FIFA 2022 WORLD CUP - NRL Support

[BunniesMan]

Is this League Unlimited or the Urban Planners Institue of Australia website??

This is a thread on the FIFA 2022 world cup, infrastructure is a major part of that.

 

[chefman21]

A f*cking tram will allow people to commute from Taree? :lol:

No. But if the government looks at rail seriously they will look at both light, medium and heavy rail and how they can utilise and implement facilities for a potential high speed rail system in the future. It should be looked at under the banner of "rail" and then include the above categories.

The last thing Australia needs is it's big cities to keep growing. Sydney is a choked up ghetto as it is.

Unfortunately population growth means cities and regional centres will continue to grow. There is no stopping it, short of a massive war or event of Biblical magnitude. Neither of which I want to happen in my lifetime. By investing in infrastructure that reduces congestion, housing affordability and the tyranny of distance etc, you allow for larger populations to expand at a sustainable rate. If you can build a high speed rail link to current regional (as opposed to extreme regional) areas for example, you allow for people to move either outwards for a seachange, stay where they are and utilise high speed rail to cities, or move inwards to newly vacant and/or created areas. The broadband network for example allows people to work from home while still maintaining productivity, or opens opportunities up for regional citizens to work in the city remotely from home. The tyranny of distance needs to be limited as much as possible.

Besides, the state govt has no money to pour into upgrading transport for a f*cking soccer tournament.

They have to pour money into transport and infrastructure sooner or later. Soccer tournament or not. It's getting - and in some cases got - to the point where current infrastructure is struggling to support current population demands.

The best League can get out of this - -part from token improvements - is a new stadium in Townsville. Brisbane has Lang, Sydney has SFS and ANZ. Melbourne has the Rorters Stadium. Other League areas: Gold Coast (the plastic is still on parts of Robina), Newy (new stands under construction) and Canberra (fairly new and serving its purpose). Unless FIFA have plans for Brookie, Kogarah or Leichhardt.

League will get nothing but a massive disruption in 2022 and a lack of sponsors from 2017-2024 a least.

The big picture for this country is that we need to look at ways of improving infrastructure and creating new revenue streams as priorities. One benefit to league is more international exposure about the culture of our country which includes league. This means potential international investors and sponsorship.

The Olympics was fantastic for Sydney. Improvements to facilities and transport - and ANZ. That aside, League got cosmetic benefits at most - PArra and the SFS were the only grounds used, and swet FA changes occurred. And all the infrastructure was focused on Sydney. Same with the Yawnion WC - League grounds became a promotion for the alternative code. League will get nothing out of Soccer

Apart from stadium improvements, there is exposure to foreigners, increased tourism and better facilities for locals. It's not like they disappear after the event. What's underlying though is the big focus on infrastructure and supporting population growth in the country from politicians and policy makers. After that report was released by Infrastructure Australia, and the big focus on immigration and population growth at around the same time and earlier by opinion leaders, infrastructure became the key focus. Things like health and education have taken a back seat somewhat to broadband networks (a form of infrastructure). It's got to the point where population and quality of life sustainability means investing in infrastructure to reduce the tyranny of distance that is one of the core problems/issues involved with this country.

The World Cup bid is just a medium for justifying the spend on infrastructure to the public, so that people forget that some of this stuff should have been done 30 or 40 years ago, such as freight networks, water supply and rail links that are now 10 times more expensive. These are the boring things that nobody notices (i.e an office worker won't notice freight systems) or don't care about (such as port facilities) which don't win votes as compared to tax cuts, baby bonuses and payouts. But they are core to the sustainability and expansion (financial, population etc) of the country and allow for greater productivity and revenue streams. Any further benefits on top of that are just a bonus. The World Cup bid is beneficial just for the improved infrastructure, let alone the rest. For a country the size of ours, infrastructure should be our single most important - and often greatest - spend. It's far more important than short term tax cuts. The entire country should be behind this. League should be behind the bid just for the exposure it brings and the better facilities. I can't see any major problems with bidding, as long as it is done properly and with a bit of forethought.

 

[Schiltzenberger]

Not sure how Blacktown will be a white elephant...

It would be good to have most of the Western Sydney teams play out of one stadium. You would hope that games like Dogs v Eels would be able to sell 40k to regular season matches in 12 years time

Have you not bothered to read anything in this thread?
The Blacktown stadium will be reduced to 26k after the WC.

When it is built it will be 41k but who knows when it'll be ready? they may only finish it 6-12 months before the WC. Even if it's done earlier it will only be 41k for a limited amount of time.

When it gets reduced after the WC no NRL team would bother making the effort to move a game to 26k stadium, all the big games of Western Sydney teams will go to ANZ. I can see trial games being played there but not an NRL match.

As I said before I think Blacktown stadium is a present to the A-League, they'll have a team playing there.

Also, having most western Sydney teams playing out of one stadium is ridiculous. It's bad enough already having so many games at ANZ and SFS.
The Roosters and Rabbits playing out of the SFS is hard to change but no other team should use it. All the others should play out of their own stadium, Parra at Parra, Dogs at ANZ, Tigers at Campbelltown, Penrith at Penrith and Illawarra at Wollongong.
This whole 'we'll play 6 here and 6 there' or we'll play 5 here 5 there and 2 somewhere else' is a bloody joke. Look at the Dogs they played something like 75% of their games at ANZ because other teams played out of there or moved games there.

 

[Proud2BeCanberran]

Qatar are long shots IMO. The WC will be in the middle of summer over there, 40C+ :shock:

You would think so wouldn't you. If this was a clean bidding race, they wouldn't even be in contention for it, however, there seems to be a lot of secret agreements behind closed doors in regards to the Qatar bid. Maybe not enough to see them through, but definitely enough to keep them in the race.

 

[BuffaloRules]

No. But if the government looks at rail seriously they will look at both light, medium and heavy rail and how they can utilise and implement facilities for a potential high speed rail system in the future. It should be looked at under the banner of "rail" and then include the above categories.

So you are saying that the whole rail transport system in Sydney ( and 300km around) will be examined and improved by the NSW/Federal goverment as a result of having a one month soccer tournament?

Where is the money coming from? Our state goverment hasnt got two bob to scratch themselves with..

FIFA must have really deep pockets if they are going to pick up the tab for a high speed rail network..

 

[chefman21]

So you are saying that the whole rail transport system in Sydney ( and 300km around) will be examined and improved by the NSW/Federal goverment as a result of having a one month soccer tournament?

Where is the money coming from? Our state goverment hasnt got two bob to scratch themselves with..

FIFA must have really deep pockets if they are going to pick up the tab for a high speed rail network..

I'm saying that if they look at it seriously and they decide it is an investment they need to make then if they do it seriously they will look at light, medium and heavy rail as a whole, rather than a single system. FIFA isn't going to build a high speed rail system, nor would you expect them to. And a high speed rail system won't be built for the World Cup. The funding isn't there and it will take far too long to build even if there was. But if the government does it seriously they will use a bit of forethought and install basic facilities needed for a high speed rail system in the future, so as to save money and time later. It might be as simple as high voltage connectors in likely transport hubs or expanding tunnel size slightly so trains fit or even just bigger exhaust fans. Nothing major, but those little things are harder and hence more expensive to install later on. The World Cup bid will be mostly local area rail.

The World Cup bid requires both federal and state level funding. According to the report released by Infrastructure Australia, expanding transport facilities in various states is a federal level event and as such will require federal level funding, just like the NBN has. If transport facilities need improving to have the bid accepted, then it makes sense to knock those transport projects off the list that are considered national priorities.

 

[Loudstrat]

Well the NSW govt cannot afford a rail link to Rouse Hill, so high speed rail to Taree is as likely as a Bunnies premiership, or Alice Springs hosting the Winter Olympics. Only corporates can fund that, and a soccer tournament won't be the catalyst.

And I fail to see how League will get exposure os. Or how tourism helps the NRL.

 

[Canard]

This is a thread on the FIFA 2022 world cup, infrastructure is a major part of that.

Agreed, espeically stadia and transport, but what areas of Sydney you would like to see developed into a second CBD or the provision of rail infrastructure to regional NSW are pretty obtruse?

 

[chefman21]

Well the NSW govt cannot afford a rail link to Rouse Hill, so high speed rail to Taree is as likely as a Bunnies premiership, or Alice Springs hosting the Winter Olympics. Only corporates can fund that, and a soccer tournament won't be the catalyst.

It requires federal level funding as well as some state funding and public-private partnerships. Corporates will help fund it because it's in their best interests to be part of major infrastructure projects in this country. If that means been part of a World Cup bid then so be it. Page 54 of the basic report listed below. What I've been saying the entire time.:roll:

http://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/files/Report_to_COAG_2010.pdf


This is an even more basic listing with costing estimates.
http://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/files/National_Infrastructure_Priorities.pdf

And this is the reasoning.
http://www.infrastructureaustralia...._to_the_Council_of_Australian_Governments.pdf

And I fail to see how League will get exposure os. Or how tourism helps the NRL.

The country gets exposure overseas, which also means local culture gets exposure. That means rugby league gets exposure. If the NRL is smart, they will be talking to foreign investors before, during and after the World Cup is on. They will spend the extra required to advertise the game during the World Cup. And they will still run a competition out of regional stadiums to show off it's wares during the World Cup. Even that has benefits in that regional rugby league gets to see NRL games. I'd love to see games been played out of Coffs Harbour, Wagga Wagga, Dubbo, Rockhampton, Mackay and Bundaberg for 4 weeks.

Tourism helps the NRL indirectly. If tourism increases, it provides a brand new revenue stream, which means more funds available so state and federal governments. Here's the difficult bit. If there is more funds available it means more potential funding is available to league. Hard huh?

 

[kmav23]

This is a blow, but not the be all end all. You'll find Australia has a lot of 2nd choices, but at the same time a fair few first choices. The 2nd choices will come into play in the last few rounds, when you will have various countries already eliminated. Australia, if reports are to be believed, have around 7 votes for the first round. And this, on top of the 2nd choice votes should carry them to the last round. SHOULD.

The US are favourites, however some rumours suggest that the European representatives will vote in favour of an Asian country ahead of them for various reasons... whether this will be Australia or Qatar... who knows?

I cant see how the USA will get as many votes

1. Soccer is not as well supported

2. They already hosted 1994 how can they host again so soon when aust has no hosted it !!! only italy, brazil and france have hosted it twice..

3.Politics... america is not very popular in middle east and europe

4. Oceania only region have never hosted..

 

[BuffaloRules]

Some things in favour of the US bid;

1. About 50-75 capacity 60,000 + quality rectangle stadiums already in existance

2. More TV friendly time zones for Europe

3. By 2022 it will have been 28 years since North America ( CONCACAF federation) has hosted the Cup.

4. Higher average attended local competition than the A League

5. The richest country in the world with 350 Million population versus a country one twelth the size...

 

[docbrown]

We don't need another stadium in the city. We already have the SFS and that just services the Roosters and the Tigers part time. All the other Sydney clubs are based too far away to use a stadium in the CBD. Blacktown may not be the perfect spot, but Parramatta, Penrith and even potentially the Tigers and Bulldogs could take big games there.

Let's face it - Stadium Australia is just too big for regular NRL club games and the sightlines are design for an athletics track, not a rectangular game.

I'm not talking about the CBD - that's what SFS is for. You could put a new stadium somewhere in the Parramatta, Bankstown and Fairfield triangle, close enough to service three of the big 5 - Eels, Bulldogs & Tigers - and perhaps some Rabbitohs/Dragons games - and then Union & A League. It would be the most used stadium in the city. If the NRL could get involved in the management trust, it would be a huge windfall for the game.

Blacktown only works for possibly the Eels and the A-League club. If the Eels don't move, you will have an empty stadium for most of the year = White Elephant.

As for the World Cup speculation, I suspect the US will get it - because everything that Australia has to offer, they can offer ten fold.

 

[chefman21]

How many stadiums do we really need to build? There are heaps that could be refurbished into world class stadiums, such as what happened at Lang Park. The SFS and ANZ (Qld) come to mind straight away. We've already got some big bastards in Homebush, Etihad and the MCG and two of those are rectangular. Suncorp is no slouch either. Then there are the newer stadiums which are a bit smaller such as AAMI Park and Skilled. You can only fill so many stadiums regularly.

 

[DRAGONZ_RULE]

I would love to have the WC here in Australia but half of the stadiums are going to be ovals, which is just crap. I include Stadium Australia in that as well because it's not a proper rectangle stadium, when it's configured for League it still feels like an oval. It's just a crap stadium anyway, too many seats up high on the sides and not enough at the ends.

To be fair, Germany is a football powerhouse, both domestically and internationally, and a hell of a lot of their major stadiums are in fact oval-shaped as they have athletics tracks around the field of play.

From memory, even the WC Final in 2006 was played at a ground with an Athletics track around the outside.

Oval fields are clearly not the be all and end all from FIFA's point of view, but rectangular fields are preferred.

 

[Loudstrat]

It requires federal level funding as well as some state funding and public-private partnerships. Corporates will help fund it because it's in their best interests to be part of major infrastructure projects in this country. If that means been part of a World Cup bid then so be it. Page 54 of the basic report listed below. What I've been saying the entire time.:roll:

http://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/files/Report_to_COAG_2010.pdf


This is an even more basic listing with costing estimates.
http://www.infrastructureaustralia.gov.au/files/National_Infrastructure_Priorities.pdf

And this is the reasoning.
http://www.infrastructureaustralia...._to_the_Council_of_Australian_Governments.pdf

Sorry mate, I'm not anal enough to read infreastructure reports costing Australian rail when I just want to talk footy. However, the Fed Govt hasn't got the money either, or they would not be relying on corporate $. Besides, Corporates are full of hot air too (TNT and the VFT to Melbourne), and not necessarily the best thinkers (Pacific National almost shutting down wheat trains, TNT building the dud monorail)

Anyway, I fail to see how a mega fast tram from Taree will help the NRL.

The country gets exposure overseas, which also means local culture gets exposure. That means rugby league gets exposure

.
How much exposure did Union get from the Soccer WC in Seff Effrica? None. 2 reasons:Soccer wont allow it, and no one wanting to watch soccer would be interested.

The only local African culture that got exposed was that some f*ckwit invented an annoying plastic toy that went zzzzzzzzzzz at high pitch.

If the NRL is smart, they will be talking to foreign investors before, during and after the World Cup is on

. The NRL IS Foreign Investment - half owned by a US media company.

They will spend the extra required to advertise the game during the World Cup.

Yeah right. Halftime in the world cup final - broadcast to the world "Don't watch this boring sh*t. Watch Penrith vs the Raiders". You dumb moron!

And they will still run a competition out of regional stadiums to show off it's wares during the World Cup.

Yeah? Like the game gets no exposure in the regions? Ever hear of a f*cking television????

Even that has benefits in that regional rugby league gets to see NRL games. I'd love to see games been played out of Coffs Harbour, Wagga Wagga, Dubbo, Rockhampton, Mackay and Bundaberg for 4 weeks.

Wrong. I want it played at Parramatta, Kogarah, Lang, EA and Dairy Farmers etc where it belongs.

Tourism helps the NRL indirectly. If tourism increases, it provides a brand new revenue stream, which means more funds available so state and federal governments. Here's the difficult bit. If there is more funds available it means more potential funding is available to league. Hard huh?

And League is the first thing a govt will spend money on? If Tourism increased by $1 billion per annum, the NRL would be lucky to get one cent extra in revenue.

 

[Bumble]

The last U.S world cup was a joke. Not a single game was sold out, including the final.

A quarterfinal between Brazil and the Netherlands had like 25,000 empty seats. And they want one again less than 30 years later? Get f**ked.

 

[chefman21]

Sorry mate, I'm not anal enough to read infreastructure reports costing Australian rail when I just want to talk footy. However, the Fed Govt hasn't got the money either, or they would not be relying on corporate $. Besides, Corporates are full of hot air too (TNT and the VFT to Melbourne), and not necessarily the best thinkers (Pacific National almost shutting down wheat trains, TNT building the dud monorail)

So you want to base your comments on a lack of information? Okay. Sounds like the Australian public at an election.

Private-public partnerships are increasingly common and bring benefits to both companies.

Anyway, I fail to see how a mega fast tram from Taree will help the NRL.

It won't. But it helps Australia enormously. f**k the NRL for the moment. Think of the country as a whole.

.
How much exposure did Union get from the Soccer WC in Seff Effrica? None. 2 reasons:Soccer wont allow it, and no one wanting to watch soccer would be interested.

Soccer won't allow it? Australia is a free country and if the NRL is willing to fork out the dollars then there is no law saying they can't advertise.

The only local African culture that got exposed was that some f*ckwit invented an annoying plastic toy that went zzzzzzzzzzz at high pitch.

bullsh*t.

. The NRL IS Foreign Investment - half owned by a US media company.

Good. Bring more of it on. Just because News Limited screwed up doesn't mean others will.

Yeah right. Halftime in the world cup final - broadcast to the world "Don't watch this boring sh*t. Watch Penrith vs the Raiders". You dumb moron!

No. You advertise the game not the games.

Yeah? Like the game gets no exposure in the regions? Ever hear of a f*cking television????

You don't think or can't see any benefits for running NRL games in regional Australia?

Wrong. I want it played at Parramatta, Kogarah, Lang, EA and Dairy Farmers etc where it belongs.

Regional Australia is just as important to rugby league as the city. Stop being such a narrow minded twat. It will be a massive thing for regional rugby league to see half a dozen NRL games live and at the stadium. You will sell out the stadiums.

And League is the first thing a govt will spend money on? If Tourism increased by $1 billion per annum, the NRL would be lucky to get one cent extra in revenue.

If the NRL invests in the bid they definitely will. They get ownership of a stadium or whatever, and the government has to pay them dividends. And even if they don't invest in the bid, with more money available to spend for the Government it means they have more money to spend on the country. Rugby league won't be the first thing that sees spending, nor should it be. Health, education, infrastructure and the like are far more important than a bunch of blokes kicking a ball around. But if they have more revenue to spend on these things, later they won't need to spend as much on them and then we start to see benefits.

 

[BuffaloRules]

The last U.S world cup was a joke. Not a single game was sold out, including the final.

A quarterfinal between Brazil and the Netherlands had like 25,000 empty seats. And they want one again less than 30 years later? Get f**ked.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1994_FIFA_World_Cup

Average attendance was nearly 69,000, which broke records that had stood since the 1950 World Cup, because of the bigger capacities of the American stadiums compared to those of Europe and Latin America. The total attendance of nearly 3.6 million for the final tournament remains the highest in World Cup history, despite the expansion of the competition from 24 to 32 teams (and from 52 to 64 matches) in the 1998 World Cup.

I know you want Australia to win the World Cup, but dont make sh*t up....

 

[Bumble]

How did those numbers you quoted disprove anything I said you pleb?

Although I didn't realise the capacity of the Cotton Bowl was only 72,500 in 1994. So oops...there was only about 10,000 empty seats at that quarter final. :lol:

http://www.fifa.com/worldcup/archive/edition=84/results/matches/match=3104/report.html

The capacity of the Rose Bowl at that time was 100,500. Would you like to tell me the official attendance of the final, as reported by FIFA in that link? (for anyone that cbf there was around 6,000 empty seats at the final)

You would EXPECT it to have the highest average crowd genius, since it has the most people of any country that has hosted the world cup. If you don't sell out the final, that's a failure right there. I mean f**k, the link you quoted even TELLS you why it had the best crowds ever. And psst...it wasn't because the Americans love their soccerball.

 

[BuffaloRules]

Listen you Pillock - Do you think you could have rocked up on the day and got a ticket to a game like Italy v Ireland at Giants Stadium..

http://www.comptroller.nyc.gov/bureaus/opm/h9f.shtm

Attendance
On the attendance side, every available seat in Giants Stadium has been sold. This opens the door to scalpers who have been doing very well indeed. For example, tickets to the Italy-Ireland game with a face value of $40 were being resold for $400 and those with a face value of $100 were being resold for $600 or more

Every ticket to every game at Giants Stadium was bought by somebody...