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John Grant quits....

Stormwarrior82

Juniors
Messages
1,036
Everyone on hear bags news ltd and the media but then eats it up and believes it at the same time. Now yes some of Kent’s statements are true. Crowds aren’t amazing when comparing to afl. Player numbers stagnated. But the preface of his article is wrong. He just constantly bags the Nrl. Never says a good thing about it.

The Nrl went from a $550mil tv deal to over $1bil. That equates to $200 mil at year for 5yrs. The clubs/states funding went from roughly $100mil to $200 mil,doubled!! Where’s the bagging of the greedy clubs? Yes there is non-broadcast revenue but that went from $80 mil(2012) to $144mil in 2016. That’s where the money went. And that’s where the money is going in the next tv deal. For me a simple look at the Nrls annual report shows that the money is being spent on normal things. Now everyone can go, I wouldn’t spend that much here or there, but it is all within reasonable spending I believe.

Now I don’t run a billion dollar company but if part of the funding (Rlpa deal) was related to increased forecast spending I would run the company at a loss too. Just saying.
 

Stormwarrior82

Juniors
Messages
1,036
Something that has just become the norm is not trusting our ceo or commission. Super league wrecked it for everyone. Since then, every ceo we had was pushing sh!t up hill. It eroded confidence and trust in the hierarchy. Gallops tenure didn’t help either. In 2012 when smith walked in and the commission was set up that was when people should of jumped on the gravy train. Instead, like they have in the past they got to the train and put there hand out. And there still doing it. The easy decisions are made harder by self-interested owners, clubs, players and media. Soon everyone has a seat at the table and any decision made will have the fingerprints of everyone. That will make it harder to strangle the Nrl in the future.
 
Messages
2,857
Heard rumblings recently of us snatching Jamie Warburtton from the VASC,Australia's 4th biggest sport

Well today he's resigned,is he coming to the NRL
 

taipan

Referee
Messages
22,500
As I've stated all along.Whilst TV deals increased each time so did expenditure most genuine, some complete waste.Is Kent aware of inflation and heard of the CPI Index?
TV deals done badly or negotiated with hands tied behind ones back,
Costs jumped for players' wages and as well as other aspects admin(with expensive consultants),insurance costs,D/O costs ,football dept costsqlayers' super doesn't stand still.
Even SOO players money went to $30,000 per game.Kangaroos to $20,000.
Waste did occur with $750,000 going toward the SFS study for a new stadium.With no refund.
Kent got it right about expensive consultants.I'll give him on point.He got it right about nothing to show asset wise.

Waste occured with legals costs due to costs associated with Parramatta,Sharks and underlining the Knights/Titans and assisting the Tigers and Dragons .Integrity units costs money, the Digital Dept ditto.
One can argue whether its worthwhile ,but that's where a hell of a lot went.
Is Kent that naive not to understand or is he still full of acid because Gallop got flicked?

And Kent and his cohorts from News completely ignore the crap scheduling,where crowds drop substantially,revenue drops also.Friday 6pm is a News baby,to which Grant & Co got reamed.

Never once have I heard or read from News hacks,that scheduling played a big part in crowd drops.Why is this so? Too close for comfort perhaps?

I pose the other question to Kent and Slothfield,how much damage does their continual negative NRL reporting do for the game?You don''t see it in the AFL, anywhere near the extent.
Massoud when he worked for that mob,as well as Burbs didn't help either.

A classic example, a non story about Ferguson this week, due to Carter carrying on like a loon.Made the headlines FFS.Fair crack,a player breaks wind and News Ltd hacks,will be there to bottle it for publicity.
 

Hello, I'm The Doctor

First Grade
Messages
9,124
Who to blame for the quagmire that rugby league finds itself in right now? John Grant? David Smith? Todd Greenberg?

PAul Kent is not the only one to be making criticisms. Gus Gould was making the comments on his podcast two months ago suggesting that people who had the power have wasted millions in flawed strategys and now want to cling on to power.

It never happened and John Grant was shown the door. Maybe David Gallop wasn't so bad huh?

I use the word quagmire, but not a go at the game, fans, or the players. More the fact league is not reaching for the stars in terms popularity, well spent resources, and expansion via its administration.

Five years and a billion dollars later rugby league is broke, writes Paul Kent



FIVE years and a billion dollars later rugby league is broke.

Take a look at that figure again: $1,000,000,000. That is a thousand cheques for $1 million each, gone in the wind.

Almost without notice October 31 looms, marking the end of the famous broadcast deal five years ago where ARL Commissioner John Grant claimed, “For our game it is the greatest deal ever done.”

The first billion dollar deal was the stake in the ground for the new commission and rugby league’s new era.

“The cash is useful in providing funding to grow our game from the grassroots to the elite level,” Grant said.

By then David Gallop had gone because he was seen as “reactive rather than proactive” — a laughable claim in light of current administration — and the banker, Dave Smith, would soon be brought in to stimulate the game’s growth and wealth.


CEO Todd Greenberg with John Grant, Chairman of the ARL Commission. pic Mark Evans

Eyebrows turned up within the clubs early on when the Commission, with their big business brains, told them they were going to show them how to make money.

Then the League went on a reckless spend and squandered millions on high-priced consultants and bad ideas.

And if you check the receipts there is little to show.

Crowds have gone down, television ratings on Channel Nine are down, memberships have risen (but come from a low base and are well down on the 400,000 the NRL strived for as part of its 2012 strategic plan) and, most of all, most significantly of all, less people play rugby league than played five years ago.

Somehow, the game is in decline. Despite an agenda to build the game’s wealth the NRL has no assets to speak of except the long-term lease of League Central, a building on SCG Trust land.

This week 25 NRL staff got sacked, 10 weeks before Christmas, as chief executive Todd Greenberg tries to rein in costs.

The banks recently knocked back the NRL’s application for a $30 million bridging loan. The league dismissed the need for a loan as nothing more than the normal running of business, scoffing at us knuckleheads in rugby league who got worried they needed cash.

In their scoffing, though, they failed to acknowledge or disclose that the first step towards bankruptcy for any business is a cash flow problem.

Worse, why didn’t the banks consider the NRL a safe investment? The AFL got a similar loan, but then the AFL has assets.

So the cash shortage — $1 billion all spent — continues.

They have discussed various contingency plans to pay their way.

The NSW and Queensland Rugby Leagues have been told they will get no funding for their state competition, which takes in under-20s for the first time next season, until the third quarter next year.

Put simply, for the first half of next year the state bodies will fund the NRL’s commitment to them.

The more you look at it the clearer it is the NRL was given a golden window, five years and a billion dollars, and blew it.

The Australian Financial Review reported this week that Channel Ten’s equity value was worth between negative $529.2 million and negative $543.7 million.

In August, Channel 7 reported a $745 million loss with Seven chief executive Tim Worner warning sports rights had reached a “tipping point”.

“Given changes in the market, price rises are not sustainable,” he said.

So future broadcast deals might not be as rosy as the one just ending or the one about to begin.

As the Rugby League Players Association negotiates the next Collective Bargaining Agreement with an under pressure NRL — for all the reasons stated here — there is a genuine possibility this era of rugby league player will earn more than the next.

Especially if the salary cap is tied into total revenue.

It’s good deal for the senior players driving this deal. Not so much for the young players coming through.

At the same time the CBA is being negotiated the game has still not finalised its pathways program, its club funding agreement or, most importantly, implemented the promised constitutional change.

Australian Rugby League Commission Chairman John Grant and NRL CEO Todd Greenberg. Picture: Brett Costello

Come November 1 the NRL moves into the next funding stage of its broadcast deal, this time $1.9 billion over five years.

Count it, that’s $1,900,000,000. An extra $900 million. Where is there any confidence the game will spend it wisely?

Earlier this year the NRL took me through its figures.

There is no doubt Greenberg is driving a lot of cost-saving as the game goes forward and tries to salvage years of poor spending.

The NRL has 40 different pie charts that can tell you where the money has been spent and where the money is going.

Yet nowhere does it say if the money has been well spent.

Most concerning was that come the 2022 season, the last of the current TV deal, the NRL is already budgeting to lose about $20 million that season.

It was seen as a normal loss.

I asked why the NRL, given it knows about 80 per cent of its projected budget, which few business can reliably know, can still run at a loss in five years.

“Inflation,” I got told.


Okay, but why couldn’t they budget for that, I asked.

“You don’t understand,” they said, “the deal is locked in but costs go up every year.”

Now, I am a simple man who runs nothing more serious than a household budget, and not always well at that.

But I asked again why they could not factor inflation in so the game could run at a profit, instead of the loss already anticipated now.

There was a brief pause.

“Well that’s one way to do it,” they said.

All the game owns is the hope and goodwill of its public.

Hopefully it is enough.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...t/news-story/f0658ac2a0c17987c293455d09cae3af

"Whose fault: Greenburg, Grant or Smith?"

Ever consider it might have been the clubs pissing away the money and demanding more?

Or the players threatenig to strike if they didnt get those extra $millions?

No, of course it is the ARLCs fault. They are the only ones not focused on self interest and taking whatever yey can for themselves. Obviously THEY are te badguys here...
 

Spot On

Coach
Messages
13,902
Everyone on hear bags news ltd and the media but then eats it up and believes it at the same time. Now yes some of Kent’s statements are true. Crowds aren’t amazing when comparing to afl. Player numbers stagnated. But the preface of his article is wrong. He just constantly bags the Nrl. Never says a good thing about it.

The Nrl went from a $550mil tv deal to over $1bil. That equates to $200 mil at year for 5yrs. The clubs/states funding went from roughly $100mil to $200 mil,doubled!! Where’s the bagging of the greedy clubs? Yes there is non-broadcast revenue but that went from $80 mil(2012) to $144mil in 2016. That’s where the money went. And that’s where the money is going in the next tv deal. For me a simple look at the Nrls annual report shows that the money is being spent on normal things. Now everyone can go, I wouldn’t spend that much here or there, but it is all within reasonable spending I believe.

Now I don’t run a billion dollar company but if part of the funding (Rlpa deal) was related to increased forecast spending I would run the company at a loss too. Just saying.


Don't get too excited over the improved figures since Gallop departed.

League was getting f**k all for the rights for years - screwed over year after year after year.

Finally getting decent coin but I think the NRL is up against to to hold onto the big $$$ next time round.
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
69,800
NRL revenue has increased wayyyyy above CPI and wayyyyy above increases to clubs and players. Soo payments went up, ticket prices went through the roof and profits grew massively.

Since game became independent in 2012 it has spent somewhere in the region of $1.5billion. What we needed up with? More girls playing the game, a bunker, decent membership growth and some rich nrl employees.
No expansion
financially secure clubs not
Stagnant crowds
Stagnant tv audiences
Stagnant playing numbers

Let's hope the $2.5 bill plus the nrl will spend over the next 5 years reaps some more favourable outcomes.
 

Stallion

First Grade
Messages
7,467
NRL revenue has increased wayyyyy above CPI and wayyyyy above increases to clubs and players. Soo payments went up, ticket prices went through the roof and profits grew massively.

Since game became independent in 2012 it has spent somewhere in the region of $1.5billion. What we needed up with? More girls playing the game, a bunker, decent membership growth and some rich nrl employees.
No expansion
financially secure clubs not
Stagnant crowds
Stagnant tv audiences
Stagnant playing numbers

Let's hope the $2.5 bill plus the nrl will spend over the next 5 years reaps some more favourable outcomes.

Actually significantly reduced player numbers when taking females and the not so rugby league like game of touch out of the sums.Its been a waste of alot of money. Poorly targeted spending to the nth degree. Along with poor administrators in various parts of the code at NRL club, local district and development levels. A real waste!
 

El Diablo

Post Whore
Messages
94,107
get
 

Hello, I'm The Doctor

First Grade
Messages
9,124
I wonder what position the NRL would have James Warburton fill. Todd Greenberg has only been at his post for a year. Peter Beattie has just filled John Grant position. "Future leader" could mean anything.


SHOOSH IV

V8 Supercars boss James Warburton is a name that continues to be whispered in rugby league circles as a future leader of the NRL.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...s/news-story/fa2f94c0d05a789e433efb8357274a20

I dont waant ANYONE put there by the clubs; if they position is dependent on keeping the clubs happy, they will just be a puppet for Gus, Nick and the rest...

Having said that, this guys name has been floating around since 2012, so he must have something special.

There is a spot representing the club bosses on the Commission yet to be filled, and it wouldnt surprise me at all if they wanted them to work full time as a Chairman-In-Exile. JW might be headed for that...
 

Hello, I'm The Doctor

First Grade
Messages
9,124
I hate Murdoch and Newslimited as much as the next guy. But the criticisms in the article have been matched up with what Gus Gould said on his podcast a couple of months ago. Gould is no fan of Newslimited either, and he's been scathing about some criticisms it has made about him over the years.

And did Gus, Panthers club boss, portion any blame on the clubs or is it ALL the big, bad ARLCs fault?

I don't think David Gallop was great, it's just what has transpired currently makes Gallop look better then it should. And yeah I agree Gallop was a newslimited lackey.

Face the facts the commission hasn't delivered what it was set out to do, and there is no getting around it. John Grant has floated pie in the sky ideas of getting extra cash flow by appealing to international markets in USA and China while Sydney crowds are dwindling. Oh please............

Gallop is criticised for not having vision, JGrant is criticised for being too ambition....
 

taipan

Referee
Messages
22,500
NRL revenue has increased wayyyyy above CPI and wayyyyy above increases to clubs and players. Soo payments went up, ticket prices went through the roof and profits grew massively.

Since game became independent in 2012 it has spent somewhere in the region of $1.5billion. What we needed up with? More girls playing the game, a bunker, decent membership growth and some rich nrl employees.
No expansion
financially secure clubs not
Stagnant crowds
Stagnant tv audiences
Stagnant playing numbers

Let's hope the $2.5 bill plus the nrl will spend over the next 5 years reaps some more favourable outcomes.

That's one side of the equation, but there are other sides also.And the Commission has to bear some of the blame.
Why then was the game getting screwed each time on TV deals prior to 2012,which if had been done properly given the code more money to either bank of play with?
Why prior to 2012 was there no attempt at lobbying Govt to get Sydney stadiums and Parra rebuilt?Yet the fumblers got Govt monies.
Expenses for players wages /SOOTests went up well above CPI,not just the revenue side.No digital dept.or bunker involved prior.No integrity unit either.I'd suggest from 2018 most clubs will be financially secure.
How much was wasted on high flying consultants when Smith carried on like he was in the money world of banking.$600-700,000 pa for some.
How much was wasted on keeping the Knights and Titans from going under.Money lent to Tigers and Dragons.
How much on legals for Parramatta/Sharks.Who recoups the loss on Internationals at Campbelltown this year.
Doubling the number of on field refs, another cost.
Admin can take the blame,so can clubs, so can players who carry on like loons off the field.So can TV stations who controlled a sh*t scheduling .How about a constant negative print media, and the home of rl ch9,who pumps AFL. Player greed? Clubs badly run?

And the AFL expansion via the Lions and Suns has been a costly ,and stagnating exercise exercise,As has the expansion of the Force into WA.TV audiences for AFL in NSW and Old have stagnated at a very low level. You can pin point negatives in every code.The A league to date has stagnant crowd numbers and ditto TV ratings.
Finger pointing is useless ,everyone in the game needs to sit back and examine the part they played in getting the code to the positionit is to date.And get of their a"ses and do something about it.
 

BuffaloRules

Coach
Messages
15,548
Gallop was a dope who either deliberately or through his incompetence repeatedly sold the game to the TV networks on the cheap....

However, one thing in his favour is that he ran the game on the smell of an oily rag... ( I suppose through necessity..)

Then our old mate Smith got on board just as the first Billion dollar TV deal rolled in, and he certainly didn't waste much time bringing in the caviar and champagne lifestyle that he must have grown accustomed to in his prior banking life... Lavish season launches, hiring a gazillion new staff, throwing a fortune at consultants to tell him what he wanted to hear, and the saddest part was he still got taken for a ride by Gyngell and turned Murdoch feral for the last deal..

Its hard to imagine any other major sport having worse management over the past 20 years...
 
Messages
14,840
Gallop was a dope who either deliberately or through his incompetence repeatedly sold the game to the TV networks on the cheap....

However, one thing in his favour is that he ran the game on the smell of an oily rag... ( I suppose through necessity..)

Then our old mate Smith got on board just as the first Billion dollar TV deal rolled in, and he certainly didn't waste much time bringing in the caviar and champagne lifestyle that he must have grown accustomed to in his prior banking life... Lavish season launches, hiring a gazillion new staff, throwing a fortune at consultants to tell him what he wanted to hear, and the saddest part was he still got taken for a ride by Gyngell and turned Murdoch feral for the last deal..

Its hard to imagine any other major sport having worse management over the past 20 years...

Gallop was a News puppet, that was definitely deliberate. He was only there to maximise value for Murdoch.
 
Messages
14,840
As I've stated all along.Whilst TV deals increased each time so did expenditure most genuine, some complete waste.Is Kent aware of inflation and heard of the CPI Index?
TV deals done badly or negotiated with hands tied behind ones back,
Costs jumped for players' wages and as well as other aspects admin(with expensive consultants),insurance costs,D/O costs ,football dept costsqlayers' super doesn't stand still.
Even SOO players money went to $30,000 per game.Kangaroos to $20,000.
Waste did occur with $750,000 going toward the SFS study for a new stadium.With no refund.
Kent got it right about expensive consultants.I'll give him on point.He got it right about nothing to show asset wise.

Waste occured with legals costs due to costs associated with Parramatta,Sharks and underlining the Knights/Titans and assisting the Tigers and Dragons .Integrity units costs money, the Digital Dept ditto.
One can argue whether its worthwhile ,but that's where a hell of a lot went.
Is Kent that naive not to understand or is he still full of acid because Gallop got flicked?

And Kent and his cohorts from News completely ignore the crap scheduling,where crowds drop substantially,revenue drops also.Friday 6pm is a News baby,to which Grant & Co got reamed.

Never once have I heard or read from News hacks,that scheduling played a big part in crowd drops.Why is this so? Too close for comfort perhaps?

I pose the other question to Kent and Slothfield,how much damage does their continual negative NRL reporting do for the game?You don''t see it in the AFL, anywhere near the extent.
Massoud when he worked for that mob,as well as Burbs didn't help either.

A classic example, a non story about Ferguson this week, due to Carter carrying on like a loon.Made the headlines FFS.Fair crack,a player breaks wind and News Ltd hacks,will be there to bottle it for publicity.

Can't speak for the Saints, but pretty certain that Wests have paid back their debts.

They'll only be up for the interim operating costs of Newcastle and Gold Coast, which I am sure they'll recoup most from the sale of both entities. Didn't they take over both franchises virtually gratis?
 

taipan

Referee
Messages
22,500
Can't speak for the Saints, but pretty certain that Wests have paid back their debts.

They'll only be up for the interim operating costs of Newcastle and Gold Coast, which I am sure they'll recoup most from the sale of both entities. Didn't they take over both franchises virtually gratis?

Hope they(Tigers) have.
My understanding they(ARLC) will get little extra from West Newcastle in Knight's purchase.Reason being
basically they were the one decent bidder in the area, and because they are prepared to pay to for a Centre of Excellence and put money into the juniors,to offset paying more for the sale.
They got the 2 franchises virtually gratis but part from normal club grants, football club expenditure marketing, debt repayments etc was at the NRL's expense.IOW an extra cost burden

Hopefully the Titans sale will give the ARLC some decent dosh
 
Messages
14,840
Hope they(Tigers) have.
My understanding they(ARLC) will get little extra from West Newcastle in Knight's purchase.Reason being
basically they were the one decent bidder in the area, and because they are prepared to pay to for a Centre of Excellence and put money into the juniors,to offset paying more for the sale.
They got the 2 franchises virtually gratis but part from normal club grants, football club expenditure marketing, debt repayments etc was at the NRL's expense.IOW an extra cost burden

Hopefully the Titans sale will give the ARLC some decent dosh

Actually I think Wests have because the Wests side of the JV took control in return for paying back Balmain's half of the debt.

Again, can't speak for the Saints, I assume they're in the process of repaying it.

OK, I wasn't certain how the Newcastle sale was structured. Even if they did the same with the Gold Coast you'd imagine that they wouldn't have lost much except for the operational losses that exceeded the club grant. We wouldn't be talking millions upon millions.
 

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