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Rugby League Live 3

nöyd

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
9,809
so glad i decided to step away from the console version(s) of this game and not purchase it, regardless of eb's return policy

luckily steam has pretty much the same policy so i will give it a crack on pc, but i don't hold any great hope of seeing improvement
 
Messages
121
That review was more than fair.

Ross and other fan boys prattle on about not comparing it to Fifa etc

Yeah but Ross & the fan boi's are quick to bring that subject up when it suits their argument. In the thread where Ross abuses the reviewer he himself mentions several times that they dont have resources of EA & other elite developers to defend his game.
 

ak47

Juniors
Messages
613
Yeah but Ross & the fan boi's are quick to bring that subject up when it suits their argument. In the thread where Ross abuses the reviewer he himself mentions several times that they dont have resources of EA & other elite developers to defend his game.

I dunno I have no emotional attachment to NFL and NBA - much like I wouldn't like the best DRAMA/Romantic movie of the year. I don't care how good Madden and NBA2k looks and plays - I hate the sports. RLL3 is technically poor in comparison but the emotion is much higher, and so is the enjoyment. judging by the AU/NZ charts seeing RLL3 ABOVE Madden. im not the only one.

That review everyone is cherry picking also said its the best rugby game to date, and the best of the RLL series, so if you enjoyed RLL2, chances are you will more than like this one too.
 

HBK619

Juniors
Messages
25
I love how HBK619 has completely abandoned LU. Coming on here and seeing all of our valid criticisms must really get them worked up.
Nope.

I've been apart of the forum scene for plenty of time, from both sides of the fence (as a player of games and now an employee of a developer) - I know frustrations at elements that aren't to my liking.

We're always looking at feedback and working towards a solution. These things aren't often quick fixes however and need time, sometimes beyond that you need to see what people's reactions are to the game before you can get a good gauge as to what actually needs to be altered.

I prefer not to be vitriolic with my responses as that only does more harm than good, however.
 

Walt Flanigan

Referee
Messages
20,727
My biggest gripe is with comments like "you have to play it like a real game of Rugby League". One of the key goals in league is to put the other team on the backfoot through momentum and quick play-the-balls. Something you just can't do in these games.

If you could do this by isolating defenders, line breaks and poorly timed tackles then it would be a step in the right direction. The ability to have set plays would be massive (hell even ET's had them).

I thought this might be the kind of development would have taken place between releases but really it plays like RLL2 with some old bugs fixed and some new created.
 
Messages
121
Nope.

I've been apart of the forum scene for plenty of time, from both sides of the fence (as a player of games and now an employee of a developer) - I know frustrations at elements that aren't to my liking.

We're always looking at feedback and working towards a solution. These things aren't often quick fixes however and need time, sometimes beyond that you need to see what people's reactions are to the game before you can get a good gauge as to what actually needs to be altered.

I prefer not to be vitriolic with my responses as that only does more harm than good, however.

HBK, Im curious about your testing procedure. What, who & how long is your game tested? Is it rugby league fans testing the game or are they generic gamers?
 

I Bleed Maroon

Referee
Messages
26,136
Nope.

I've been apart of the forum scene for plenty of time, from both sides of the fence (as a player of games and now an employee of a developer) - I know frustrations at elements that aren't to my liking.

We're always looking at feedback and working towards a solution. These things aren't often quick fixes however and need time, sometimes beyond that you need to see what people's reactions are to the game before you can get a good gauge as to what actually needs to be altered.

I prefer not to be vitriolic with my responses as that only does more harm than good, however.

Allow me to not be vitriolic. I have trouble believing the bolded. You say you're always looking at feedback, were you looking at feedback when RLL2 was released? Because many of the problems that plagued that game still exist in RLL3, particularly serious balancing issues with the difficulty settings and presumably how that relates to the efficiency of your A.I teammates both in attack and defence, who are beyond useless, even on Pro or higher. They almost seem to be running on rails sometimes.

I don't understand how the opposition can knock a ball down, regather and not be called a knock on, I don't understand why the ref sends a try attempt from outside the in goal area by about 6 metres up to the video ref for inspection, I really don't get how the kick off mechanic works because the blue bar is very ambiguous and doesn't seem to make sense as to why shanks that land 10 metres away from halfway happen.

I don't understand why the toe grubber and low tackle are on the same button (X), which means when the opposition puts it down close to my defender, I'm toeing it back to them instead of tackling like I meant to, I don't get why the game seems incapable of allowing a player to keep their opposition scoreless, even when the stats are well and truly against them something invariably happens that allows them to have a scoring opportunity, such as a knock on, a bomb to the in goal that is impossible to defuse or, again, A.I defenders just conveniently falling asleep at the wheel.

Also finally I will give you guys the benefit of the doubt and say that you didn't intend for the player to be able to send 4 different players to the sin bin because of repeated ruck infringements which are remarkably easy to earn but funnily don't seem to make a huge impact in the final result regardless.

It seems that the problems have to be truly game breaking in order for you guys to take notice and fix it prior to release, such as the intercepts which were very egregious, to the point of seeming scripted (I might be just mad, blind or both, but it seemed in that game that when an intercept was about to happen, the game almost slowed down for a nanosecond to allow the ball to float in a certain direction).

Half of those could be excused as bugs in a new game that need to be ironed out, which is fine, but not 3 times in a row. It makes it very difficult for you guys to argue that RLL3 isn't just the same old code dressed up with prettier graphics with the same price tag when the exact same problems are occurring over and over again. It suggests that you need far better QA testers, but it also is a sign of a bit of hypocrisy on your part (you being Big Ant and Tru Blu).

You know who else just dresses up the same game code in slightly prettier graphics and slaps full price on it? EA, and last time I checked, any comparisons that people make between you and them is met with derision because of budget differences. It's fair enough that you guys are a lonely fish in a dying ocean at the moment and money and time to make a good game are hard to come by, but you should remind your bosses over at Tru Blu that despite what the AFL crowd might suggest down there in Melbourne, RL fans aren't stupid. They can see when they're being fleeced, and charging 100+ dollars for a slight cosmetic upgrade which is followed by smartarse comments from your colleague Ross when criticism is brought to him falls into that category.
 

canberra_raiders2k2

First Grade
Messages
6,255
I wrote something similar on Big Ant, obviously not as well written as that but as per usual...anything negative gets deleted.

It is shit like that which makes me believe that Big Ant simply do not want to listen to the negative feedback. They spend more time deleting threads and posts questioning the gameplay then they do anything else.

Now we are supposed to believe that Big Ant are going through the issues noticed by the consumers hahaha. Yeah right. The issues have been present for sometime and we picked up on them within a few play sessions. Do not come here and make up BS to make Big Ant come across as some saviour of ours.

Lets not compare RLL3 to the other big sporting games ....just have it whatever way you guys want..bunch of sooks.

Big Ant should be thankful that other larger sites/reviewers have not reviewed this game.

Whilst the market is small and the budget is just as small, a small sized game reviewer noted how terrible the game was and Ross went ape shit. Like seriously, does he believe he developed a good game!?!?

Imagine someone like Angry Joe with this game hahaha. Regardless as to how the market for this game, the game itself is quite...shit.
 

Parra Pride

Referee
Messages
20,433
Lets not compare RLL3 to the other big sporting games ....just have it whatever way you guys want..bunch of sooks.

I've seen quite a few people say they are either just going to wait for NBA/Fifa, or trade in their copy of RLL3 for either of those. So I think it's more than fair to compare the games, as people are genuinely taking those bigger titles over this. Simply saying you don't have the budget of those games is never going to change the fact that you are still competing with these other sports titles.

Imagine someone like Angry Joe with this game hahaha. Regardless as to how the market for this game, the game itself is quite...shit.

Angry Joe reviewing this would be amazing.
 

HBK619

Juniors
Messages
25
HBK, Im curious about your testing procedure. What, who & how long is your game tested? Is it rugby league fans testing the game or are they generic gamers?
In terms of employees testing the game we had a number of sports fans on it. I'm a lover of all sports (as I noted in my introduction post). I go to any and all sporting events (went to the Victory FFA Cup game tonight).

I'm also a member of the Storm (going this Saturday to watch them against the Cowboys).

In terms of others at BigAnt and Tru Blu there's a varying mix, remember that we don't just do Rugby games. We've done Jetpack Joyride, Cricket, AFL and have Lacrosse in development as well as a number of other titles that range quite heavily in genre.

But we've had Rugby League fans come in and do focus tests, and we've had people that play local Rugby help us in various aspects of developing the game too.

In terms of testing time it's been close to 2 years, it's all a ramp up though. What you see at the end isn't even close to what it starts out as, and generally the testing process isn't always what people expect (it's a lot of making sure you comply with manufacturer standards).
Allow me to not be vitriolic. I have trouble believing the bolded. You say you're always looking at feedback, were you looking at feedback when RLL2 was released? Because many of the problems that plagued that game still exist in RLL3, particularly serious balancing issues with the difficulty settings and presumably how that relates to the efficiency of your A.I teammates both in attack and defence, who are beyond useless, even on Pro or higher. They almost seem to be running on rails sometimes.
I don't want to quote a word wall here so I'll try and answer your post as much as I can and just quote the opening paragraph.

First thing I'll mention is that I came to BigAnt, late 2013 just as RLL2 WCE was being finished up on. I'll admit I didn't have a huge amount of knowledge of peoples opinion on that game going into RLL3 as I wasn't around these sorts of forums at that point in time. It's my choice to come to this forum to engage feedback, generally I am here looking rather than posting (as I am somewhat hamstrung by what I can say most of the time - so I try not to say much at all). I don't have to come to this site, but I like to get a diverse amount of opinions. I don't have a hard time weeding through the crap to get to what I need to know, I know how forums operate.

What I will say about RLL3 is that for the most part the game is built from the ground up, there wasn't much of RLL2's code that was used. Whether you believe that or not, it's just fact. We didn't spend 2 years just making the game look better and push it out the door, there was a significant amount of re-writes to pretty much every single system in the game.

Some of the things you mention are design decisions (whether right or wrong to you - if something is designed a certain way it's not necessarily debated internally until people give feedback that it's not how they want it). Other things are things we probably do need to look at, as to why they make it into the final product comes down to a range of factors (again unfortunately I can't really divulge exactly what - as much as it'd be great to enlighten some of the ignorant crowd around here).

I have a heap of feedback gathered that we're dissecting to see what can be done (so yes canberra_raiders2k2 believe it...). If I could talk more about it I would, but I can't at this stage. But yes, things are being heard despite some of the completely terrible and unhelpful comments people can make.

I also don't really care for your inference in your last paragraph about 'AFL crowd'. Just because we're in Melbourne doesn't mean we don't have passion for Rugby League or are 'AFL focused' (I don't really even see how you manage to get AFL into this at all in the first place). Like I said above I'm a Storm member (and have been for several years) and have followed them throughout the shit times and the good and everyone in the studio is aiming to make a good title regardless of the sport we are attempting to emulate. Nobody is sitting back saying "who gives a shit what we give these NRL blokes, they don't know what's going on and AFL is the better sport anyway!"

There's a lot of long hours and late nights put into these games, to think there's any less effort put in just because it's a Rugby title is just not right at all.
 
Messages
121
In terms of employees testing the game we had a number of sports fans on it. I'm a lover of all sports (as I noted in my introduction post). I go to any and all sporting events (went to the Victory FFA Cup game tonight).

I'm also a member of the Storm (going this Saturday to watch them against the Cowboys).

In terms of others at BigAnt and Tru Blu there's a varying mix, remember that we don't just do Rugby games. We've done Jetpack Joyride, Cricket, AFL and have Lacrosse in development as well as a number of other titles that range quite heavily in genre.

But we've had Rugby League fans come in and do focus tests, and we've had people that play local Rugby help us in various aspects of developing the game too.

In terms of testing time it's been close to 2 years, it's all a ramp up though. What you see at the end isn't even close to what it starts out as, and generally the testing process isn't always what people expect (it's a lot of making sure you comply with manufacturer standards).

Thanks for answering HBK. I can appreciate that you come on here where things can be more in your face than the Bigant forum.

You mentioned sports fans testing the game. I'm a sports fan when it comes to games, cricket, NFL, Hockey, etc. But because I play those games that doesnt mean I know the nuances of the sport. NFL has so many aspects to it that I may not see things a die hard NFL fan would see.
And its the same with RL, stick a generic sports tester in & they test the game to make sure no one explodes, but they miss the nuances of the game that a true RL fan watches every single weekend on TV & wants to reenact in their favorite game.
Hearing some of the "bugs- Hot potato for one" in RLL3 makes me wonder if the wrong people were testing the game, the testers reports were ignored or couldnt be fixed or the game was pushed out way too early.

I can see you have pride in your work, but as a RL fan you should also be able to see that certain aspects of the game aren't quiet right too.
 

edabomb

First Grade
Messages
7,190
It's funny to me that the most reasonable contact person from BigAnt still has to get a shot in about their customers being ignorant :lol:
 

alien

Referee
Messages
20,279
hbk, i hear the game is coming out on pc (steam). is it possible some of these things that are not good with the game will be fixed through patches on steam???
 

Frederick

Moderator
Staff member
Messages
27,633
What if like to know is why they rushed to get it out now when the season is all but over. Surely it would have been better for them to spend another 6 months on it and release it at the beginning of next season, instead of releasing it at a time when there's only six weeks left before no-one cares about rugby league for four months. Would've also meant that rosters and draws were relevant, and it wouldn't be facing stiff competition from Fifa, madden, nba etc etc

Whoever came up with the timeline and release date for the game should be shot because it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever
 

HBK619

Juniors
Messages
25
Thanks for answering HBK. I can appreciate that you come on here where things can be more in your face than the Bigant forum.

You mentioned sports fans testing the game. I'm a sports fan when it comes to games, cricket, NFL, Hockey, etc. But because I play those games that doesnt mean I know the nuances of the sport. NFL has so many aspects to it that I may not see things a die hard NFL fan would see.
And its the same with RL, stick a generic sports tester in & they test the game to make sure no one explodes, but they miss the nuances of the game that a true RL fan watches every single weekend on TV & wants to reenact in their favorite game.
Hearing some of the "bugs- Hot potato for one" in RLL3 makes me wonder if the wrong people were testing the game, the testers reports were ignored or couldnt be fixed or the game was pushed out way too early.

I can see you have pride in your work, but as a RL fan you should also be able to see that certain aspects of the game aren't quiet right too.
When I say sports fans, I mean sports fans. We have a guy here who has followed NFL since a very young age, and also lived amongst the Canberra faithful during the time of Meninga, Daley and the greats there. So we're across a number of sports.

Beyond that, we also play sports games to better understand what the other games do and play like.

There's a lot of reasons the game ends up as it does, I'd love to go into it further but it's just not something I can do. We know certain things when the game goes out, but a lot of the time it comes down to getting a good opinion from the masses before you can get a good gauge of whether something is right, wrong or otherwise.

The good thing is we have the capability to address these things and as I've said, we're certainly looking to do so.
It's funny to me that the most reasonable contact person from BigAnt still has to get a shot in about their customers being ignorant :lol:
That was my forumite side coming out. ;-)

That being said, our fans in general are great to deal with and have had massive influence on our products (DBC14 has literally been shaped due to immense community feedback). There's always some bad eggs amongst the crowd, that's inevitable.
hbk, i hear the game is coming out on pc (steam). is it possible some of these things that are not good with the game will be fixed through patches on steam???
Unfortunately I can't confirm what is and isn't going to be in the Steam version on release other than to say we have been taking feedback and are looking to apply it to all versions of the game.
What if like to know is why they rushed to get it out now when the season is all but over. Surely it would have been better for them to spend another 6 months on it and release it at the beginning of next season, instead of releasing it at a time when there's only six weeks left before no-one cares about rugby league for four months. Would've also meant that rosters and draws were relevant, and it wouldn't be facing stiff competition from Fifa, madden, nba etc etc

Whoever came up with the timeline and release date for the game should be shot because it makes absolutely no sense whatsoever
The game wasn't rushed out.

Beyond that, 6 months isn't chicken feed. That's 6 months worth of salaries, 6 months of pushing back marketing plans. It's a lot of re-working and most likely wouldn't actually have been worth holding the game back for (and even then if it's a '2016 season' game - it wouldn't be coming out day one of the 2016 season due to licensing).

We've managed to get the game out at a competitive time for games and yet in Aus and NZ RLL3 it's the no.1 selling game and top 10 in UK despite only 2 recorded days of sales data. This is when big titles like Mad Max, MGSV, Madden, et al have released and RLL3 is outselling them.
 
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Shaun Hewitt

First Grade
Messages
6,464
Those are valid points re- not waiting for 6 months for release and shoud have been raised.
I think people see this as being rushed for xmas sales due to the odd time (myself included) until this was pointed out.

HBK, a few questions.
Why is Ross such an ass when it comes to negative feedback? Does he realize how bad it makes himself and BA look?

I'm glad to hear that feedback is generally appreciated though (as DBC). Would the following things look to be implemented in RLL3 in future?

-Mid season signings (not releases, but actual signings)

- International matches in Coach mode

- Numbers to represent positions in 9s, or an indication as to what position the number is referring to

- Ability to search off-contract players

- Longer team sheets, 9s you can barely read the names before they are off the screen! I like to be able to see who I'm playing against while checking to see who I selected

- Removal of the June 6th market deadline (where did that come from?, its not like that IRL is it?)

- Season stats
 

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