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Johns vs Thurston

Who is better Thurston or Johns?

  • Thurston

    Votes: 47 25.7%
  • Joey

    Votes: 136 74.3%

  • Total voters
    183

T.S Quint

Coach
Messages
14,975
so your argument is that Johns was better because he was more versatile?

What a stupid argument.

If that's the case, why aren't Alan Wilson and Luke Lewis Immortals?

Because neither of them have been the best in any position.
Johns was the best halfback of his time (or any time some will argue), plus he was good enough in another position to be able to play there at a Representative level.

If you don't think that counts for anything, then you're crazy.
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
Johns. He led Newcastle to the holy grail. Twice. Thurston has had some very ordinary years with the Cowboys. And his sole premiership was as a late replacement in an interchange role.

Johns is a significantly better defender than Thurston. There's times the bloke is not much better than a turnstyle. I think people overrate the 'gutsy' side of his defence because they know he's generally not expected to make a decisive tackle, and when he does, there's much fapping. They also talk of his commitment in defence, often his scrambling tackles are off the back of an initial miss by him.

I'd say Johns had a more creative kicking game, and he made a lot of opportunities from something instinctive and most times he went to that type of trick play, it was executed brilliantly.

I think rugby league has this real 'recency' bias to it. In the last era Lockyer at one was rated by some as the greatest ever. Then Johns. Buderus the greatest hooker of all time. Thurston here is the best of the bunch in this era so typically the media faps the same praise as they did on the previous eras holy grail of playmakers. I find it cringeworthy often that guys like Daley, Sterling, Meninga are often quickly forgotten and the flavour of the day is touted as the best of all time. Obviously, there were more greats before that era as well.
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
70,867
Moron. By that logic any legal drugs used to help mental health issues are performance enhancing drugs.

Recreational drugs helped him relax in the way a beer or a smoke helped players in Meninga's day.

Haha you calling someone a moron, classic.

You seem to be missing the point what he took was illegal by law and banned substances by the league. Cigs and booze (or anti depressants) are not.
 

DiegoNT

First Grade
Messages
9,378
Nobody ever rated Buds the greatest hooker of all time. Nobody

There was a time from about 01-06 when he was the Australian hooker, when many commentators were asking if he was the greatest hooker of all time. A perfect example of the over hype still active players get. His was great hooker though
 

DiegoNT

First Grade
Messages
9,378
Haha you calling someone a moron, classic.

You seem to be missing the point what he took was illegal by law and banned substances by the league. Cigs and booze (or anti depressants) are not.

Yes it's illegal, but it had nothing to do with his on field performance. Ecstasy would only make you a worse player and having a drug habit would of made his life harder not easer. Yes his a 'drug user' but people who label him a 'drug cheat' have no idea
 
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BunniesMan

Immortal
Messages
33,738
Haha you calling someone a moron, classic.

You seem to be missing the point what he took was illegal by law and banned substances by the league. Cigs and booze (or anti depressants) are not.

Yes it's illegal but it's effect on performance is no difference to a beer, a smoke or a prescription drug. It is not performance enhancing by any reasonable definition.
 

DiegoNT

First Grade
Messages
9,378
Off field dramas shouldn't come into it, the difference between johns and a lot other great players is that johns got caught.
 

Iafeta

Referee
Messages
24,357
Nobody ever rated Buds the greatest hooker of all time. Nobody

You must have had cotton buds in your ears for about 5 years. The fapping going on was enormous. That said, the same fapping occurs with Cameron Smith like it did with Steve Walters and Ben Elias. Its a generational thing. If you play 10 games for Australia you are regarded by that generations media as the greatest of all time in your position.
 

perverse

Referee
Messages
26,753
You must have had cotton buds in your ears for about 5 years. The fapping going on was enormous. That said, the same fapping occurs with Cameron Smith like it did with Steve Walters and Ben Elias. Its a generational thing. If you play 10 games for Australia you are regarded by that generations media as the greatest of all time in your position.

To be fair... the Cowboys wouldn't know a great hooker even if they brought one through to first grade themselves. Oh... wait...
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
70,867
Yes it's illegal, but it had nothing to do with his on field performance. Ecstasy would only make you a worse player and having a drug habit would of made his life harder not easer. Yes his a 'drug user' but people who label him a 'drug cheat' have no idea

It may not have made him run faster or tackle harder but he admitted he took it to deal with game day pressures and it helped him psychologically cope with playing. Sure booze can do the same but he didn't use booze, he used illegal banned drugs. Did it help his performance? Well according to him yes it did. Without it maybe he is more nervous on game day, maybe he over thinks his game, maybe he isn't as cool under pressure. Having your head right is just as important as having your body right at that level.

That aside sterlo, roger millward and John's were the three 7's who were incredible to watch, I am struggling to think of a centre on par with Menninga that I have watched in my 35 years of following RL. That's what makes him ahead IMO. Not that he was a more influential player but that he was without peer.
 
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madunit

Super Moderator
Staff member
Messages
62,358
Because neither of them have been the best in any position.
Johns was the best halfback of his time (or any time some will argue), plus he was good enough in another position to be able to play there at a Representative level.

If you don't think that counts for anything, then you're crazy.

You should pick an angle and stick with it.

Why bang on about his versatility and then come out with this?
 

Craig Johnston

First Grade
Messages
5,396
It may not have made him run faster or tackle harder but he admitted he took it to deal with game day pressures and it helped him psychologically cope with playing. Sure booze can do the same but he didn't use booze, he used illegal banned drugs. Did it help his performance? Well according to him yes it did. Without it maybe he is more nervous on game day, maybe he over thinks his game, maybe he isn't as cool under pressure. Having your head right is just as important as having your body right at that level.

That aside sterlo, roger millward and John's were the three 7's who were incredible to watch, I am struggling to think of a centre on par with Menninga that I have watched in my 35 years of following RL. That's what makes him ahead IMO. Not that he was a more influential player but that he was without peer.

No different to taking a head ache tablet, it doesn't IMPROVE ones ability, if just enables them to play at a level that is expected
 

Perth Red

Post Whore
Messages
70,867
Headache tablets are not banned illegal substances lol. There's plenty of potions and lotions that are legal/not banned that help build muscle mass. Doesnt mean taking a banned peptide or steroid is ok as there are legal alternatives.
 

Craig Johnston

First Grade
Messages
5,396
Headache tablets are not banned illegal substances lol. There's plenty of potions and lotions that are legal/not banned that help build muscle mass. Doesnt mean taking a banned peptide or steroid is ok as there are legal alternatives.

He didn't take them "in competition" though he took them post match and then out of system next day, the only thing that makes him is a rec drug user
 

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