

First Grade
Messages
5,095
Biggest load of sh*t ive read today. The thing that made him good was thats not the type of winger he was.

And yours is now the biggest load of sh*t i've read this week. Kemp is terrible. Easily one the worst signings in the clubs history and he is now playing at a level that he can compete at, the NSWRL.
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
I feel quite sorry for Kemp to be honest. He's apparently been playing injured which I imagine hasn't helped his form and he's needed to adapt to a very different team. And on top of that once he missed a game Locke came into his position and went brilliantly.

Having said that, I really don't see how he can fit into our full strength team right now. The back three of McKinnon, Vatuvei, Locke is working well and I don't think Kemp has the physical presence to play centre at this stage. I think it will be an interesting test to see if he's prepared to stay at the Warriors to try and prove himself (and whether the Warriors want to give him that chance of course) or whether he heads off for another club in the off season.

I'd bring him back onto the bench and bring him in the centres through the game. I think NZW suggested it, and the more I think of it the more I think its a good move. Moon and MAnnering to start in the centres, Kemp off the bench, Lewis Brown is a hooker by trade so he can interchange with Henderson and Moon is in the team incase something's needed in the halves. Gives you a game breaker off the bench and pretty much coverage of all your positions.

From the last game therefore I'd have as changed 3 Moon 14 Kemp and I'd also take a serious look at Ta'ai. If we're going to use the ball, I want him on the fringes.

are you serious? Kemp is average, all he ever did at the broncos was catch the pass from lockyer and either run 2 metres and dive over the line.

Yeah, he just falls over the line with this one...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HWCyq5wBcNg

The try about 20 seconds into this, does he just pick it up and run 2 metres? No he gasses the Eels to win the game with Lockyer. And the one 1:43 in? The one 2:14 in is him again I'm sure, and again its express pace over distance (The Warriors have tried about 3-4 times this play also, the only difference has been the kicking ability of the relative halves).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kQ21Meg6OrU

I can't find his debut try where he went 75m straight through Manly from a kick return.

The only difference is here you have to be built like a freight train or have outlandish abilities to read plays to rev it up in the try scoring stakes. The Warriors would have been better served with blokes like Semi Tadulala or Wise Kativera, big dudes on the wing who will play as an extra prop. All other clubs would be better served with a bloke like Kemp who can crash a game open. We've got a dude who makes 10-15 support runs every game but can't find a forward to pop an offload to save themselves... The difference is the lack of class in creating tries. I think it's been a lack of freedom in ball movement, a stubborn desire to be near the top of completion rates rather than do what the Warriors used to be good at. Finally we're hearing Ivan Cleary talk about this so hopefully the Warriors lose some of the restrictions and we see some expansive football again and we can start to see McKinnon receive some decent ball, Vatuvei be used as more than just a battering ram and anyone at all who plays on the right hand side actually receive some opportunities that don't consist of cross field bombs.
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
That's due to the inside work. Nothing was created for the bloke. He'd be fine anywhere else, the Warriors of 2009 are the least attacking Warriors team since their inception and by far the most inept attacking unit in the NRL. The three blokes at the back aren't responsible for changing that, it starts up front and with the playmakers. Maybe now that our most instinctive player is back in the halves we may start to generate some opportunities in sets that consist of more than hit up, hit up, hit up, dummy half run, hit up, bomb. Tell me how any winger, except for Vatuvei who plays like an extra backrower, is supposed to thrive off that? Broncos know how to create, the Warriors don't, our philisophy is tuck it under the arm and make 45 metres for the set and nothing else. I reckon blokes like Vatuvei would have a field day playing for them.
 

ozbash

Referee
Messages
26,922
You should rename this sh*thouse society of yours, Air France. Because it's going down in flames at the moment.

Pffffft, membership is at an all time high, I've had to build a shed out the back to accomadate everyone.
We're on a roll..


That's due to the inside work. Nothing was created for the bloke.

agree again, but does the player fit the game plan or do we fit the game plan to the player...

and, how come we started winning/playing better when the shirt lifter was chucked ?? hmmm
 

Micistm

Bench
Messages
4,470
Game plan to the player or player to the game plan...?
They seem to revolve enough of it around Manu, why not utilise Kemps speed into some? IMO it is a poor team that wouldn't take a player like Kemp in make a gameplan around him...and unfortunately, a poor team is exactly what the Warriors have been this year on attack. I'm hoping things will change around now like they have around this time the last three odd years...you never know.
Maybe Kemp off the bench into centre is worth a go, providing his defence can handle it. That way we're filling the centre gap and allowing Locke to stay on the wing in the FG
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
Pffffft, membership is at an all time high, I've had to build a shed out the back to accomadate everyone.
We're on a roll..




agree again, but does the player fit the game plan or do we fit the game plan to the player...

and, how come we started winning/playing better when the shirt lifter was chucked ?? hmmm

Well I'd like to think having a game plan that involves us having the potential to score more points than the opposition is desirable...? Its clear out attack this year has been woeful. If that's by design I'd suggest you'd change the game plan to take advantage of what you've got. Otherwise you might as well plonk Grant Fox on the wing and at least have a decent goal kicker. Yak, you get to the point where you could say we might as well play union, get it to the halfback and just boot. The next progression for our attackless team is to form a line out and stick a couple of extra tacklers into the team. I can't ever see our current game plan of hit up, hit up, hit up, hit up, dummy half run, kick is ever going to win a modern day premiership. Your entire game plan can't revolve around the props hitting up, lock tackling anything he can, hooker taking a nothing run and halfback booting it high.

I'd also like to think that given we're currently averaging 14 points per game, and are sitting entrenched outside the 8, that the whole tuck it under the arm routine and not use our wingers shtick isn't an effective game plan. So yes, I think there's a massive amount of indicators to suggest its our game plan thats wrong, not the player.

We have also lost to the Cronulla Sharks while Denan hasn't been in the team.

Just quietly, I'd even suggest that blokes like Jerome Ropati, Wade McKinnon, Manu Vatuvei and Ben Matulino have hardly set the world on fire in attack this year. Surely, surely, surely to heck that shows there may be something wrong with our attacking structure. I don't think the right winger is to blame for those blokes being down on their attacking numbers (forget their metres made, I mean genuine attacking potency) in 2009. I'd even suggest that Joel Moon progressively has appeared a weaker attacking player the longer he's been with us to assimilate into our structure. From all reports he was great in the trials, first couple of weeks he was strong, and since then he's been a below average performer. I think it shows up further again when you look at Locke and Brown and in that second half against Cronulla Aaron Heremaia that you have blokes who haven't been regimented into following the first grade game plan and its been these blokes who have looked most likely, because they seem to still play unrestricted football. The long term players look like structured statures without any flair or any aspiration to break the opposition apart with an attacking flurry. All in all, it points to the team structure being wrong, not the player, because it extends well beyond Denan Kemp.
 
Last edited:

ozbash

Referee
Messages
26,922
The next progression for our attackless team is to form a line out and stick a couple of extra tacklers into the team.

that wont work, they lost too..

apart from some initial centre swapping I dont think things changed all that much except for the intro of young Locke.

Locke started doing what kemp was supposed/hyped to do,, eg score trys and our defence down his side of the paddock tightened up considerably.

Agree that the team has been very uninspiring on attack, but was purchasing a finisher (kemp) a sensible option? we have done a hell of a lot better with attacking wings (manu and, recently, Locke).

Does Kemp have any attack/flair/creativity/spark in him ?
Havnt seen it here or last year at the Broncs..
 

Rich102

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
11,655
that wont work, they lost too..

apart from some initial centre swapping I dont think things changed all that much except for the intro of young Locke.

Locke started doing what kemp was supposed/hyped to do,, eg score trys and our defence down his side of the paddock tightened up considerably.

Agree that the team has been very uninspiring on attack, but was purchasing a finisher (kemp) a sensible option? we have done a hell of a lot better with attacking wings (manu and, recently, Locke).

Does Kemp have any attack/flair/creativity/spark in him ?
Havnt seen it here or last year at the Broncs..

Hell yes! A blue bag with brown shoes shows a hell of a lot of flair.
 

badav

Bench
Messages
2,601
he's not at the broncos, mate

he's useless..


Thats got alot more to do with the Warriors than it does with Kemp. Any back is only as good as the ball they get.

Warriors have been struggling to put points on the board this season. They are much better suited to big clumsy 1 dimensional backs like Vatuvei and Ropati.
 
Last edited:

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
In fairness mate, Vatuvei plays a similar style of football to Wendell Sailor on the wing - straight ahead, does a load of work, tough to stop close to the line - and I really, really, really doubt you'd label him clumsy. His handling is much improved over the past couple of years. There's a lot of other players in the NRL with higher error rates than Manu and his workrate is pretty high for an outside back.

As your own team showed throughout the 90s badav, you can have multiple types of wingers. You can have your aggro dynamos like Hancock, your slick finishers like Carne, the power and passion of Sailor and Tuqiri, it's all irrelevant its how you use the ball to give them opportunities. I think the Warriors rely too much on Manu's go forward. I think the Warriors attack is stifled and seriously depleted, it creates nothing on the inside and asks the outside backs on very limited occasions to thrust through the line and create something out of nothing. Vatuvei, like Kemp, would be a star at a team like Brisbane. They'd usually be good at a team like the Warriors, but this they've played very restricted and inhibited go forward football with little flair and it has largely made it a 6 man game + the halfback, which would be ok maybe if your halfback was a Soward or someone similar who had express pace off the mark himself to break the line and create broken field opportunities.

Kemp will bounce back. The question for me is whether it will be at the Warriors, and the only reason it can't be is if they stubbornly keep to the overly structured regimented game plan, or at another club. Anyone who can't see we have massive problems with our attack that extend far beyond the winger when we average 14 points per game is kidding themselves. Its a miracle we're as high in the table as we are.
 

Rich102

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
11,655
Thats got alot more to do with the Warriors than it does with Kemp. Any back is only as good as the ball they get.

Warriors have been struggling to put points on the board this season. They are much better suited to big clumsy 1 dimensional backs like Vatuvei and Ropati.

True, but Locke manages to score tries.
 

Latest posts

Top