Rationalisation of Sydney

[taipan]

Mate your club itself has publicly stated it isn't sustainable.
No other rectangular code wants to play professionally in the back of Wooloware
The gameday break-even is higher than all but 1-2 crowds per year (source: your club)
The government will never bother upgrading it because they don't own it and it's not central.
Anchor.

Local juniors are nice to have but aren't an indicator of success of a professional club.
Roosters have built a pathway with the CC without needing to play anywhere near them.
Brisbane don't directly run any of their junior areas.
Melbourne pull juniors from QLD and all over.
A number of clubs with huge junior nurseries have been rubbish for years despite having first shot at them.

The club has stated they need a 12,000 average to break even,hardl;y news.The old Leagues club for a start is hardly overly inviting.They still have 3 more home games at the ground, none involving the cursed Thursday night.

Have you bothered to check the situation re the development and the 2 years they will be way from the ground?
No other code? Depends on or if a A League Southern franchise comes in. Anycase the club's developments not dependent on any other rectangular code.

Who said anything about the Govt paying for an upgrade? The club has already received grant acknowledgment by the State Govt for a Centre of Excellence.Any ground upgrades are the club's responsibility.The club is debt free and that's taking into account 2019 results.

Didn't state anywhere having local juniors guaranteed success.Having large numbers of local juniors indicate interest in the code in that area.
Roosters have built a pathways ,thus they need youngsters ,so a de facto junior base IOW.And please the crowds for a hugely successful club, have hardly been mind blowing.What happens when Nick leaves for the Sky.Central for Sydney is Parramatta .Else the SCG crowds would be greater than they are.

Juniors playing in Brisbane ,whether under outside control ,still source"local"juniors from Brisbane.
That's right Melbourne pull juniors from everywhere except Melbourne, and this has been the commentary by the cynics, 22 years of existence and SFA locals in their side.What happens with consecutive leans years?
Well the Panthers with 3 new juniors helped knock over the Sharks last weekend.

 

[T-Boon]

Not a case of an old threat .It's the reality.I have been following the ARL and NRL for ages,and have zero interest if my team is relocated.I will continue to follow Intnl RL, as I have always done.

No one's holding up progress ,if you increase the number of teams .

Last line is BS.What happens, some fans stay loyal, a decent number give it away following the relocated or removed club, and a few look for other forms of entertainment ,the latter happened when Souths were given the flick ATT.
Even rationalisation pundits on TV, note you relocate a team, you gain fans and lose fans, and you're back to square one.Adelaide ATM has SFA juniors.
Anyway you are hardly a RL supporter.

Firstly,I am the ultimate RL supporter. Even though I detest the way the game is played now and can barely watch 5 minutes of a game, I am still on here trying to save the game from itself.
Secondly, I cannot relate to your attitude of if the Sharks move somewhere else you are done with them. So it means you love the town but not the club. As an Eels fan I would be totally fine with relocation as when I selected the Eels as my team I had no idea of where Parramatta was and I have never had any love of the town anyway.

 

[flippikat]

If a club is in deep financial shyte ,and has no other alternative,I agree relocation is the only way to retain the name.
Clubs that are financially viable regardless of support, should not be penalised.

Sure. But my point is that regardless of whether Norths were doing ok before their ill-fated move to Gosford or not, the actual task of relocating did them in.. partially because of their nomad status while the move was in progress, part because of the construction delays.

The NRL needs to guarantee to ANY club that relocates that they the costs won't cripple them to the point of collapse. That HAS to be a rock-solid assurance from the NRL, otherwise nothing will happen.

 

[Perth Red]

I see no signs from the nrl that they have inclination to entice clubs to relocate. That would take vision and strategy and the nrl administration has neither. I suspect we may never see the outcomes of the expansion report, or at best get a pss weak watered down release that talks about increasing the reach of the nrl without new clubs, which is all we’ve heard since the commission took over.

 

[flippikat]

I see no signs from the nrl that they have inclination to entice clubs to relocate. That would take vision and strategy and the nrl administration has neither. I suspect we may never see the outcomes of the expansion report, or at best get a pss weak watered down release that talks about increasing the reach of the nrl without new clubs, which is all we’ve heard since the commission took over.

Precisely.

The very definition of insanity is trying the same thing over again and expecting different results.

In the 2000s the NRL tried mergers, it under-delivered, and just created headaches.

The ARL tried mega-expansion (keeping the same Sydney footprint) in 1995, it failed - the depth wasn't there.

The NRL tried exclusion on Souths, it was a shambles.

The only thing we haven't tried is relocation. We got close with Norths, but they were combined with Manly into the Northern Eagles shambles before they could settle into their new digs - and even then, not for all their home games.

The AFL has already done relocation twice, how come we can't get it together to do it properly even ONCE?

 

[taipan]

Firstly,I am the ultimate RL supporter. Even though I detest the way the game is played now and can barely watch 5 minutes of a game, I am still on here trying to save the game from itself.
Secondly, I cannot relate to your attitude of if the Sharks move somewhere else you are done with them. So it means you love the town but not the club. As an Eels fan I would be totally fine with relocation as when I selected the Eels as my team I had no idea of where Parramatta was and I have never had any love of the town anyway.

If you barley watch 5 minutes of the game, then you have little contact.
Firstly if you are going to save the game form itself.you can start with some of the idiot players who bring the game down .That's a decent starting point.
My attitude reflects not only my view but by more than a few not only on Shark's threads but through people I know in my area.
NO it means having followed the club through thick and thin ,even when they nearly went broke on a couple of occasions, the ASADA crisis and because the community has become intertwined with them, losing them interstate would be like losing part of me.Also I have put my hard earned into help the club at the time they were nearly out the door.In addition to season memberships for years.

It's all very easy to say if my team X was relocated,I wouldn't have a problem, until of course it happened.
You have just clarified things, by admitting you were not a local Parra fan.That is a hell of a lot different than one who spent their youth living in that area, and followed the mall through those years, watching local players also come through..

 

[Mr Pmatta]

I am a Parra fan. I would be okay with relocating the Eels because I don’t much like Parramatta )though it is on the improve). I just don’t think it makes sense to relocate the Eels as we are a one team town.

Yep, agreed let’s relocate a club that’s has a new 400 million dollar stadium built for them because you don’t like Parramatta, wtf!!!!

 

[taipan]

Sure. But my point is that regardless of whether Norths were doing ok before their ill-fated move to Gosford or not, the actual task of relocating did them in.. partially because of their nomad status while the move was in progress, part because of the construction delays.

The NRL needs to guarantee to ANY club that relocates that they the costs won't cripple them to the point of collapse. That HAS to be a rock-solid assurance from the NRL, otherwise nothing will happen.

The whole News/ARL peace settlement was a quickly thought out fiasco.Creating the situation we all face now ,wanting to move this club here and this club there.
In the case of the AFL both the Lions and the Swans were in deep financial poo in Vic.They moved North on that basis, and even the Swans nearly went down the gurgle twice.
The convenience of the SL war, the axing of Souths and the Bears, the joint ventures, gave that code a huge financial and publicity leg up.
Anycase we are all p*ssing in the wind, until Greenburger does his background work on expansion and how the comp should look, which supposedly is presented to the ARLC end of this year.
Clubs will only want to relocate to survive.If they are all financially viable, you'll get no takers.

 

[mongoose]

Precisely.

The very definition of insanity is trying the same thing over again and expecting different results.

In the 2000s the NRL tried mergers, it under-delivered, and just created headaches.

The ARL tried mega-expansion (keeping the same Sydney footprint) in 1995, it failed - the depth wasn't there.

The NRL tried exclusion on Souths, it was a shambles.

The only thing we haven't tried is relocation. We got close with Norths, but they were combined with Manly into the Northern Eagles shambles before they could settle into their new digs - and even then, not for all their home games.

The AFL has already done relocation twice, how come we can't get it together to do it properly even ONCE?

I think if it ever happens Adelaide or NZ could accept a relocated team. Possibly somewhere in QLD if done right.... Not sure if it would work in Perth now, seems like the league community there has become too attached to the Pirates or Reds coming back.

The problem with relocating though is there is a stench of failure that follows the club and potential fans may not want to be associated with it. It's probably actually better to relocate a team who are doing well (off field) like the Bulldogs or Roosters than a team that is struggling like Sharks or Tigers.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

You guessed wrong. The numbers are very low! 1000! That's low! It's good to see some improvement but from a very low base. Please have comments with proper perspective .

@flippikat is right. Demotion from NRL to NSW Cup isn't the end of the world as Newtown have demonstrated.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Union troll, Lol I’ve never played the code and the only game I remember watching from start to finish was the World Cup final win which still didn’t entice me to watch more.

@Stallion is the one that actually played union though.. go figure - lol

 

[Pommy]

Have you bothered to check the situation re the development and the 2 years they will be way from the ground?
No other code? Depends on or if a A League Southern franchise comes in. Anycase the club's developments not dependent on any other rectangular code.

Im not trying to trash sharks in anyway but you have to feel the A League ship has sailed with the addition of a SW Sydney team.
Four A league teams in sydney would be dumber than all the NRL teams Sydney currently has.

 

[T-Boon]

I see no signs from the nrl that they have inclination to entice clubs to relocate. That would take vision and strategy and the nrl administration has neither. I suspect we may never see the outcomes of the expansion report, or at best get a pss weak watered down release that talks about increasing the reach of the nrl without new clubs, which is all we’ve heard since the commission took over.

Maybe it will take something like a reduction in the income from TV which seems around the corner.

 

[T-Boon]

Yep, agreed let’s relocate a club that’s has a new 400 million dollar stadium built for them because you don’t like Parramatta, wtf!!!!

It wasnt built for Parra and if we moved to say Perth then other western sydney clubs would use it more successfully.

 

[titoelcolombiano]

Central Coast Sea Eagles: Gosford / one game at Brookevale
West Coast Tigers: NIB Stadium, Perth
St George Illawarra Dragons: Win Stadium, Wollongong / one game at Kogarah

All three teams will still play regularly in Sydney and can sell away Sydney memberships.

that leaves us in Sydney with:
Sydney Roosters: SFS - Eastern Suburbs and North Shore (team of the affluent areas of Sydney)
South Sydney: SFS or ANZ whatever
Conulla Sharks: The Shire
Bulldogs: ANZ
Eels: WSS
Penrith: Penrith

Then, Conulla and Penrith are the only stadia regularly used in the NRL that might need a bit of attention.

Benefits:

• Extra TV timeslot and increased national footprint from having a Perth team
• Sea Eagles, Tigers & Dragons brand stay in the NRL
• Sydney is less congested without the pain of cutting teams completely
• Sydney based Tigers, Eagles and Dragons fans can still watch their team play quite a few times in Sydney each year plus still get to watch them on TV every week.

 

[taipan]

Im not trying to trash sharks in anyway but you have to feel the A League ship has sailed with the addition of a SW Sydney team.
Four A league teams in sydney would be dumber than all the NRL teams Sydney currently has.

That I don't know.All I do know is having a team for the South has not gone away and will no doubt rears its ugly head in the future..Whether it happens is the big question.The Shire has the biggest junior soccer numbers in the country, as well as a decent size and growing junior rl base.
The Sharks with all the residents that will be moving in to the new development, plus the current base with anew Leagues club will not need an A League to make them viable, but it would no doubt add to revenues.
Inclined to agree with you 4 A league Sydney teams in a comp, that is hardly top quality now, would further water down the comp.

 

[Pommy]

That I don't know.All I do know is having a team for the South has not gone away and will no doubt rears its ugly head in the future..Whether it happens is the big question.The Shire has the biggest junior soccer numbers in the country, as well as a decent size and growing junior rl base.
The Sharks with all the residents that will be moving in to the new development, plus the current base with anew Leagues club will not need an A League to make them viable, but it would no doubt add to revenues.
Inclined to agree with you 4 A league Sydney teams in a comp, that is hardly top quality now, would further water down the comp.

I would like to see what percentage of Sydney FCs members come from the shire, st George etc. I bet it’s a lot.

 

[taipan]

I would like to see what percentage of Sydney FCs members come from the shire, st George etc. I bet it’s a lot.

Yep there are decent numbers I know from the Shire.So yeah, having a team in the south would weaken Sydney FC numbers.Sydney FC have protested about having a team from the South, for that very reason.

 

[Stallion]

@flippikat is right. Demotion from NRL to NSW Cup isn't the end of the world as Newtown have demonstrated.

Lol. Do you honestly think it's general knowledge that the Newtown Jets exist in the eyes of the mainstream public? The Bears were unfairly axed and deserve life in the form of a top flight club namely the Central Coast Bears. That's a win /win top flight ready to make money and consolidate the code in Australia's largest populated area. This amidst forced mergers and axing of popular Sydney clubs that were completely wrong as a superleague outcome!

 

[Stallion]

@flippikat is right. Demotion from NRL to NSW Cup isn't the end of the world as Newtown have demonstrated.

Lol. Well that seals it then! An endorsement from you is clearly indicating he's on the wrong path!