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GC v CC

Ari Gold

Bench
Messages
2,939
central coast dont deserve shit......go support newcastle or manly. NSW have too many teams already, CC should only get a team if either a sydney team falls down, which doesnt look to be happening anytime soon.

didnt the trial at the CC last night only get round 4000? whereas 16000 turned up at carrara? why is there only team in NZ which has over 30000 players alone?

itll be in australias interest also to have a second nz team, because atm most of the up and coming juniors; sonnyb benji hunt harrison soliola......are NZ players, and there as sooo many more juniors coming up the ranks that its not funny and this is cutting opportunities for the aussie kids to develop. go and watch an U 18/19 rep side and you'll see the majority of the rep sides will have about 6+ nz players, and those 6 spots could be going to some aussie kids, and this will in return stop the talent coming thru 4 australia. 10 years back, when someone asked who was going to be the next star of the game it was the lockyers, johns, barrets etc. now its sonny bill, benji, hunt.

i dunno anything bout the blueprint but the teams that deserve entry to the nrl the most are (in order), orcas, GC, perth(have to wait and see what the crowds are for next weeks trials) CC, adelaide, redcliffe.....
 

mightybears

Bench
Messages
4,342
razor said:

Call it what you want, but they were not playing on the Gold Coast. Tweed Heads is NOT part of the Gold Coast area.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
big tip mate- it is
the border doesn't stop it being one single entity in terms of 'market'
a bid long urban sprawl
they played at seagulls till 95, they started at carrara in 94
no matter where the team was [nsw or qld] supporters came from both sides of the tweed
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
razor said:

CC people only want to support their team, not the game. If their own team isn't playing, they aren't interested.
The Gold Coast has proven that they want to support the game on top of their team. If their own team isn't play, the GC population is still interested.
That's why the Gold Coast deserve to be in first
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
'their' team is an nrl team that plays ALL ITS MATCHES AT GOSFORD as per the 98 bears plan
the bears went their because a generation of norths fans moved up the cc because they couldn't afford the area their parents lived in

the bears have been recruiting their for years-and putting the money into the area - o'meley, orford, fairleigh etc
the bears got the stadium built at gosford-its done
have you been to carrara?-its a joke still

and there have been lots of trials at gosford that have been well supported
 

Matt M

Juniors
Messages
707
mightybears, what is the point of having a great stadium if only 4500 people go there? This is not a one off, the Northern Eagles got 5000 people to full NRL games all the time. You may say that it wasn't their own team but if the Northern Eagles played half their games at the GC there would be well over 5000 to matches.
 

mightypanther

Juniors
Messages
2,023
.

by miccle

The Courier Mail actually states the crowd at Gosford as 4,500


by dodge

1) Charity Shield crowd was 20000 - however that was a heavily publicised game that was played at an already official NRL venue and a trial also shown on TV.

2) The small crowd was a direct result of extremely poor weather that struck Gosford at around 4pm. Had it been very stormy and raining on the GC the crowd wouldn't have topped 6 or 7k.

3) Well done contradicting yourself Iafeta - "trials are not covered"

4) Hence why alot of people wouldn't have known, and many of those who did would've decided against going once the rain poured.


by Happy Gilmore

But the weather was terrible, 10,000 wouldve been great considering all the seats uncovered were wet even the ones that were just under cover, we had to force our way up the stands, and even some of those seats were wet. If it didnt rain they wouldve got a lot more and thats no excuse.


So........if I've got this right so far.......there are only 4 main excuses
being given for the very small crowd of 4,500 that turned up at the CC
last night for the trial match............and they are.......

1) Bad weather

2) Not advertised

3) Not at an official NRL venue

4) And not shown on TV


Well if they are the only excuses that the Cental Coast have got.........
then they don't have too much going for them then.

Why ?

Because the Penrith v Knights trial match was also on last night

1) In VERY bad weather

2) Not advertised

3) At a tiny country ground in Bathurst with one grandstand that
....would be lucky to hold 300 people.

4) And not shown on TV

CROWD FIGURE ??? .... 7,000


VERY POOR SHOWING CENTRAL COAST.... :roll:



.
 

Razor

Coach
Messages
10,077
big tip mate- it is
the border doesn't stop it being one single entity in terms of 'market'

TWEED HEADS IS NOT PART OF THE GOLD COAST.

Tomorrow ring up the Gold Coast City council and ask them. They'll laugh at you.

Can't believe Central Coast people are so stupid that they actually think Tweed Heads is a suburb of the Gold Coast.

they played at seagulls till 95, they started at carrara in 94

Good math you have there.

Anyway 1997 was the first year they played at Carrara stadium. I was wrong before when they said 1996. But it certainly wasn't 1994.

So they were at the Gold Coast for 2 years

Look at what the website rl1908 says

"The 1997 season saw the club move to the Gold Coast to play their matches"

Obviously you know more than them, since that statement says 1997 was their first year, and "move to the Gold Coast" implies they weren't already there. Maybe that's because they weren't, and it seems only Central Coast people think they were, because they need to lie and twist things to make the Gold Coast bid look bad. In fact all this twisting of facts makes the Central Coast bid look even worse, because it shows that deep down you generally believe that the Gold Coast bid is better. So if CC people think the GC bid is better, what's the NRL going to think? "Heck they're making up stories about the Gold Coast, let's give CC the team", no they'll say "Heck they're making up stories about the Gold Coast, the CC bid must be even worse than we think. Now there's no doubt GC should be the team, if even the CC public thinks that's the better choice"

'their' team is an nrl team that plays ALL ITS MATCHES AT GOSFORD as per the 98 bears plan
the bears went their because a generation of norths fans moved up the cc because they couldn't afford the area their parents lived in

the bears have been recruiting their for years-and putting the money into the area - o'meley, orford, fairleigh etc
the bears got the stadium built at gosford-its done
have you been to carrara?-its a joke still

Yes I've been to Carrara. The stadium will be upgraded if the Dolphins get in.

And the Gold Coast public has shown they'll go to watch any League match. Central Coast won't. You just re-iterated that fact

You're nothing but a News Ltd lacky spewing their propoganda on how SE-QLD must remain exclusive to the Broncos.
 

choisir

Juniors
Messages
232
Razor arn't the Knight's opposed to a central Coast team?IMO both the Bronco's and Newcastle have selfish agenda's.
 

Razor

Coach
Messages
10,077
Razor arn't the Knight's opposed to a central Coast team?

No AFAIK the Knights support the Central Coast bid over the Gold Coast bid (but the Knights want Wellington in first)

I live in QLD, and don't necessarily support my team on everything. I support what is best for the game.
 

Razor

Coach
Messages
10,077
Happy Gilmore said:
Just to correct the Gold Coast, they started their matches at Carrara in 1996, when they first became the Chargers.

That's what I thought but rl1908 says 1997
 

mightybears

Bench
Messages
4,342
razor
first march at carrara was 1994 round 2 [march 18 1994]
gold coast v brisbane
and won 25 to 12-the coast moved their home game from seagulls as a one off, they played at seagulls for the rest of 94 and 95
they moved permanently in 1996 to carrara
my 'maths' was fine
rl1908 is a great history site but less strong on modern stats
have a look at
http://stats.rleague.com/rl/rl_index.html

==========================================
razor said:

TWEED HEADS IS NOT PART OF THE GOLD COAST.
Tomorrow ring up the Gold Coast City council and ask them. They'll laugh at you.
Can't believe Central Coast people are so stupid that they actually think Tweed Heads is a suburb of the Gold Coast.
============================================

we both live in queensland [i live in brisbane]
i well know that tweed heads is in nsw, seperate council etc -big suprise

but in terms of 'market, they are the same
it is IN EFFECT a suburb of the gold coast
one big sprawl/conurbation -it doesn't go bush at twin towns does it?
the tweed and gold coast areas have been one and the same in a practical sense for decades

and no matter seagulls or carrara the people of the gold coast and northern nsw supported the gold coast team
lots of lismore peolpe use to make the trip to watch the gold coast
===========================================
razor said:

You're nothing but a News Ltd lacky spewing their propoganda on how SE-QLD must remain exclusive to the Broncos.

============================================

i laughed out loud at that
no mate i been screaming at broncos bias and the evil empire before superleague
i have always supported expansion in general
i have never had a problem with a team on the gold coast bar pinching redcliffe's name
i have hate the red hill scabs for what they did to the game

but using one trial on the gold coast [with the 'local' broncos playing and heaps of newslimited publicity] and comparing it to another match at gosford as your reason why the gc but not cc supports league in general is bullshit

it ignores all the other trials at both venues, who was playing, how much publicity etc


the broncos support a gc team because they fear another brissie team
the knights fear the cc bears concept so they support a gc bid
its all self interest, don't believe otherwise
 

JW

Coach
Messages
12,657
Razor said:
Tomorrow ring up the Gold Coast City council and ask them. They'll laugh at you.

Why would he do that? Councils only govern a certain area, not an entire city which can be defined by looking up combined statistical divisions and boundaries on the ABS site.

Going on your logic, Brisbane is by far the biggest city in Australia and Sydney is one of the smallest.

Cheers.
 

Surfer Joe

Juniors
Messages
42
Didn't one John Singleton encourage the CC people NOT to go to Northern Eagles Games? I recall a comment regarding the world record for lowest attendance. The CC had the chance and blew it badly. Their logo should be: "The Central Coast Bears,proudly maintaining 80 years of mediocrity and stuff-ups". Give it to the Gold Coast.
 

Knightmare

Coach
Messages
10,716
coldhardbitch said:
dodge. you just cant seem to look at it for the good of the sport.

Central Coast brings absolutely NOTHING to rugby league and is a complete waste of time.

Gold coast, wellington, sout brisbane, perth, cairns and adelaide all deserve berths before central coast is even mentioned as a possible team.

For central coast to get a team, at least 5 sydney teams need to be booted or relocated first.

:lol: Yeah, because having the third largest junior Rugby League base in NSW counts for nothing, does it? Going by your logic, we should try and establish a team in Hobart before we give the Central Coast a team. At least you'll be happy when Rugby Union swoop on all the Central Coasts' juniors. :roll:
 

bender

Juniors
Messages
2,231
PARRA_FAN said:
Why should NZ get another team before Central Coast, Perth and Adelaide?

This is NATIONAL Rugby League, we've got to think about going national before putting another team from New Zealand in.

Perth should get another chance, Adelaide try again, Central Coast for real this time.

Lets put the Gold Coast in first and then go Australia wide. Hell you cant ignore Western Australia, its the 3rd biggest Rugby League state in Oz and I've got the fear of losing it Rugby Union is something is not done about it.
The reason New Zealand get in before Central Coast is because they bring in twice as much money as the other sides. The Auckland Warriors are pretty much responsible for an awfully large amount of payTV revenue (from New Zealand), which would be greatly reduced if they werent there. Bringing in the Orcas, not only sures this up, but it has enormous potential to expand on it, if the Orcas are successful. In fact, if they work out, in 5-10 years, the Warriors and Orcas will probably bring in enough NZTV money to not only pay for themselves, but also for an extra couple of teams. Whether those teams end up being a third kiwi team, a Perth or Adelaide or even a central Coast team, will tell. From a juniors point of view, a second Kiwi team, really doesnt have any problem getting players and could probably but up a team (to current wooden spoon standards) without even drawing from current NRL players. Neither of the others can.

In reality, CC is a gamble though, because the are not a traditional RL area. Gold Coast simply isnt. They are a rugby league town through and through. Maybe not quite as strong as Townsville or Newcastle but certainly the equal of Brisbane or Sydney or Central Coast and ahead of Perth, Adelaide, Wellington, Canberra etc. There case is simple. They are now the 6th Largest City in Australia, behind Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Perth, Adelaide and just ahead of Newcastle. This was not the case when they were last in the competition. They are located in the fastest growing area in Australia (not just Queensland). When you consider that it is more than likely that the vast majority of Logan Residents will also feel that Gold Coast are there team, since they are the closest team to them (or at least equal distance from the Broncos HQ and most people prefer to go to the more laid back Gold coast city (with the beaches allowing families to make a day of it), Logan is Qlds third biggest city, behind Brisbane and the Gold Coast and ahead of Townsville. That isnt including places like Ipswich or Nthn NSW and Gold Coast Hinterlands and surrounding areas which are both within 1hrs drive and likely to be the source of many fans (whether primary or secondary) especially given that these areas are as true blue rugby league supporters as you can get.

ON top of all that, you have to consider the hate in Brisbane for the Broncos due to the superleague fallout and other factors, which has left people either not supporting any sides, or only atending one or two games a year when their defacto sydney teams come in. An awful lot of these people would support the Gold Coast. Brisbane to Gold Coast is pretty much just one big city now (much like Sydney and Parramatta). If you add in these other areas, Gold Coast is pretty much as big as Adelaide and Perth. Not having a team in this area (whether they finish with the spoon each year, go broke, or do anything else) is pretty much ridiculous.

The Central Coast do , themselves, have quite a decent case. they are similar to Illawarra in size and location and are also very similar to Penrith. All areas which have quality teams and are better off than several of the inner city teams. The problem is that they are too close to too many teams. They will be most people's second team in the area (the Northern Eagles started like this, but pretty much dropped the tag towards the end of the merger). The problem is that by necessity, they will have some very lean years due to the problems of starting a new comp (so will CG and Orcas). Unfortunately, unlike the GC and Orcas their residents can still support their no1 teams (most of their residents will have one they have supported since birth) by driving an hour or two. This choice means that during their lean times, they will struggle to get crowds (creating the bandwagon illusion). This what happened with the Eagles when competive they got great crowds, but after a while they dropped. History has shown us that in Sydney and areas the size of CC generally, they can expect crowds of under 10,000 during these times. I think that the CC, more than the other 2 could benefit from waiting 5 years or more. They need to settle on a name and colours (if its the bears, the bears must relocate now). All local Rep teams should play under those colours and names and they should try to get an affiliation with CC whether they are accepted or not. like GC, it should be a matter of when and not if. As the CC population rises their case can only get stronger. With the amount of RL available to their residents they can only get better, the central coast are not in danger of becoming a soccer city or any other sport, as many have suggested.
 

Knightmare

Coach
Messages
10,716
I thought the game at Carrara was meant to end up a sellout? I got there at a quarter past 3 to be on the safe side, I could've waited till 5 to get there. You can't compare these two games when we had great weather and a lot of promotion for the trial game up here, yet at Gosford it was raining and there was little or no promotion for the Dogs/ Raiders game. (God willing), there'll be great weather in Gosford this weekend and we'll have a better idea of how much the CC wants a team.
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
PARRA_FAN said:
Well the NRL should do a lot to those areas in Adelaide and Perth, cause if we add another NZL it seems like they're continuing to ignore those areas. Ok they dont have a bid like Gold Coast, Wellington, and Central Coast but we've got to improve on Adelaide and Perth, and maybe they will have a bid in years to come.

No, you're not ignoring those areas.

IF they had a co-operative putting together a bid, then for the now they'd be worthy of discussion. They presented nothing to the NRL sub-committee for expansion, so we can't seriously put their interests ahead of those planning for such an occassion. Thats frought with danger of failure.

As a previous poster said, you bring in the Orcas, you'll get your Perth's and Adelaide's readmitted. The Sky New Zealand contract is very handy to the NRL, if you gave them the rights to a second team to televise, their subscriptions would go up, and therefore their next bid to the NRL to retain the rights would double. One of the key resources of funding the NRL has is the sky contract, increasing its exposure in New Zealand will bring forth more money to fund your Adelaide's and Perths.

There's nothing to stop the NRL setting up junior clinics, or taking games to Adelaide and Perth (as the Warriors and Sharks are), but you can't put their case forward ahead of Wellington until such time as a serious proposition from them is put up. If its not planned for, not presented for, they stand no chance of getting a team back.
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
bender said:
PARRA_FAN said:
Why should NZ get another team before Central Coast, Perth and Adelaide?

This is NATIONAL Rugby League, we've got to think about going national before putting another team from New Zealand in.

Perth should get another chance, Adelaide try again, Central Coast for real this time.

Lets put the Gold Coast in first and then go Australia wide. Hell you cant ignore Western Australia, its the 3rd biggest Rugby League state in Oz and I've got the fear of losing it Rugby Union is something is not done about it.
The reason New Zealand get in before Central Coast is because they bring in twice as much money as the other sides. The Auckland Warriors are pretty much responsible for an awfully large amount of payTV revenue (from New Zealand), which would be greatly reduced if they werent there. Bringing in the Orcas, not only sures this up, but it has enormous potential to expand on it, if the Orcas are successful. In fact, if they work out, in 5-10 years, the Warriors and Orcas will probably bring in enough NZTV money to not only pay for themselves, but also for an extra couple of teams. Whether those teams end up being a third kiwi team, a Perth or Adelaide or even a central Coast team, will tell. From a juniors point of view, a second Kiwi team, really doesnt have any problem getting players and could probably but up a team (to current wooden spoon standards) without even drawing from current NRL players. Neither of the others can.

In reality, CC is a gamble though, because the are not a traditional RL area. Gold Coast simply isnt. They are a rugby league town through and through. Maybe not quite as strong as Townsville or Newcastle but certainly the equal of Brisbane or Sydney or Central Coast and ahead of Perth, Adelaide, Wellington, Canberra etc. There case is simple. They are now the 6th Largest City in Australia, behind Sydney, Melbourne, Brisbane, Perth, Adelaide and just ahead of Newcastle. This was not the case when they were last in the competition. They are located in the fastest growing area in Australia (not just Queensland). When you consider that it is more than likely that the vast majority of Logan Residents will also feel that Gold Coast are there team, since they are the closest team to them (or at least equal distance from the Broncos HQ and most people prefer to go to the more laid back Gold coast city (with the beaches allowing families to make a day of it), Logan is Qlds third biggest city, behind Brisbane and the Gold Coast and ahead of Townsville. That isnt including places like Ipswich or Nthn NSW and Gold Coast Hinterlands and surrounding areas which are both within 1hrs drive and likely to be the source of many fans (whether primary or secondary) especially given that these areas are as true blue rugby league supporters as you can get.

ON top of all that, you have to consider the hate in Brisbane for the Broncos due to the superleague fallout and other factors, which has left people either not supporting any sides, or only atending one or two games a year when their defacto sydney teams come in. An awful lot of these people would support the Gold Coast. Brisbane to Gold Coast is pretty much just one big city now (much like Sydney and Parramatta). If you add in these other areas, Gold Coast is pretty much as big as Adelaide and Perth. Not having a team in this area (whether they finish with the spoon each year, go broke, or do anything else) is pretty much ridiculous.

The Central Coast do , themselves, have quite a decent case. they are similar to Illawarra in size and location and are also very similar to Penrith. All areas which have quality teams and are better off than several of the inner city teams. The problem is that they are too close to too many teams. They will be most people's second team in the area (the Northern Eagles started like this, but pretty much dropped the tag towards the end of the merger). The problem is that by necessity, they will have some very lean years due to the problems of starting a new comp (so will CG and Orcas). Unfortunately, unlike the GC and Orcas their residents can still support their no1 teams (most of their residents will have one they have supported since birth) by driving an hour or two. This choice means that during their lean times, they will struggle to get crowds (creating the bandwagon illusion). This what happened with the Eagles when competive they got great crowds, but after a while they dropped. History has shown us that in Sydney and areas the size of CC generally, they can expect crowds of under 10,000 during these times. I think that the CC, more than the other 2 could benefit from waiting 5 years or more. They need to settle on a name and colours (if its the bears, the bears must relocate now). All local Rep teams should play under those colours and names and they should try to get an affiliation with CC whether they are accepted or not. like GC, it should be a matter of when and not if. As the CC population rises their case can only get stronger. With the amount of RL available to their residents they can only get better, the central coast are not in danger of becoming a soccer city or any other sport, as many have suggested.

:clap:

Thats one of the best ever posts I've seen on any forum. World class.
 
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