Sack Adam O'Brien

[Apey]

I'm genuinely impressed you think Klemmer had that big of an impact on our attack one way or another.

 

[slotmachine]

Think it's a case of who is here now (Gamble, Hastings, Miller) that are out and out competitors, rather than who has left.

 

[mozza91]

Yeah screw Klemmer and his trying hard and giving a shit. What a prick!

 

[Yosh]

Yeah screw Klemmer and his trying hard and giving a shit. What a prick!

I thought so too last year but this season im beginning to think he just wanted to pad his stats. Was more about getting his metres than aiding his team win.

 

[perverse]

I'm genuinely impressed you think Klemmer had that big of an impact on our attack one way or another.

Those stat-padding nothing hitups in the red zone certainly haven't been doing the Tigers any favours. We're not missing him, and we're still paying half his salary. He's not a team player, and there's reasons why teams have ultimately been happy to move him on and that he's been exiled from rep footy beyond his playing ability. I think he's just playing for paycheques (to support his family long term) and happy to plod along into retirement from here.

I don't think it's any one, two or even three factors though. We've made a glut of changes that have all coalesced into a lot of improvement. I don't think anyone is outright wrong or right with their takes. I think there's some truth in just about all of it - and quite likely stuff we can't know without being behind the scenes too.

 

[HarVeeGee]

““Success has many fathers” - George Washington” - HarVeeGee

 

[Yosh]

““Success has many fathers” - George Washington” - HarVeeGee

Success' mum must have gotten around eh?

 

[Loose Cannon]

The Klemmer criticism is idiotic.

Okay, yes he may have overplayed his one-dimensional runs. But consider the alternative last year.

1. 2x Saifiti taking the piss beyond lazy.
2. A one-legged halfback who, as clever as hell, is a second tier option.
3. Jake Clifford offering not a single positive due not only to outside circumstances.
4. Gagai, Best, Tuala were a waste of space.
5 (and this is the most important one). Ponga never returned a kick. Dom and the other winger always taking the return flat footed with the kick chase in their face after a Ponga 20 metre pass. Think about it. How good have Dom and Marz (admittedly a huge improvement on Tuala) gone taking dummy half runs after Miller’s kick returns? Are we not making ground that would allow Klemmer to hit up on the 3rd, rather than racing back to take the 2nd under pressure, and without momentum? No wonder he wanted more shots, that’s not stat selfish, it’s what was needed due to our incompetence.

Hastings, Gamble, Miller are the reasons it’s now working. And Blake Green is making it happen.

 

[perverse]

The Klemmer criticism is idiotic.

Okay, yes he may have overplayed his one-dimensional runs. But consider the alternative last year.

1. 2x Saifiti taking the piss beyond lazy.
2. A one-legged halfback who, as clever as hell, is a second tier option.
3. Jake Clifford offering not a single positive due not only to outside circumstances.
4. Gagai, Best, Tuala were a waste of space.
5 (and this is the most important one). Ponga never returned a kick. Dom and the other winger always taking the return flat footed with the kick chase in their face after a Ponga 20 metre pass. Think about it. How good have Dom and Marz (admittedly a huge improvement on Tuala) gone taking dummy half runs after Miller’s kick returns? Are we not making ground that would allow Klemmer to hit up on the 3rd, rather than racing back to take the 2nd under pressure, and without momentum? No wonder he wanted more shots, that’s not stat selfish, it’s what was needed due to our incompetence.

Hastings, Gamble, Miller are the reasons it’s now working. And Blake Green is making it happen.

Sure, all of the above is correct. And Klemmer was also not really an asset either. He provided about $400k of prop value (and being generous, he's soft as wet tissue these days and slow as hell to play the ball) at $800k a year. He selfishly pads his stats with garbage nothing plays, and honestly seems like a destabilizing presence whereever he goes - if for no other reason than he's playing to fill his bank balance and set his family up moreso than any sort of passion to win.

I mean i'm not making up the stat selfish thing from thin air. He's a self-admitted stat-watcher and has been accused of it by people much closer to him than I am.

Trading him for Hastings is seeming like the deal of the century at the moment.

 

[Jono078]

Trading him for Hastings is seeming like the deal of the century at the moment.

I raise you a Chris Randall for Greg Marzhew.

Either way - it's nice to be on the winning end of a trade for once!

Based on what's publicly been said, these are the reasons for our turnaround;

1. Peter Parr - It starts from the top and I assume he's been a big involvement in some of the staff and players we've been able to acquire. Not only that, he may very well have given AOB full control to do what he wants to save his career.

2. The staff. In particular Brian McDermott, Matthew Jay (fitness) and the promotion within where it seems Blake Green and Rory Kostjasyn have been heavily involved.

3. The player recruitment. As Loose Cannon pointed out above, it's hard to win with what we had last year and how they performed. We've clearly gone for high energy, somewhat arrogant players who love to compete and don't mind getting their hands dirty.

4. Finally - AOB. Maybe he finally realized if he didn't do things how he really wanted he wouldn't be a head coach much longer. He himself seems to have an edge to him this year and you can tell just from post-game conferences. Much less excuses. It's almost like he's rewound to what he used to be and re-found his core values and has applied them.

 

[Apey]

The Klemmer criticism is idiotic.

Okay, yes he may have overplayed his one-dimensional runs. But consider the alternative last year.

1. 2x Saifiti taking the piss beyond lazy.
2. A one-legged halfback who, as clever as hell, is a second tier option.
3. Jake Clifford offering not a single positive due not only to outside circumstances.
4. Gagai, Best, Tuala were a waste of space.
5 (and this is the most important one). Ponga never returned a kick. Dom and the other winger always taking the return flat footed with the kick chase in their face after a Ponga 20 metre pass. Think about it. How good have Dom and Marz (admittedly a huge improvement on Tuala) gone taking dummy half runs after Miller’s kick returns? Are we not making ground that would allow Klemmer to hit up on the 3rd, rather than racing back to take the 2nd under pressure, and without momentum? No wonder he wanted more shots, that’s not stat selfish, it’s what was needed due to our incompetence.

Hastings, Gamble, Miller are the reasons it’s now working. And Blake Green is making it happen.

I had already legitimately forgotten about Jake Clifford's existence, lol.

 

[Loose Cannon]

Sure, all of the above is correct. And Klemmer was also not really an asset either. He provided about $400k of prop value (and being generous, he's soft as wet tissue these days and slow as hell to play the ball) at $800k a year. He selfishly pads his stats with garbage nothing plays, and honestly seems like a destabilizing presence whereever he goes - if for no other reason than he's playing to fill his bank balance and set his family up moreso than any sort of passion to win.

I mean i'm not making up the stat selfish thing from thin air. He's a self-admitted stat-watcher and has been accused of it by people much closer to him than I am.

Trading him for Hastings is seeming like the deal of the century at the moment.

I agree Klem was overpaid, but it wasn’t his fault, and nor is it Ponga’s for his deal. Management was incompetent in both cases.

And I’m ecstatic with the Hastings trade. We have a real halfback for the first time in a generation.

 

[Loose Cannon]

Sure, all of the above is correct. And Klemmer was also not really an asset either. He provided about $400k of prop value (and being generous, he's soft as wet tissue these days and slow as hell to play the ball) at $800k a year. He selfishly pads his stats with garbage nothing plays, and honestly seems like a destabilizing presence whereever he goes - if for no other reason than he's playing to fill his bank balance and set his family up moreso than any sort of passion to win.

I mean i'm not making up the stat selfish thing from thin air. He's a self-admitted stat-watcher and has been accused of it by people much closer to him than I am.

Trading him for Hastings is seeming like the deal of the century at the moment.

My post wasn’t directed at you mate, just the general tone. I had actually missed your previous post, and yet I appreciate the differing perspectives despite my stance.

 

[Knight Tales]

Klemmer and Hastings would be at it already if he was still here. It would not have ended well. Klemmer had a ridiculous habit of taking hit ups in the opponents 20 with his garbage out the back offloads easy pickings.

 

[mozza91]

Was Klemmer a massive destabilising force?
I know he gave Knowles a spray but everything else mentioned like stats padding, going against game plans, a hypothetical Hastings feud (lol) are just guesswork and hearsay.

I’m really happy we got Hastings because he’s what we badly needed but I’m not gonna hang shit on Klemmer because he was one of the few blokes who put in each week last year. As he did each year he was at the club.

 

[PhilGould]

Don’t think there’s much point arguing about his intent because only one person knows the answer to that, and I find it hard to denigrate a prop for wanting to take more hit-ups as well. My issue was always that I think even on his best days he’s an ineffective player, and had been for the last 3 years of his Knights stint. Look around the comp and you’ll have a hard time finding a similar prop, especially young ones coming through, because he’s the opposite of what teams look for now. The comparable ones are generally older journeyman, bench/depth players who take a quarter of his runs and get a quarter of his money.

Said all along it would be a dumb club taking him off our hands if it were to happen. Thanks, Tigers.

 

[Woody90]

Makes you wonder:

a. WTF went on the past 3 seasons.
b. Who is responsible for the style of play and effort the side are displaying? It is a complete turnaround. The majority of the squad look 500% better players than they ever have at the club.
c. Can it continue???

I read an article a couple of weeks ago where they had stats from the Fox sports lab that confirmed that we've been the unluckiest team over the past decade when it comes to injuries with each year our spine only playing a handful of games together, the least of all other teams (as opposed to all of the premiership winning sides who kept the same spine for the majority of the season).

Now obviously we're still getting spine in injuries but I feel like our attitude to them has shifted significantly. Rather than throwing our hands up and feeling sorry for ourselves it's like the club has finally acknowledged that we're an unlucky club and always going to get injuries and we're playing a style of football the utilises the whole team rather than basing everything around 1 or 2 players who we'd likely lose at some point.

 

[Knight Tales]

I read an article a couple of weeks ago where they had stats from the Fox sports lab that confirmed that we've been the unluckiest team over the past decade when it comes to injuries with each year our spine only playing a handful of games together, the least of all other teams (as opposed to all of the premiership winning sides who kept the same spine for the majority of the season).

Now obviously we're still getting spine in injuries but I feel like our attitude to them has shifted significantly. Rather than throwing our hands up and feeling sorry for ourselves it's like the club has finally acknowledged that we're an unlucky club and always going to get injuries and we're playing a style of football the utilises the whole team rather than basing everything around 1 or 2 players who we'd likely lose at some point.

We don’t need Fox to tell us the clearly obvious.

 

[aqua_duck]

I think the change of approach in attack has been brought about by necessity more than anything else.
Previously and even in round 1 the game plan was pretty much 4 settlers and then give it to KP and hope for the best, moreover the our attack was predicated on making sure our key players were in the right position and that often meant burning multiple tackles waiting for that to happen, it also tied into our desire to use our middles to win that forward battle at any cost.
This year after losing Klemmer, Barnett, J.Saifiti to suspension, Elliott to injury and D.Saf struggling with niggling injuries we simply don’t have the troops to dominate up the middle and we also KP being out has forced us to relook at how our points will come.

 

[Jono078]

I think the change of approach in attack has been brought about by necessity more than anything else.
Previously and even in round 1 the game plan was pretty much 4 settlers and then give it to KP and hope for the best, moreover the our attack was predicated on making sure our key players were in the right position and that often meant burning multiple tackles waiting for that to happen, it also tied into our desire to use our middles to win that forward battle at any cost.
This year after losing Klemmer, Barnett, J.Saifiti to suspension, Elliott to injury and D.Saf struggling with niggling injuries we simply don’t have the troops to dominate up the middle and we also KP being out has forced us to relook at how our points will come.

If we revert back to 4 settlers and give it to KP, will people start to say KP is the issue - just like Klemmer was?

Will be interesting if it does...

I actually have faith we're going to put on a good show against the Cowboys. Really hope I'm right. Will be unreal for all of us and the club to know we are capable and legit this year, legit as in being competitive in every game.