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18th club, whose next?

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14,822
I’m pointing out the last time we negotiated with the existing broadcasters and gave in to everything they wanted, we got barely enough money to cover the cost of an team’s entry.

Was that a good strategy by your man Pete? Because he seems to absolutely got played on that one.

The goals of broadcasters and the game aren’t perfectly aligned and it’s foolish to think otherwise.
News Ltd provided an extra $100m over 5 years. That's $20m per annum. The annual grant is now $17m. That's more than enough to cover the Dolphins.
 
Messages
14,822
If you're going to use the Storm to argue that Perth will be successful then you need to factor in everything that made them what they are today.

  • $100m funding from News Ltd over 20 years.
  • The elimination of Crushers in 1997 and the Chargers a year or two later. This provided Melbourne Storm with access to disgruntled rugby league fans in SEQ and elite juniors.

    So Dolphins and Titans are going to be booted for Perth?
  • Mariners and Reds were culled in 1997. Quite a few of their quality players went to the Storm.

    So Storm and Newcastle will be booted for Perth?
  • A salary cap scandal to hoard a mega squad.
  • A Perth Glory team pulling 20k crowds like the Melbourne Victory did to get PRS upgraded.

Why will RL fans from SEQ have any interest in Perth when they now have content fans supporting the Broncos, Dolphins, Cowboys, Titans and Storm?
 

MugaB

Coach
Messages
15,089
I’m pointing out the last time we negotiated with the existing broadcasters and gave in to everything they wanted, we got barely enough money to cover the cost of an team’s entry.

Was that a good strategy by your man Pete? Because he seems to absolutely got played on that one.

The goals of broadcasters and the game aren’t perfectly aligned and it’s foolish to think otherwise.
Got to start somewhere, if they hadn't pushed the dolphins thru, the whole idea of expansion as a benefit would be lost on broadcasters and club bosses, yes we've had gold coast some 18 years ago, but that just meant expansion looked like another mouth the feed, NOW the way its a great way to add more value all round the game, so yeah broadcasters might have gotten that discount, but it was to start the ball rolling, now they're hooked, now the 9th game will cost, and so on... the bigger picture is coming... we could even get 22-24 teams, depending on how thet set up conferences or timeslots
 
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Iamback

Referee
Messages
20,332
Got to start somewhere, if they hadn't pushed the dolphins thru, the whole idea of expansion as a benefit would be lost on broadcasters and club bosses, yes we've had gold coast some 18 years ago, but that just meant expansion looked like another mouth the feed, NOW the way its a great way to add more value all round the game, so yeah broadcasters might have gotten that discount, but it was to start the ball rolling, now they're hooked, now the 9th game will cost, and so on... the bigger picture is coming... we could even get 22-24 teams, depending on how thet set up conferences or timeslots

If Dolphins brought in $20m for 12 games. You are looking at a minimum of $40m for team 18.

That isn't exactly just handing the rights across as some are saying
 

Canard

Immortal
Messages
35,611
If you're going to use the Storm to argue that Perth will be successful then you need to factor in everything that made them what they are today.

  • $100m funding from News Ltd over 20 years.
  • The elimination of Crushers in 1997 and the Chargers a year or two later. This provided Melbourne Storm with access to disgruntled rugby league fans in SEQ and elite juniors.

    So Dolphins and Titans are going to be booted for Perth?
  • Mariners and Reds were culled in 1997. Quite a few of their quality players went to the Storm.

    So Storm and Newcastle will be booted for Perth?
  • A salary cap scandal to hoard a mega squad.
  • A Perth Glory team pulling 20k crowds like the Melbourne Victory did to get PRS upgraded.

Why will RL fans from SEQ have any interest in Perth when they now have content fans supporting the Broncos, Dolphins, Cowboys, Titans and Storm?

Maybe a Perth team can appeal to a market that's not SEQ?

Radical suggestion, I know.

The conceit that SEQ somehow supplies the bulk of talent to the NRL, is laughably ignorant.
 

Canard

Immortal
Messages
35,611
If Dolphins brought in $20m for 12 games. You are looking at a minimum of $40m for team 18.

That isn't exactly just handing the rights across as some are saying
I thought it was widely reported that the NRL accepted a greatly reduced TV deal from Foxtel during Covid, as in a lot less then the originally agreed figure.

 

Iamback

Referee
Messages
20,332
I thought it was widely reported that the NRL accepted a greatly reduced TV deal from Foxtel during Covid, as in a lot less then the originally agreed figure.


That was before the breakdown of the AFL was known. You can't go whinging to Fox sports because AFL felt they should include Upgrades to Marvel Stadium when announcing TV rights

Also we had the CBA talks that were drawn out and all sort of petty arguments put out and not once did the players ( who would know the numbers) say anything about TV being low.

They were always saying the $ side of it was good it was add ons.

Nor have the clubs ( who also see the books ) said anything when the NRL opened them as part of the NRL policy.

The Rumours are of the $400m being cash figure. Certain reporting ( like when the FTA side was announced ) have the cash figure of $115m as the headline with the contra thrown into the article.

There are people with agendas that know the actual figure and nothing about it being unders for atleast 12 months now.
 

Canard

Immortal
Messages
35,611
That was before the breakdown of the AFL was known. You can't go whinging to Fox sports because AFL felt they should include Upgrades to Marvel Stadium when announcing TV rights

Also we had the CBA talks that were drawn out and all sort of petty arguments put out and not once did the players ( who would know the numbers) say anything about TV being low.

They were always saying the $ side of it was good it was add ons.

Nor have the clubs ( who also see the books ) said anything when the NRL opened them as part of the NRL policy.

The Rumours are of the $400m being cash figure. Certain reporting ( like when the FTA side was announced ) have the cash figure of $115m as the headline with the contra thrown into the article.

There are people with agendas that know the actual figure and nothing about it being unders for atleast 12 months now.
Yep, I'm not taking about what the AFL deal was, more that I thought the NRL reduced its original TV deal quite significantly during Covid.

Wasn't V'landys even quoted saying he did it to ensure Foxtel survived?
 

Canard

Immortal
Messages
35,611
Found it.


AW: Was it a mistake doing the deal with Foxtel during the pandemic?

At the time, Fox needed an asset on its sheet to continue its viability. If we didn’t come into play, there’d be no Foxtel.

AW: Isn’t that Rupert Murdoch’s problem, not rugby league’s?

If Foxtel coughs, all the codes catch a cold. If you haven’t got them in play, the other parties won’t be paying as much as they should because you need competitive tension. When COVID-19 hit, they were the only ones. If they went under, there was no-one else available.
 

Colk

First Grade
Messages
6,750
News Ltd provided an extra $100m over 5 years. That's $20m per annum. The annual grant is now $17m. That's more than enough to cover the Dolphins.

It’s barely more. If you take out the grant that they give the Dolphins they are making $15m over 5 years.

This is a deal for a side that broadcasters desperately wanted. That’s pathetic however you want to spin it.
 

Colk

First Grade
Messages
6,750
If Dolphins brought in $20m for 12 games. You are looking at a minimum of $40m for team 18.

That isn't exactly just handing the rights across as some are saying

If they only make $40m for an extra game then that’s not a very good result
 

Colk

First Grade
Messages
6,750
Colky you’re the one wanting maximum tv deals and then wanting teams that have no value for tv

pick one priority

Perth will mean a lower tv deal than Brisbane 3

if you think that’s worth it don’t complain about the size of the tv deal

My argument is not that complicated. I’m arguing that competitive tension will be more important than the location of this next side.

I can give you examples of different sports where they got increases because of competitive tension and didn’t have broadcasters tell them where the next side has to be.

Mate we are arguably the most slavish code to and for media interests and it hasn’t helped us; yet people are arguing for more of the same. I know it’s somewhat a hackneyed phrase but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result
 

Colk

First Grade
Messages
6,750
The last time the rights didn’t go to market

it was a renogiation of the existing contract


next time they will be going to market and the value of the dolphins will be realised

we saw what happened when the nrl did the opposite of what foxtel wanted under Dave smith and it was a disaster

working with broadcasters is the smart way to go until there is genuine competition for the fta and pay rights

as long as Fox keep the rights Perth is worth nothing to broadcasters

Who told him to do that during a pandemic and better yet for such an extended period?

Do you think it was a smart idea to negotiate a long term deal during a pandemic? I don’t think many other businesses would be doing that and for good reason.
 

Wb1234

Immortal
Messages
33,795
My argument is not that complicated. I’m arguing that competitive tension will be more important than the location of this next side.

I can give you examples of different sports where they got increases because of competitive tension and didn’t have broadcasters tell them where the next side has to be.

Mate we are arguably the most slavish code to and for media interests and it hasn’t helped us; yet people are arguing for more of the same. I know it’s somewhat a hackneyed phrase but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result
Competitive tension will happen with or without the brisbane easts that’s a dumb argument

on top of competitive bidding broadcasters have certain wants which the game would be stupid to ignore
 

Maximus

Coach
Messages
13,705
It is crazy that we have people defending a deal that even the person who negotiated the deal is trying to find excuses for.

It's a cult. You must support every decision made, and worship Vlandys. Any criticism of anything results in you being dogpiled by the pack.
 
Messages
14,822
My argument is not that complicated. I’m arguing that competitive tension will be more important than the location of this next side.

So @Perth Red lied when he said we need teams in Adelaide and Perth within the next decade or we'll fall behind?

I know it’s somewhat a hackneyed phrase but the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting a different result

@Perth Red, @mongoose and @The Great Dane have been arguing the same case for years, with no sign of the ARLC ever agreeing with them.
 
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MugaB

Coach
Messages
15,089
It's a cult. You must support every decision made, and worship Vlandys. Any criticism of anything results in you being dogpiled by the pack.
Oh no, we'll end up with a horses head in our bed, nice one maxipad... are you following the karen parade too
 
Messages
14,822
Who told him to do that during a pandemic and better yet for such an extended period?

Do you think it was a smart idea to negotiate a long term deal during a pandemic? I don’t think many other businesses would be doing that and for good reason.
V'landys didn't do the game aby favours, but what choice did he have?

Greenberg and Smith were ousted by the clubs when the broadcasters chucked a fit.

If we're to believe @mongoose, @The Great Dane and @Perth Red when they say News Ltd will block the Brisbane Tigers then we cannot expect the ARLC to not pander to its broadcast partners.
 

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