West Coast Pirates Bid News

[T-Boon]

You are right we do not have the player talent for a 17th team.

To be honest you look at the bottom Clubs rosters in the NRL and it looks like we only have the talent pool for 14 teams.

No Club has shown even the slightest bit of interest in relocating.

So until a Sydney Club dies I can't see expansion for a very long time.

All very true.
Although I think certain clubs would become interested as the incentives increased... Example: dangle enough additional funding, enough additional salary cap, draft picks (if that ever happens), guarantee a certain number of games at the traditional ground (e.g. if Parra 5 games at Parra Stadium each year for ten years; if Cronulla 5 games at Shark Park). Those incentives or others would eventually attract somebody, the problem is the other clubs would not cooperate with those incentives as "whats is in it for them"?
I believe the Gold Coast should get additional funding and cap space in order to grow and compete with the Suns, but it is not going to ever happen because of totally self interested clubs.

 

[The Great Dane]

You are right we do not have the player talent for a 17th team.

To be honest you look at the bottom Clubs rosters in the NRL and it looks like we only have the talent pool for 14 teams.

No Club has shown even the slightest bit of interest in relocating.

So until a Sydney Club dies I can't see expansion for a very long time.

This is only because some clubs have salary caps and others have salary sombreros.

Tighter restrictions on 3 party agreements, the NRL taking over junior development, and better enforcement of the salary cap and you'd see the talent spread more evenly.

Just taking my club the Raiders, we've got Sam Williams, Kurt Baptiste, Brenko Lee, etc that are all NRL quality that're all in NSw cup (apart from Baptise), the Broncos practically have a second NRL quality squad under their international and Origin star studded first one.
If the NRL could make it that clubs couldn't stack talent and that talent wasn't just sitting idle just below the NRL then there'd be more then enough talent for 2 more clubs, chuck in some of the players that the NRL loses to the Super League every year and you've got plenty of talent and not enough opportunities for that talent to shine.

 

[T-Boon]

This is only because some clubs have salary caps and others have salary sombreros.

Tighter restrictions on 3 party agreements, the NRL taking over junior development, and better enforcement of the salary cap and you'd see the talent spread more evenly.

Just taking my club the Raiders, we've got Sam Williams, Kurt Baptiste, Brenko Lee, etc that are all NRL quality that're all in NSw cup (apart from Baptise), the Broncos practically have a second NRL quality squad under their international and Origin star studded first one.
If the NRL could make it that clubs couldn't stack talent and that talent wasn't just sitting idle just below the NRL then there'd be more then enough talent for 2 more clubs, chuck in some of the players that the NRL loses to the Super League every year and you've got plenty of talent and not enough opportunities for that talent to shine.

there are plenty of athletes for a new club. But decent skill players are few and far between. One solution would be make the game an 11 man game.

 

[alien]

i just think they should look after nsw and qld first, by bringing in a second brisbane team (jets) and central coast bears (who keep their north sydney junior district and play 1 home game per year at nth syd oval, during heritage round). 5 years later they can bring in perth and adelaide. that would make it a 20 team comp (keep the top 8) but only have 19 rounds (play every team once). that would leave plenty of time to have stand alone origin/rep weekends and plenty of test matches at end of season, and maybe have a nines world cup too sometime during the year. warriors should play only half of their home games in auckland and divide the rest evenly between wellington and christchurch. pacific nations like png, fiji, tonga, samoa to compete in qld cup or nsw cup

 

[RoosTah]

The trouble with a Sydney relocation at this point is that the Sydney clubs are almost all now reasonably stable.

I mean at this point, it's only Wests that are in any trouble financially and even then it's only the Balmain part of the equation.

There is of course a way to help the problem with depth - increase the level of investment in our development and bring more people coming into the game.

Personally, I actually think the competition could sustain 18 teams - there just needs to be a better spread of talent. In that regard, perhaps the NRL could think about a draft?

 

[Pommy]

This whole argument about not being enough talent to support more teams is bullshit. The biggest issue is there's no incentive to invest money in developing players.
In football clubs invest money in to it knowing that even if the nurturing team doesn't use the player there will be a pay day when he moves on.
If it was worthwhile NRL clubs could set up academy's in AU/NZ the pacific islands even Europe but there's no incentive to bother as it stands you could develop a dream tam but would have to ship them out as they woudnt all fit in the cap.

 

[Pommy]

Just a thought perhaps the NRL should be setting up proper NRL academy's using money from TV and then the clubs just fight over the players in the normal fashion.
But this would require some effort and vision.

 

[siv]

This whole argument about not being enough talent to support more teams is bullshit. The biggest issue is there's no incentive to invest money in developing players.
In football clubs invest money in to it knowing that even if the nurturing team doesn't use the player there will be a pay day when he moves on.
If it was worthwhile NRL clubs could set up academy's in AU/NZ the pacific islands even Europe but there's no incentive to bother as it stands you could develop a dream tam but would have to ship them out as they woudnt all fit in the cap.

Agree a bit of smart planning between FG and U20s by promoting a new grade or two would bridge the gap over 2 to 4 years

 

[Dragon Slayer]

This whole argument about not being enough talent to support more teams is bullshit. The biggest issue is there's no incentive to invest money in developing players.
In football clubs invest money in to it knowing that even if the nurturing team doesn't use the player there will be a pay day when he moves on.
If it was worthwhile NRL clubs could set up academy's in AU/NZ the pacific islands even Europe but there's no incentive to bother as it stands you could develop a dream tam but would have to ship them out as they woudnt all fit in the cap.

No the argument is real.

Just take a look at the roster of the Newcastle Knights.

And you're telling me there is enough talent for another Club or 2?

You're dreaming and like I said the only way new Clubs will emerge in the short term will be because of the demise of another.

But hey WA can keep planning for a team like the Central Coast has.

Enjoy the long ride........

 

[adamkungl]

Another Newcastle Knights and they might have more than 1 win :lol: (Roosters too )

 

[Pommy]

No the argument is real.

Just take a look at the roster of the Newcastle Knights.

And you're telling me there is enough talent for another Club or 2?

You're dreaming and like I said the only way new Clubs will emerge in the short term will be because of the demise of another.

But hey WA can keep planning for a team like the Central Coast has.

Enjoy the long ride........

As I said in the rest of my post its because nobody invests in developing players properly due to the fact its just not worthwhile, wheres the incentive?
If a niche sport like AFL can manage 18 teams without the sport being played properly abroad. Why can't RL with it being played abroad and having a fairly close game to poach people from as well?

 

[The Mad Hatter]

As I said in the rest of my post its because nobody invests in developing players properly due to the fact its just not worthwhile, wheres the incentive?
If a niche sport like AFL can manage 18 teams without the sport being played properly abroad. Why can't RL with it being played abroad and having a fairly close game to poach people from as well?

Some leading Afl minds are suggesting the Afl has six teams too many.

So it's not just nrl worrying.

I do think where teams are based within the nrl needs to be explored to maximise the spread, appeal and finances of the game.

 

[RoosTah]

Some leading Afl minds are suggesting the Afl has six teams too many.

So it's not just nrl worrying.

I do think where teams are based within the nrl needs to be explored to maximise the spread, appeal and finances of the game.

This is a fair point actually. When you look at the size of our country and the number of big pro football codes, it's hard to believe how many top line sides there are. With Super Rugby, the AFL, NRL and A-League we have almost 50 pro football teams.

In an ideal world, Sydney would have 2 teams (East and West - given that's the biggest cultural divide here), with Newcastle, the CC and Illawarra getting their own sides to give the state's other major regional centres fair representation, and then we'd have 2 NZ sides (North Island Warriors and South Island Bulls ... or something else the locals want), Melbourne, Canberra, 2 Brisbane sides, Perth, North Queensland and the GC (long term investment that one) for a 14 team competition.

 

[T-Boon]

This is a fair point actually. When you look at the size of our country and the number of big pro football codes, it's hard to believe how many top line sides there are. With Super Rugby, the AFL, NRL and A-League we have almost 50 pro football teams.

In an ideal world, Sydney would have 2 teams (East and West - given that's the biggest cultural divide here), with Newcastle, the CC and Illawarra getting their own sides to give the state's other major regional centres fair representation, and then we'd have 2 NZ sides (North Island Warriors and South Island Bulls ... or something else the locals want), Melbourne, Canberra, 2 Brisbane sides, Perth, North Queensland and the GC (long term investment that one) for a 14 team competition.

Thats how I see it. Less teams not more. Relocate a few Sydney teams and then I guess wait for a few other Sydney teams to die off as they just cannot compete.
The AFL only gets away with having as many clubs as they like because they really have no standards (what other football code would allow a team of 18 year olds to run around in the top premier competition?).

 

[Dragon Slayer]

Some leading Afl minds are suggesting the Afl has six teams too many.

So it's not just nrl worrying.

I do think where teams are based within the nrl needs to be explored to maximise the spread, appeal and finances of the game.

Exactly!

The AFL has some serious issues with a lot of their bottom clubs being no where near competitive.

Expansion for expansion sake will never be successful or improve a Competition unless you can guarantee the competition's standard won't decline.

Take a look at the circus the Rugby is at the moment.

So many dud teams dragging down the quality of the competition.

 

[Dogs Of War]

Exactly!

The AFL has some serious issues with a lot of their bottom clubs being no where near competitive.

Expansion for expansion sake will never be successful or improve a Competition unless you can guarantee the competition's standard won't decline.

Take a look at the circus the Rugby is at the moment.

So many dud teams dragging down the quality of the competition.

Thing is that sometimes to get more players, you need to open pathways, so a team in WA would do this. A second team in brisbane may see more pathways for QLD players.

 

[Pommy]

Exactly!

The AFL has some serious issues with a lot of their bottom clubs being no where near competitive.

Expansion for expansion sake will never be successful or improve a Competition unless you can guarantee the competition's standard won't decline.

Take a look at the circus the Rugby is at the moment.

So many dud teams dragging down the quality of the competition.

But AFL has to be much more limited in their options to bring on new talent. Its played properly in a couple of ozzie states and thats it there next closest thing is a semi pro sport in a country with a population less than Victoria.
Teams in WA and south island NZ should be able to bring more talent in to the game if they were given a chance. If someone was suggesting more teams in Sydney or even on the Central Coast I would agree that its not going to bring much more in to the playing pool.

 

[T-Boon]

Brisbane Tigers
Perth Panthers
Wellington Roosters
Adelaide Sharks

 

[jim_57]

Thing is that sometimes to get more players, you need to open pathways, so a team in WA would do this. A second team in brisbane may see more pathways for QLD players.

Pathways can be more than an NRL team though. Whilst I'm all for expansion to WA, Brisbane, NZ etc at NRL level, expansion at junior level is where we could make the most progress developing overall player strength/depth.

A revised Under 20's system of 2 state based conferences with extra teams like NZ×3, Fiji, WA, Melbourne, PNG×2, Darwin etc would be a winner for mine. Maybe with an eye towards NZ & the Pacific having their own conference within time.

 

[taipan]

Brisbane Tigers
Perth Panthers
Wellington Roosters
Adelaide Sharks

Darwin Dragons
Ballarat Bulldogs

Makes as much sense