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dannyt

Coach
Messages
14,491
About the possible draft - if I remember correctly, the NRL tried to bring in a draft quite a few years ago. The RLPA took the NRL to court, arguing that it was a "restraint of trade", and the court ruled in favour of the RLPA. The AFL draft works because neither the clubs or the players have objected to it.
Correct. The player at the centre of the court case was Terry Hill. If anyone objected to the draft in the ARL, the precedent has been set and the draft would be thrown out.
 

dannyt

Coach
Messages
14,491
I actually have no idea , but Ive always wondered about that
Maybe its that there clubs agreed to the draft but NRL clubs didnt ??

maybe theres a good for nothing lawyer on the forum to explain !!! ;)

as others have mentioned , the salary cap should be secondary and a points system should be a primary system with a panel (from all clubs) score players based on skill, reps, SOO etc BUT you get serious discounts if they are over 10 yrs at club , or a 1 club player or they are your junior product.
It would immediately stop these clubs paying unders with big third party deals or brown paper bags to keep these players at a club loaded with stars ie The Rorters

I also think that juniors should be paid transfer fees from other clubs as the original club has spent a lot of time and money on that kid and should be compensated
The points system would be great, but it would be disadvantageous to teams such as the rorters.

In other words, absolutely no chance of becoming reality.
 

Trifili13

Juniors
Messages
1,136
Well, yes, but I've been supporting St George too long to have that kind of "good history".

Off the top of my head:
-First Sydney team to be beaten in a GF by a non-Sydney team
-First team to lose a GF to a team that came fifth
-First team to lose a GF on a penalty try
-First minor premier to be eliminated after 2 consecutive losses under the McIntyre system (2009)
While that's an "impressive" list of firsts that our club holds, Balmain are the first Sydney team to lose to a non-Sydney team when Canberra beat them in 1989. We are however the first Sydney team to lose to an interstate team in a GF, so we can add that to our achievement of firsts. Or maybe that doesn't count like tries from kicks don't count?
 

dannyt

Coach
Messages
14,491
While that's an "impressive" list of firsts that our club holds, Balmain are the first Sydney team to lose to a non-Sydney team when Canberra beat them in 1989. We are however the first Sydney team to lose to an interstate team in a GF, so we can add that to our achievement of firsts. Or maybe that doesn't count like tries from kicks don't count?
Ah yes, of course. Thanks for the correction, but for some reason, it doesn't make me feel better.

Tries from kicks only count if the field was 98 m long and you're 85 minutes from a GF.
 

Dragon David

First Grade
Messages
9,323
Why is a draft system illegal in the NRL but legal in the AFL ???
Hi justa.

There are lots of things on the net to answer your query. Too much stuff that I haven't been able to spend time to read and digest.

Generally involves the restraint of trade and challenges but this is my simplistic view. The following from the Roar is one article that defines a bigger picture.

There is also this from Zero Tackle giving a case on how the draft could work in the NRL:
And another:
And this:

Enjoy reading when you have the time mate!
 

justadragon

Bench
Messages
4,103
Hi justa.

There are lots of things on the net to answer your query. Too much stuff that I haven't been able to spend time to read and digest.

Generally involves the restraint of trade and challenges but this is my simplistic view. The following from the Roar is one article that defines a bigger picture.

There is also this from Zero Tackle giving a case on how the draft could work in the NRL:
And another:
And this:

Enjoy reading when you have the time mate!
Thanks Dave, I'll try and enjoy it :))
 

Ghostrider22

Juniors
Messages
559
About the possible draft - if I remember correctly, the NRL tried to bring in a draft quite a few years ago. The RLPA took the NRL to court, arguing that it was a "restraint of trade", and the court ruled in favour of the RLPA. The AFL draft works because neither the clubs or the players have objected to it.
Dennis Tutty was the first and Terry Hill was the second, as you stated a restriction of trade. Again the structure of the NRL is flawed, a 30 man roster when in fact it’s a 17 man team every week, you really need 40 man roster. The AFL is light years ahead in the draft, more players play it now. And it works, there are so many restrictions placed on a team to use junior players. Roosters are allowed cause they were allowed by the NRL. The teams today just don’t have the players. Penrith and Parramatta have the largest juniors and always had. Brisbane had a whole state, Melbourne manufactured. To be honest it’s a never ending story and unfortunately there won’t be any changes occurring.
 

dannyt

Coach
Messages
14,491
Dennis Tutty was the first and Terry Hill was the second, as you stated a restriction of trade. Again the structure of the NRL is flawed, a 30 man roster when in fact it’s a 17 man team every week, you really need 40 man roster. The AFL is light years ahead in the draft, more players play it now. And it works, there are so many restrictions placed on a team to use junior players. Roosters are allowed cause they were allowed by the NRL. The teams today just don’t have the players. Penrith and Parramatta have the largest juniors and always had. Brisbane had a whole state, Melbourne manufactured. To be honest it’s a never ending story and unfortunately there won’t be any changes occurring.
Tutty and Hill were both both types of restraint of trade, but different.

In Tutty's case, the rule back then (60s-70s) was a club could prevent any professional player who had played in one of its teams from playing with any other club, even if the player no longer played for the retaining club (source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Tutty). Wow- how weird is that???

In Hill's case, it was the concept of the player effectively had no say in where they would play (source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Hill)
 

Ghostrider22

Juniors
Messages
559
Tutty and Hill were both both types of restraint of trade, but different.

In Tutty's case, the rule back then (60s-70s) was a club could prevent any professional player who had played in one of its teams from playing with any other club, even if the player no longer played for the retaining club (source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dennis_Tutty). Wow- how weird is that???

In Hill's case, it was the concept of the player effectively had no say in where they would play (source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Terry_Hill)
I know Dannyt
 

shiloh dc

Juniors
Messages
465
While that's an "impressive" list of firsts that our club holds, Balmain are the first Sydney team to lose to a non-Sydney team when Canberra beat them in 1989. We are however the first Sydney team to lose to an interstate team in a GF, so we can add that to our achievement of firsts. Or maybe that doesn't count like tries from kicks don't count?
We were the first team to lose to the Western Reds. I suspect the NRL will want the Northern Reds to play their opening weekend game at home and I dread it will be against us. I just couldn't handle Wayne doing the dancing jig in the dressing sheds post match.
 

justadragon

Bench
Messages
4,103
Hi justa.

There are lots of things on the net to answer your query. Too much stuff that I haven't been able to spend time to read and digest.

Generally involves the restraint of trade and challenges but this is my simplistic view. The following from the Roar is one article that defines a bigger picture.

There is also this from Zero Tackle giving a case on how the draft could work in the NRL:
And another:
And this:

Enjoy reading when you have the time mate!
Hi Dave, I did manage to read most of the articles, now the one in the ROAR explains it best and I think if you read it again, this time the NRL would be perfectly justified to bring in a draft. We virtually have a 2 tier comp, poaching of youngsters to the more successful clubs etc. I really think getting a draft proposal for the NRL of today would solve many issues and it would stand up legally. But thats just my thoughts.It works bloody well in the AFL they always have a variety in finals and top 8 eg Collingwood last year finished 17th this year 4th, good crop of youngsters, works well for them.
 

Trifili13

Juniors
Messages
1,136
Hi Dave, I did manage to read most of the articles, now the one in the ROAR explains it best and I think if you read it again, this time the NRL would be perfectly justified to bring in a draft. We virtually have a 2 tier comp, poaching of youngsters to the more successful clubs etc. I really think getting a draft proposal for the NRL of today would solve many issues and it would stand up legally. But thats just my thoughts.It works bloody well in the AFL they always have a variety in finals and top 8 eg Collingwood last year finished 17th this year 4th, good crop of youngsters, works well for them.
Not sure the High Court Judge Politis will agree with you
 

Dragon David

First Grade
Messages
9,323
Hi Dave, I did manage to read most of the articles, now the one in the ROAR explains it best and I think if you read it again, this time the NRL would be perfectly justified to bring in a draft. We virtually have a 2 tier comp, poaching of youngsters to the more successful clubs etc. I really think getting a draft proposal for the NRL of today would solve many issues and it would stand up legally. But thats just my thoughts.It works bloody well in the AFL they always have a variety in finals and top 8 eg Collingwood last year finished 17th this year 4th, good crop of youngsters, works well for them.
Very good justa that you have read most of the stuff I sent.

I'll try and read the ROAR's article closer in the next day or so. Thanks for your opinion.
Cheers.
 

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