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Penrith v The Saddle Club

G

Girds89

Bench
Messages
3,239
Iamback said:
No Salmon was the 2nd rower.

See where Fish was to push Cobbo out? The middles are standing wider for us in attack

Salmon is in the 17.
No one covers the positions he can
Click to expand...
Your well and truly missing the whole point of my post.

Fish was standing where he was to push cobbo out because it was a quick 20m tap and the people that got back quickly had set up the line in the middle.... everyone was scattered everywhere.. fish just went back to where he did because there was legit no one in the line there and you dont get time on quick taps to set up the defensive line perfectly.

Ridiculous using that to try prove a point..

My point was the try martin scored wss a typical 2md rowers try. Same as hes others this season and many from last.

Couple passes wide of the ruck, changing direction at speed as your catching the pass..

Its just a classic 2nd rowers try..

Salmon may line up at 2md rower when he comes on but he really doesnt do much and certainly doesnt play a typical 2md rowers role.
 
D

DinkyDi

Juniors
Messages
2,212
Girds89 said:
He was but it was a 2nd rowers try.. he was lined up as a 2nd rower.

He was running off yeo just like a 2nd rower would. Was a great hole run, typical from a 2nd rower well wide of the ruck. Change of direction as he caught it and hes too hard to stop that close..

He has really nailed that down, whether it be off nath or yeo he changes direction as he catches the ball at speed. Very hard for defenders, especially smaller men like your halfs to contain that close to the line.

If he plays middle of the field you lose that becuase defence is much more compact and bigger bodies..

Ive never been against him playing middle. And theres potentially time and place for it in some games.

But i just think the dynamic of the side atm suits him playing on an edge..

For example id have much rather see leniu get another 7 or 8 mins last night (cause onky got 27)... than martin fill in at prop for 7 or so mins till the 2nd prop came back on...

Salmon has been ok and he hasnt ket anyone down. Ive been critical of him all pre season but ill admit hes done ok...

But i still just dont think he offers much when he comes on as a 2md rower.. hes not as good as c smith.. hes literally just there for an injury to the halfs or backs.

If we are still sitting nicely when we are back to full strength id love to see a few things..

C smith on the bench instead of salmon... i just think hed have much much more impact.. i know he doesnt have the utility value but i just want to see how it affects the team dynamic. If we are winning and doing well i think its worth trying..

And the other is to see how too goes on the right.. taylan is undroppable. Hes freakish..

Full strength id love to see
Edwards
Too
Critta
Tago
May
Luai
Cleary
Moses
Api
Fish
Kiks
Martin
Yeo

Kenny
Leniu
Soro
C smith

18th salmon.

Unluckiest bloke being eiso who is a deadset bargain and been soo good for us in his time here.

Man i was wrong when ivan signer him.. cant remember exactly what i said but i thought it was an absolute shit house signing. I turned out to be super wrong haha
Click to expand...
No the unluckiest would be Charlie Staines.
 
Someone2

Someone2

Bench
Messages
2,661
Just seen on YouTube JT interviewing the players after the match omg Ive got second hand embarrassment for them

talk about jumping around screaming acting like a bunch of classless bogans you could tell JT felt uncomfortable
 
Iamback

Iamback

Referee
Messages
20,318
Girds89 said:
Your well and truly missing the whole point of my post.

Fish was standing where he was to push cobbo out because it was a quick 20m tap and the people that got back quickly had set up the line in the middle.... everyone was scattered everywhere.. fish just went back to where he did because there was legit no one in the line there and you dont get time on quick taps to set up the defensive line perfectly.

Ridiculous using that to try prove a point..

My point was the try martin scored wss a typical 2md rowers try. Same as hes others this season and many from last.

Couple passes wide of the ruck, changing direction at speed as your catching the pass..

Its just a classic 2nd rowers try..

Salmon may line up at 2md rower when he comes on but he really doesnt do much and certainly doesnt play a typical 2md rowers role.
Click to expand...

Well he stands 3 in. So where was he playing?

Watch all of the props inside the 20. We are running wider now
 
G

Girds89

Bench
Messages
3,239
Iamback said:
Well he stands 3 in. So where was he playing?

Watch all of the props inside the 20. We are running wider now
Click to expand...
Hahah just completley glossed over your point about fish...

He was playing 2nd row. We basically just run with one prop at times. Last night wasnt the first time its happened.. last year we ran same structure probably a dozen times...

The games changed.. he certainly wasnt out there for those 7 or so mins playing a typical front rowers role..

Nothing he did basically changed from the rest of the game..

Salmon doesnt really play a 2nd rowers role either..

Your stuck in the mindset in an old school mimdset imo.

Our outside backs do sooo much work and make soo many meters we could run with no props at times throughout a match as we just dominate the ruck and meterage...

This is just fact... our outside backs dominate every team and make hiuuuge meters..

The need to play two "traditional" props isnt required for us...

We can give one a rest and martin can still play 2 or 3 passes wide of the ruck in attacl
 
D

DinkyDi

Juniors
Messages
2,212
Someone2 said:
Just seen on YouTube JT interviewing the players after the match omg Ive got second hand embarrassment for them

talk about jumping around screaming acting like a bunch of classless bogans you could tell JT felt uncomfortable
Click to expand...
If you say so, Rhyno.
 
Iamback

Iamback

Referee
Messages
20,318
Girds89 said:
Hahah just completley glossed over your point about fish...

He was playing 2nd row. We basically just run with one prop at times. Last night wasnt the first time its happened.. last year we ran same structure probably a dozen times...

The games changed.. he certainly wasnt out there for those 7 or so mins playing a typical front rowers role..

Nothing he did basically changed from the rest of the game..

Salmon doesnt really play a 2nd rowers role either..

Your stuck in the mindset in an old school mimdset imo.

Our outside backs do sooo much work and make soo many meters we could run with no props at times throughout a match as we just dominate the ruck and meterage...

This is just fact... our outside backs dominate every team and make hiuuuge meters..

The need to play two "traditional" props isnt required for us...

We can give one a rest and martin can still play 2 or 3 passes wide of the ruck in attacl
Click to expand...

Yeo and Martin were the props when Salmon and Kenny came on. It is what we do play smaller at stages
 
G

Girds89

Bench
Messages
3,239
Iamback said:
Yeo and Martin were the props when Salmon and Kenny came on. It is what we do play smaller at stages
Click to expand...
Again missed the point.

Missing whats actually happening out there..

Kenny has been playing middle though. Not traditional but purely a middle role when api is on.

Kenny hasnt played edge at all...??

The reason he plays middle or prop when api is still on is because it means hes closer to the ruck... so if api takes a run and gets tackled... hes there to play dummy half too..

I like that tactic.. but it just proves my point that we often at times dont run with two traditional props...

The games evolved mate..

We very often run with just one prop and the other player is a bit of a floater..

When kenny plays prop its cause api is on and the purpose is so hes a back up dummy if api runs and gets tackled... works well because it encourages api to run more and kenny has great line speed and solid defence. He also carries it strongly well above hes wait for a prop.

As for martin he bounces between a prop and 2nd row role.. last night he was a 2nd row role and we just were running with one prop..

Theres reasons why ivan does that with martin..

The main one is we are much more mobile with only 1 prop and an extra wider player with a bit more speed.. ivan only tends to do this when we are well on top which was reflected last night..

Again our outside backs are so good the need for two traditional props isnt required at times during a game..

Your stuck in a 2000 mindset that there has to be two props out there..games evolved soo much over the last few years..

Mainly down to interchange but players are jsut so fit and strong now..wingers regularly make 200m... the need for two props ismt always required..

Ivan took off a prop but martin didnt play that role..

Fyi im not saying he never has either!! Martin has at times definitley played a prop role.. last year!!

And when the game dictated it last year he did it well most times.

He hasnt been required to do that role yet this year
 
Iamback

Iamback

Referee
Messages
20,318
Girds89 said:
Again missed the point.

Missing whats actually happening out there..

Kenny has been playing middle though. Not traditional but purely a middle role when api is on.

Kenny hasnt played edge at all...??

The reason he plays middle or prop when api is still on is because it means hes closer to the ruck... so if api takes a run and gets tackled... hes there to play dummy half too..

I like that tactic.. but it just proves my point that we often at times dont run with two traditional props...

The games evolved mate..

We very often run with just one prop and the other player is a bit of a floater..

When kenny plays prop its cause api is on and the purpose is so hes a back up dummy if api runs and gets tackled... works well because it encourages api to run more and kenny has great line speed and solid defence. He also carries it strongly well above hes wait for a prop.

As for martin he bounces between a prop and 2nd row role.. last night he was a 2nd row role and we just were running with one prop..

Theres reasons why ivan does that with martin..

The main one is we are much more mobile with only 1 prop and an extra wider player with a bit more speed.. ivan only tends to do this when we are well on top which was reflected last night..

Again our outside backs are so good the need for two traditional props isnt required at times during a game..

Your stuck in a 2000 mindset that there has to be two props out there..games evolved soo much over the last few years..

Mainly down to interchange but players are jsut so fit and strong now..wingers regularly make 200m... the need for two props ismt always required..

Ivan took off a prop but martin didnt play that role..

Fyi im not saying he never has either!! Martin has at times definitley played a prop role.. last year!!

And when the game dictated it last year he did it well most times.

He hasnt been required to do that role yet this year
Click to expand...

Kenny plays middle
As does Dylan Walker
Kurt Mann and other
Teams are copying the Storm's model with Brandon Smith in the middle

The plan seems to be in most sides. Smaller skillful guys in the middle to run at bigger guys
Bigger guys wider trying to isolate halves

Martin is perfect at this role
 
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