General Discussion Thread

[Westernised Panther]

Exactly. This is the foundation of fact.

2nd half last night, blues had no field position. All sets started basically from the goal line. Clive Churchill or Dally Messenger would not have been able to turn it around.

.....or the Eighth immortal

 

[franklin2323]

Might as well put my 2 cents in... Cleary definitely had an off game to go with a bad month. He has the potential to be a very dominant half but has had some stage fright the last couple of big games played but has showed the glimpses that he has it. I believe Cleary is the type of half that needs a off the cuff play what’s in front 5/8 to really get his groove on. For all the talk of Cleary failing in origin 1 I would be looking at Keary he is the multiple premiership winner big game player but it was meant to be Clearys team so the onus falls on him for the failure to get the basics done like repeat sets and kicking for for space but forwards need to aim up for that to happen. Cleary is 22 has 100 fg games played a gf and origin, will we be talking about this in 10+ years or will it be looked as his maturing years to be the complete half he has the potential to be.... I’m going with the second option purely on faith and a hunch. He’s young really young for a half most don’t hit there prime until 25 so we got time!

The thing with Keary was it was his debut. He has 3 premierships and a Clive Churchill medal... so has the runs on the board He should be the 1st half picked

 

[franklin2323]

Laurie Daley was obsessed with picking fullbacks in the outside backs rather than specialists and it would seem Freddie is no different.

Dropping Luke Keary is strange even if he wasn’t great in game 1.

Queensland have a great opportunity to win this series and will be difficult to beat now they have confidence and there noses in front.

The Blues forwards will have to be far better in the remaining two games if we are going to come from behind and take out the series.

We had more run metres than QLD... had plenty of chances really no excuse for not getting the win

 

[MTNPanther]

The thing with Keary was it was his debut. He has 3 premierships and a Clive Churchill medal... so has the runs on the board He should be the 1st half picked

Agreed Keary has the runs on the board but didn’t exactly stand up either origin is a beast of its own but was more disappointed he didn’t stand up when Cleary didn’t. Both halves failed unfortunately, if Cleary doesn’t stand up this Wednesday he shouldn’t be in the team for origin 3.
It appears teams are figuring out if you pressure him on his kicks the rest of his game suffers, Freddy and brandy need to get in his head and teach him how to adapt better. I think this would help him a lot in the bigger games.

 

[franklin2323]

Agreed Keary has the runs on the board but didn’t exactly stand up either origin is a beast of its own but was more disappointed he didn’t stand up when Cleary didn’t. Both halves failed unfortunately, if Cleary doesn’t stand up this Wednesday he shouldn’t be in the team for origin 3.
It appears teams are figuring out if you pressure him on his kicks the rest of his game suffers, Freddy and brandy need to get in his head and teach him how to adapt better. I think this would help him a lot in the bigger games.

I think you need atleast a series to come good. The same think happened with Walker last year game him a game then was gone.

It is just predictability more then anything. Good coaches have him worked out and know what is coming... then he gets flustered and goes off his game

 

[The_Frog]

The thing with Keary was it was his debut. He has 3 premierships and a Clive Churchill medal... so has the runs on the board He should be the 1st half picked

This was the major problem. Picking players on form from previous years. Keary has been OK this year but looked to be carrying injury anyway.

 

[franklin2323]

This was the major problem. Picking players on form from previous years. Keary has been OK this year but looked to be carrying injury anyway.

He was still top 5 in Dally M. His side finished 4th it isn't like he struggled this year

 

[Luke Bowden]

By that theory someone like Jake Turbo who can ball play should be half? The 7 should also manage the game to suit the occasion.

Take SOO 1. The conditions with the wind etc made it more a running game. Couldn't throw long passes or Kick.

DCE ran for 163m. As well as 35 tackles and GK both are similar style of players neither are what you would call elite but one can adjust to the conditions better.

He was a late bloomer on the rep scene granted

DCE was playing on a team that was playing better. Running direct, not constantly going sideways when they hadn’t earned the right.

Its really obvious if you actually watch the game.

Again, Cleary didn’t have a great game, but his performance was made to look worse because of the team.

Even Cooks service from dummy half was shit.
Where is your stat for “Poor Pass received from dummy half”....

 

[Aliceinwonderland]

DCE was playing on a team that was playing better. Running direct, not constantly going sideways when they hadn’t earned the right.

Its really obvious if you actually watch the game.

Again, Cleary didn’t have a great game, but his performance was made to look worse because of the team.

Even Cooks service from dummy half was shit.
Where is your stat for “Poor Pass received from dummy half”....

Franklin playing the same of 'clutching at straws'

 

[The_Frog]

He was still top 5 in Dally M. His side finished 4th it isn't like he struggled this year

I agree he earned his place.

 

[franklin2323]

DCE was playing on a team that was playing better. Running direct, not constantly going sideways when they hadn’t earned the right.

Its really obvious if you actually watch the game.

Again, Cleary didn’t have a great game, but his performance was made to look worse because of the team.

Even Cooks service from dummy half was shit.
Where is your stat for “Poor Pass received from dummy half”....

Point 1. We had more run metres then them

Point 2. I am counting all 6 of his SOO games in. There have been games particularly that game in Perth last year where NSW blew QLD away... yet still to get a Try assist, Try or a linebreak

If he wasn't a Panthers player you would be saying the same thing

 

[franklin2323]

Franklin playing the same of 'clutching at straws'

I see the game how it is... Not kiss someone's ass cause they play for the club I support

 

[The_Frog]

Point 2. I am counting all 6 of his SOO games in. There have been games particularly that game in Perth last year where NSW blew QLD away... yet still to get a Try assist, Try or a linebreak

He was injured well before halftime in that game and didn't play the second half but you would be aware of that.

 

[Smug Panther]

Point 1. We had more run metres then them

Point 2. I am counting all 6 of his SOO games in. There have been games particularly that game in Perth last year where NSW blew QLD away... yet still to get a Try assist, Try or a linebreak

If he wasn't a Panthers player you would be saying the same thing

Nath has earned the next 2 games but if he flops he should 100% go

 

[murraymob]

I don’t think Fittler even factored in that players may not have played for several weeks and it show
Both guys picked in the centers don’t even play there
No flak has come fittlers way no suprise

 

[Luke Bowden]

Point 1. We had more run metres then them

Point 2. I am counting all 6 of his SOO games in. There have been games particularly that game in Perth last year where NSW blew QLD away... yet still to get a Try assist, Try or a linebreak

If he wasn't a Panthers player you would be saying the same thing

I’ve already explained how poor it is to judge a game by stats. I even gave you examples of how it is floored. Particularly the ones you are picking.

Nathan hasn’t had a fair shot at being the dominant player in the origin team. Hopefully he does next week and I’m sure he will play like he did for the entire season.

If you are going to rely on your numbers, you need to back that up by saying what you want from him.

Personally, I think he needs to keep the attack a lot straighter, as they did in the first half (I’m willing to bet that’s where we got most of our run metres). Two many chiefs in the second half, which led to us going sideways too much.

I’m happy to listen to your point of view, you may even convince me your right, but just quoting meaning less numbers, that won’t do.

for me, Cleary is the best half back in the country and will no doubt show that next Wednesday. I’m sure Walker will stay out of his way and let him steer the ship home.

see if you can change my mind.

 

[Kilkenny]

I’ve already explained how poor it is to judge a game by stats. I even gave you examples of how it is floored. Particularly the ones you are picking.

Nathan hasn’t had a fair shot at being the dominant player in the origin team. Hopefully he does next week and I’m sure he will play like he did for the entire season.

If you are going to rely on your numbers, you need to back that up by saying what you want from him.

Personally, I think he needs to keep the attack a lot straighter, as they did in the first half (I’m willing to bet that’s where we got most of our run metres). Two many chiefs in the second half, which led to us going sideways too much.

I’m happy to listen to your point of view, you may even convince me your right, but just quoting meaning less numbers, that won’t do.

for me, Cleary is the best half back in the country and will no doubt show that next Wednesday. I’m sure Walker will stay out of his way and let him steer the ship home.

see if you can change my mind.

I agree raw stats don’t give the full picture, they are a guide, a useful tool in analysing a game but using stats in isolation is highly flawed.

 

[Jane Murray]

I see the game how it is... Not kiss someone's ass cause they play for the club I support

Your arrogance is astounding.

 

[franklin2323]

Nath has earned the next 2 games but if he flops he should 100% go

3rd series in. You'd think by this stage he can handle the big stage

 

[franklin2323]

I’ve already explained how poor it is to judge a game by stats. I even gave you examples of how it is floored. Particularly the ones you are picking.

Nathan hasn’t had a fair shot at being the dominant player in the origin team. Hopefully he does next week and I’m sure he will play like he did for the entire season.

If you are going to rely on your numbers, you need to back that up by saying what you want from him.

Personally, I think he needs to keep the attack a lot straighter, as they did in the first half (I’m willing to bet that’s where we got most of our run metres). Two many chiefs in the second half, which led to us going sideways too much.

I’m happy to listen to your point of view, you may even convince me your right, but just quoting meaning less numbers, that won’t do.

for me, Cleary is the best half back in the country and will no doubt show that next Wednesday. I’m sure Walker will stay out of his way and let him steer the ship home.

see if you can change my mind.

The issue is with Panthers players they can do no wrong in some fans minds but I will take a try.

He was the best halfback for most of the year then he reverted back to the old self of been too predictable.

Watch the 2nd half of Origin again and the GF. Every kick was a bomb and hope it works instead of what works rolling the ball into the ingoals. If you can't look at stats for that then how do you judge it?

The Try assist stat alone wouldn't be an issue if he was taking the line on himself. If you can't use Metres gained and line breaks then how do you judge it?

You mentioned the JAC tries as him having an involvement in a try but not showing on stats? It went through 2 sets of hands after him. Most backs and even some forwards can do a draw and pass.

What you want to see is the half do a move on the blindside or a grubber and chase or something to play what you see. Not just be robotic and do what is in the game plan