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Future NRL Stadiums

Yosemite Sam

Juniors
Messages
741
Dave Smith has never stated he wants a 2 stadium strategy. It's all about playing the right games at the right venues. Big Sydney derbies will be played at ANZ/SFS, while the suburban grounds will always be used for the smaller games.

They aren't going to disappear completely.

And while Liverpool may look like a good location on a map, it is extremely poorly served by public transport for anyone coming from the city. The South & Bankstown lines are two of the slowest on the entire network. Add to that the stadium site is nowhere near Liverpool station.

F*ck Liverpool off, it's never gonna happen.
 

reanimate

Bench
Messages
3,828
i know about the traffic on military road.

brookie wont get more than $50 million if its lucky, which wont make it a 30k all seater.

in the future the clubs who dont play out of big stadiums will get left behind by those that do

not just on crowd numbers, but also corporate facilities.

id say 6 games at brookvale, the rest at SFS or SCG

try to work with the ARLC to get the SFS games schedule for a sat night, or perhaps a sunday afternoon, avoid friday games.

fans of my club (dragons) were adamant they wouldnt travel to ANZ, now because the club is losing money they have accepted it, indeed we got 20k vs tigers,which we wouldnt have got at either win stadium

It's not just Military Rd, traffic through Brookvale, Frenches Forest, Forestville and sometimes Collaroy, Mona Vale and Terry Hills also gets insane around peak hour now. And with the developments in Warriewood valley and more apartments popping up in areas like Narrabeen, it's only going to keep getting worse.

A 25-30k stadium would probably be fine for Brookvale, with the odd big game being moved to the SFS (no one would stump up the cash if Manly only played 6 games there). The Dragons situation for its Sydney fans is different, you've got access to far better public transport options for ANZ, i.e. free train travel as a part of your ticket cost- there's no free bus or ferry travel for fans in the North to get to the SFS/ANZ, and even if there was, it's not going to make the insurmountable travel times after work to those stadiums for weekday games go away.

Basically, the North needs some attention, the NRL needs to make a decision as to what to do with the North Shore- either bring in the Bears or extend Manly's territory, and help get a decent stadium get set up there, making all fans in the North travel to the SFS/ANZ simply won't work. The neglect the area has suffered is absolute insanity.
 

bottle

Coach
Messages
14,126
Homebush Stadium with a roof on it wont 'be fine'.
It would be a turd with a roof over it.

Homebush Stadium converted to a rectangular stadium would be a turd configured into a rectangle.

I agree that the area itself can be salvaged given improvements in amenities and transport.
However give Sydney what it deserves, a new purpose built large capacity rectangular stadium - at Homebush.
 

georgesnmith

Juniors
Messages
1,781
It's not just Military Rd, traffic through Brookvale, Frenches Forest, Forestville and sometimes Collaroy, Mona Vale and Terry Hills also gets insane around peak hour now. And with the developments in Warriewood valley and more apartments popping up in areas like Narrabeen, it's only going to keep getting worse.

A 25-30k stadium would probably be fine for Brookvale, with the odd big game being moved to the SFS (no one would stump up the cash if Manly only played 6 games there). The Dragons situation for its Sydney fans is different, you've got access to far better public transport options for ANZ, i.e. free train travel as a part of your ticket cost- there's no free bus or ferry travel for fans in the North to get to the SFS/ANZ, and even if there was, it's not going to make the insurmountable travel times after work to those stadiums for weekday games go away.

Basically, the North needs some attention, the NRL needs to make a decision as to what to do with the North Shore- either bring in the Bears or extend Manly's territory, and help get a decent stadium get set up there, making all fans in the North travel to the SFS/ANZ simply won't work. The neglect the area has suffered is absolute insanity.

cant see brookie ever having more than 10k seats, 15k tops. and limited corporate facilities.

and the club has to pay to use it

at SFS they would be paid i think it is $100,000 per game. no comparison from a revenue viewpoint.

manly are averaging 14k with a top team, what happens if the club start missing the 8?

its what happened to the dragons.
 

georgesnmith

Juniors
Messages
1,781
Homebush Stadium with a roof on it wont 'be fine'.
It would be a turd with a roof over it.

Homebush Stadium converted to a rectangular stadium would be a turd configured into a rectangle.

I agree that the area itself can be salvaged given improvements in amenities and transport.
However give Sydney what it deserves, a new purpose built large capacity rectangular stadium - at Homebush.

yeh like thats ever going to happen. maybe they can make it out of gold
 

reanimate

Bench
Messages
3,828
cant see brookie ever having more than 10k seats, 15k tops. and limited corporate facilities.

and the club has to pay to use it

at SFS they would be paid i think it is $100,000 per game. no comparison from a revenue viewpoint.

manly are averaging 14k with a top team, what happens if the club start missing the 8?

its what happened to the dragons.

No comparison from a revenue viewpoint, but if the fans can't get there, then what's the point? Warringah Council are being complete dicks about the use of Brookvale Oval, they jacked up Manly's rent costs this year, quoting maintenance costs, without considering the fact that if Manly doesn't play there and keep contributing money towards the upkeep of Brookie, the Council will have to stump up far, far, far more of their own money to keep it maintained. The site of Brookvale Oval can never be anything but a field/oval, so Warringah Council can't sell it or use the site for anything else, without a major tenant in the Sea Eagles, the cost of maintaining the site will fall to them, and them alone.
 

georgesnmith

Juniors
Messages
1,781
No comparison from a revenue viewpoint, but if the fans can't get there, then what's the point? Warringah Council are being complete dicks about the use of Brookvale Oval, they jacked up Manly's rent costs this year, quoting maintenance costs, without considering the fact that if Manly doesn't play there and keep contributing money towards the upkeep of Brookie, the Council will have to stump up far, far, far more of their own money to keep it maintained. The site of Brookvale Oval can never be anything but a field/oval, so Warringah Council can't sell it or use the site for anything else, without a major tenant in the Sea Eagles, the cost of maintaining the site will fall to them, and them alone.

i dont mind brookvale oval just looking at it from a revenue POV.

a dream site would be that cricket oval right in the heart of manly shops.
 

georgesnmith

Juniors
Messages
1,781
That settles it then. No other hypotheticals to be discussed other than your own because you deem it not to be feasible.
A roofed, reconfigured turd it is then.

its not that bad.

with 30k in its fine

with 40k in its good

and with 70k+ its fantastic
 

bobmar28

Bench
Messages
4,304
Liverpool is terrible area to get to as well as being a terrible part of Sydney full stop. Can't see it happening. Either parra will be upgraded or blacktown might get a stadium. The location is anz is pretty much the centre of Sydney, maybe they could knock down the athletics centre and build a stadium there!

Liverpool is very easy to get to by using the M5, M7, Hume Highway, Or the nearby station.

A new stadium there would be a better idea than spending a fortune reconfiguring ANZ.
 

bobmar28

Bench
Messages
4,304
its a wasteland.

none of those fans will want to travel in large numbers to a small suburbs in the south west of sydney

it would take panthers fans over an hour i guess to get there. from belmore / homebush same for dogs fans, almost 90 mins from lillfield / leichardt

the dogs gave up on oasis ages ago they are settled at homebush

a stadium at liverpool will be a bigger white elephant than ANZ stadium it, which is at least in the actual centre of sydney

the state govt wont be funding this

....
 
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bobmar28

Bench
Messages
4,304
its a wasteland.

none of those fans will want to travel in large numbers to a small suburbs in the south west of sydney

it would take panthers fans over an hour i guess to get there. from belmore / homebush same for dogs fans, almost 90 mins from lillfield / leichardt

the dogs gave up on oasis ages ago they are settled at homebush

a stadium at liverpool will be a bigger white elephant than ANZ stadium it, which is at least in the actual centre of sydney

the state govt wont be funding this

A wasteland? A small suburb?

Liverpool City council area has a population of 200,000. Half a dozen ten storey apartment buildings under construction. About a dozen recently built. Easy to get to using M5, M7, Hume Highway and trains. The adjoining suburb - Fairfield has a bigger population.
 
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bobmar28

Bench
Messages
4,304
liverpool is in the south west. its near none of them. putting a new stadium which is near none of the clubs is a dumb idea.

homebush kills liverpool as a location to get too.

id much rather go to a night game in homebush than liverpool, or have to catch a train from their at night to go home

the state govt wont be wasting hundreds of millions on this white elephant when theyve already got one at homebush to service.

and try driving from parramatta to liverpool in traffic, or from penrith to liverpool in traffic.

If any stadium in the west gets money it will be parramatta as they share with an A League club

if they have to spend $300 million on a new stadium in liverpool or a roof at homebush they will go with the latter

the state govenment has already called for costings on a roof at homebush they are looking at it closely.

Penrith to Liverpool in traffic? When was the last time you used the M4/M7? There's never any traffic.
 

bobmar28

Bench
Messages
4,304
Dave Smith has never stated he wants a 2 stadium strategy. It's all about playing the right games at the right venues. Big Sydney derbies will be played at ANZ/SFS, while the suburban grounds will always be used for the smaller games.

They aren't going to disappear completely.

And while Liverpool may look like a good location on a map, it is extremely poorly served by public transport for anyone coming from the city. The South & Bankstown lines are two of the slowest on the entire network. Add to that the stadium site is nowhere near Liverpool station.

F*ck Liverpool off, it's never gonna happen.

Woodward park is about 500 metres from the station. There's room for 1000 parking spaces.
 

duylm

Juniors
Messages
126
A couple of people have argued that Liverpool is not central and is a wasteland in the middle of nowhere, difficult to get to from the east. I think that misses the point that Liverpool would be an ideal place for all the WESTERN SYDNEY clubs to share. Look at a map between Parramatta, Bankstown, Campbelltown and Penrith. The distances are pretty huge and if you try to find the midpoint, Liverpool is close enough while being it's own satellite city and and a transport hub where the trainline is a junction of more than 1 line (3 to be exact).

Yes the place has gone backwards over the last few decades, but hey, a new sporting/entertainment precinct (i.e. stadium rock concerts) may drive reinvigeration of the area. Hell even the Wanderers might want to play there. Don't 2M people live in that Western corridor with the highest growth rates of Sydney both nominally and as a percentage? Build it for where the most people will live in the future.
 

Slick

Juniors
Messages
215
A couple of people have argued that Liverpool is not central and is a wasteland in the middle of nowhere, difficult to get to from the east. I think that misses the point that Liverpool would be an ideal place for all the WESTERN SYDNEY clubs to share. Look at a map between Parramatta, Bankstown, Campbelltown and Penrith. The distances are pretty huge and if you try to find the midpoint, Liverpool is close enough while being it's own satellite city and and a transport hub where the trainline is a junction of more than 1 line (3 to be exact).

Yes the place has gone backwards over the last few decades, but hey, a new sporting/entertainment precinct (i.e. stadium rock concerts) may drive reinvigeration of the area. Hell even the Wanderers might want to play there. Don't 2M people live in that Western corridor with the highest growth rates of Sydney both nominally and as a percentage? Build it for where the most people will live in the future.

Are Parra fans from the Hills District in north-west Sydney expected to travel all the way to Liverpool to watch the Eels play? Never going to happen. Liverpool doesn't make any sense it's not a central location.

Ideally you would have a stadium for the city - SFS, a stadium for the inner-west - Homebush and a stadium for the greater-west. A greater-west stadium if it was ever to be built has to sit roughly west of the CBD so it's accessible to fans from the north-west and south-west, ie: a central location. That puts it somewhere between Parra and Penrith with Blacktown being the obvious choice IMHO.
 

duylm

Juniors
Messages
126
Are Parra fans from the Hills District in north-west Sydney expected to travel all the way to Liverpool to watch the Eels play? Never going to happen. Liverpool doesn't make any sense it's not a central location.

Ideally you would have a stadium for the city - SFS, a stadium for the inner-west - Homebush and a stadium for the greater-west. A greater-west stadium if it was ever to be built has to sit roughly west of the CBD so it's accessible to fans from the north-west and south-west, ie: a central location. That puts it somewhere between Parra and Penrith with Blacktown being the obvious choice IMHO.


Yeah Blacktown is also good, but in that scenario the Campbelltown fans become isolated. Campbelltown to Blacktown is a decent trek, 45 min drive, 1:15 train trip. Having said that I can see that driving from castle hill to Liverpool is close to 50 mins. A 3 stadium solution does look more suitable for Sydney.

/edit wouldn't Parramatta play put of Homebush in your instance with 3 stadiums? Then Liverpool might work for all the other clubs.
 
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bottle

Coach
Messages
14,126
its not that bad.

with 30k in its fine

with 40k in its good

and with 70k+ its fantastic

We will have to agree to disagree.
If you are talking about the general 'vibe' of the place as the crowd figures increase, I will concede that it is better with larger numbers.
However nothing will improve it as a viewing spectacle. Indeed it could be argued that as crowd numbers increase, it's amenity as a place to watch the game decreases as more people get pushed further up the tiers of the turd.
 

oikee

Juniors
Messages
1,973
Hello, got kicked off a couple of other sites, well not kicked off totalrl, but they seem a little odd to me.
Maybe it was me.
Look, this stadiums issue in Sydney is a complete ballsup. I dont know why our code or any other code puts up with it, they should be refusing to play our normal rounds games out of this giant wasteland. (unless a true blockbuster)
Between Monday night footy, (which helps clubs crowd average go backwards,) and having to play in this 80 thousand round dinosaur that is taking our atmosphere and depositing it out in the Indian ocean, the NRL is killing our tribes.
Here is what needs to be done, besides turning that fan killing souless beast into a rectangle stadium.

Sydney needs two more stadiums, one at 40 thousand, the other 55 thousand.

We have 3 codes of footy all trying to use SFS and unless it is a international, no other code really wants to use that souless grub.

So 3 codes have to use either a 80 thousand or the Sydney footy Stadium. Who planned that, the muppets.
No, we need another two big stadiums so all codes can play in proper rectangle grounds, that can nicely fit 50 thousand or 40 thousand crowds, in the right areas.
Parramatta being one of those areas.
Parra is a huge city, and give them a suncorp type 55 thousand stadium, Eels and Wanderers and even Tigers Penrith big games can be played here instead of taking them to that souless beast ANZ.
Fix the souless beast and the Dogs Rabbits and any other sucker, i mean team like Waratahs can use this big white elephant, once it is fixed.

Brisbane needs 3 teams, if you want to start growing the code yes, Brisbane needs 3 teams, i will explain why.
For a start it gives you a game every weekend, lets say that is Friday night, ? we still need a game somewhere over the rest of the weekend. You cant just keep having Friday night games and allow nothing, no rugby league played for the rest of the weekend in Brisbane. ? Madness.
No they need to get another 2 teams at least into Brisbane. Crowds will thrive, like aFL and all their 2 city teams, derbies, and you have more than one game every two weeks in Brisbane, and one on the Sunday or Saturday so we can grow the game to tourists and whoever.

As i said above, if we keep playing the Sharks on Monday nights, we will not only end up with 5 thousand crowds, killing our averages, we will also kill our support.
The NRL has got to stop killing the game, they doing a damm good job so far.

Plus we need another stadium in Brisbane, probably a 30 or 40 thousand , just to keep all three codes off Suncorp which is starting to look like a cow paddock every year.
The Reds should be shifted and the second Brisbane team and third Brisbane team can use this smaller stadium when they are not playing blockbusters.
This should be all thought out by the NRL already. I bet nothing has been done.

Those are the key areas, "killing our averages" by playing monday night footy and locking the kiddies and mums out, and putting the team you least want to play during prime-time , so the Sharks get shafted, as if they dont have enough problems. What teams dont realise is they are shafting themselves, crowd averages are going backwards.

Losing fans by taking 20 thousand to a souless ANZ.
Why would the NRL want to do that, i know you need to grow your crowds, but you dont go from 20 thousand to 80 thousand. No you take them to a 40 or 50 thousand and slowly build the crowds. After you fil those and you think you need bigger, take it then to the big elephant which should be rectangle by then, we hope.
Thats it.
 
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