New Zealand 2 will deal a massive blow to NZ rugby

[Pneuma]

I think you have some salient points and I don’t think the Suns and Giants are very popular; however, there are a few points that need to be made:

1. League ratings are going up not down. That would suggest that whilst the product could improve (last year’s quality was a considerable improvement on 2021) people seem to be relatively happy with the product. It is also rating higher than the AFL.

2. I would add that their TV deals have been greater for a long time. Some of that probably correlates with longer games however a factor would also having popular teams in every metro city market (the Swans and Lions have been on the other hand a success for them)

All of the above. Selling a game with a presence in all 5 major states to sponsors and governments is an obviously easier task. If we can expand the game to Perth and then a second NZ team it will give us a clear strategic advantage over the fumblers in selling and marketing the game.

 

[Colk]

All of the above. Selling a game with a presence in all 5 major states to sponsors and governments is an obviously easier task. If we can expand the game to Perth and then a second NZ team it will give us a clear strategic advantage over the fumblers in selling and marketing the game.

Exactly mate.

There seems to be this argument going around that you either have to kill Sydney teams to go to new markets (which is not very smart and not going to happen anyway ) or that for some reason the game can’t expand anywhere outside NSW/QLD (which is myopic). Just plan Perth/NZ 2 within the next decade (in whatever order you want) and then decide what you want to do with the 20th team when you get to that point.

 

[Pneuma]

Exactly mate.

There seems to be this argument going around that you either have to kill Sydney teams to go to new markets (which is not very smart and not going to happen anyway ) or that for some reason the game can’t expand anywhere outside NSW/QLD (which is myopic). Just plan Perth/NZ 2 within the next decade (in whatever order you want) and then decide what you want to do with the 20th team when you get to that point.

Amen

 

[Wb1234]

That is only true if they are popular. It's hard to believe the Giants and Suns add much to the value of AFL broadcast deals. If they do, it's merely through the crude measure of extra content, which would accrue just the same from a team in Tas and a third in Perth.

You could be right in the sense that NRL viewership might already be at saturation point in NSW and QLD. New viewers might only be available in AFL States and NZ.

The Dolphins will shed light on whether there are more eyeballs within the existing geographic footprint, the sort who only watch Origin or GF, prepared to regularly follow NRL. If they deliver figures similar to the Broncos, will that be at the expense of lower ratings for other clubs? Meaning no increase in overall aggregate.

Analysis of Dolphins TV ratings will inform the decision on where to go to set up a ninth weekly game. Because of the undeniable correlation between playing performance and ratings, one year's data (maybe several years' data) will not suffice.

One question often neglected in debates around the pros and cons of growth is whether the on-field NRL product is currently fit for expansion. Most changes and applications of rules seem designed to increase the frequency and speed with which one bloke smashes into three other blokes. Administrators must think there's an insatiable appetite for bash and crash.

I think supporters, and more to the point prospective supporters, want greater diversity and less predictability.

The way the game is played is largely determined by officials and coaches. Both these groups operate in the grip of various media-induced neuroses. Teams who take risks are often punished. Players who take risks are often derided. Might be an idea to address the effects of all this on the product before placing it more prominently in front of audiences in Perth and Adelaide.

Well most of the comp spent ten years being bad versions of the storm

wrestling the life out of games and running blocks plays in attack

now there’s a side who actually plays genuine rugby league and most of the comp can’t adapt to eyes up rugby league

every club will be trying to copy the panthers now

the arlc can try and make rule changes but the reality is coaches don’t much care for the spectacle of the game. They just like their sides to grind out boring wins

coaches like Cleary Robinson and bennett are leading the charge into positive play

 

[Wb1234]

I think you have some salient points and I don’t think the Suns and Giants are very popular; however, there are a few points that need to be made:

1. League ratings are going up not down. That would suggest that whilst the product could improve (last year’s quality was a considerable improvement on 2021) people seem to be relatively happy with the product. It is also rating higher than the AFL.

2. I would add that their TV deals have been greater for a long time. Some of that probably correlates with longer games however a factor would also having popular teams in every metro city market (the Swans and Lions have been on the other hand a success for them)

Good post

afl tv deals are larger as the aftermath of super league and news ltd owning 50 percent of the game

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Once saw the most graphic enlightenment for those slow learners who don't understand the difference between forward out of the hands and forward relative to the ground at an amateur game on the Cumbrian coast.

Twas blowing a hoolie, dummy-half passed the ball 2 metres backwards, wind took hold and it landed about 30 metres downfield and went into touch. They lost possession, but the attempted pass was perfectly legal.

The old Athletic Park ground in Wellington was legendary like that. It was located near the top of a rise that sloped downhill to the south coast and would bear the full force of southerly gales off Cook Strait. There was a legendary moment when All Black Don Clarke was taking a sideline conversion in a southerly and he kicked the ball directly across the field, judging the wind perfectly which blew it right through the crossbars.

It was a great ground for sight lines, being a rectangle with steep, close stands, but they’d sway a couple of feet in a good wind.

 

[Wb1234]

TikTok - Make Your Day

vt.tiktok.com

We need more of this !

 

[Stormy weather]

I don’t see a South Island team being a huge blow to rugby. Unless the invest the money to get more kids playing league at a grassroots level and provide a strong pathway for them to come through.

Union players aren’t going to leave NZ super rugby sides for an NRL team when they already have the opportunity to get more playing in England, France or Japan.

The only way the team could be a blow to NZ Rugby is if they focus on the next generation of super stars and not the current one

 

[MugaB]

Bullshit and spew in the one sentence? They educate them well in Logan!

 

[MugaB]

Well most of the comp spent ten years being bad versions of the storm

wrestling the life out of games and running blocks plays in attack

now there’s a side who actually plays genuine rugby league and most of the comp can’t adapt to eyes up rugby league

every club will be trying to copy the panthers now

the arlc can try and make rule changes but the reality is coaches don’t much care for the spectacle of the game. They just like their sides to grind out boring wins

coaches like Cleary Robinson and bennett are leading the charge into positive play

Robinson shouldn't be in that conversation, he was a massive rule breaker, especially when it comes to offsides on the line, six agains and penalties have now put the rorters well in the pack again, bellamy, bennett, cleary and payten are the coaxhes to hang your hat on for exciting footy, they aren't generally grinding out wins, more out to play expansive footy to blow teams away

 

[Wb1234]

Robinson shouldn't be in that conversation, he was a massive rule breaker, especially when it comes to offsides on the line, six agains and penalties have now put the rorters well in the pack again, bellamy, bennett, cleary and payten are the coaxhes to hang your hat on for exciting footy, they aren't generally grinding out wins, more out to play expansive footy to blow teams away

Penrith do similar infringements lmao

he won’t allow his players to lie down and it’s cost them games

and their attack is good

bellamy is one of the worst at cheating but with the current rules the game is too fast so his team is forced to play like Penrith

 

[Wb1234]

I don’t see a South Island team being a huge blow to rugby. Unless the invest the money to get more kids playing league at a grassroots level and provide a strong pathway for them to come through.

Union players aren’t going to leave NZ super rugby sides for an NRL team when they already have the opportunity to get more playing in England, France or Japan.

The only way the team could be a blow to NZ Rugby is if they focus on the next generation of super stars and not the current one

Whoosh

they play overseas they can’t play for the all blacks

so super rugby ends up with 30 good players ? Ok

 

[Stormy weather]

Whoosh

they play overseas they can’t play for the all blacks

so super rugby ends up with 30 good players ? Ok

Exactly and if they take less money to try and play for the All Blacks why are they going to switch to league? They need to focus on the juniors

 

[Wb1234]

Exactly and if they take less money to try and play for the All Blacks why are they going to switch to league? They need to focus on the juniors

Well unless the all blacks are planning on paying for 4 all blacks teams all the rest who remain in super rugby will be targets

nrl or overseas union pick your poison

 

[Stormy weather]

Well unless the all blacks are planning on paying for 4 all blacks teams all the rest who remain in super rugby will be targets

nrl or overseas union pick your poison

But they already are targets. Growing the grassroots is the way forward if they want it to work

 

[Wb1234]

But they already are targets. Growing the grassroots is the way forward if they want it to work

Look I know you are new to this thread but all of this has covered previously ad nauseam

I really cbf repeating these arguments for the millionth time

 

[Gobsmacked]

Super rugby is on a downward spiral. Maybe in 10 years it collapses or they pull an Australian club ( which they talk about often) .
That would be the ideal time for a Perth team would it not?
Is it worth waiting for the perfect time?

 

[Wb1234]

Super rugby is on a downward spiral. Maybe in 10 years it collapses or they pull an Australian club ( which they talk about often) .
That would be the ideal time for a Perth team would it not?
Is it worth waiting for the perfect time?

Realistically australia can only support two clubs now

and the two pacific sides aren’t viable

so it’s a comp with six viable teams

they should copy South Africa and join the top 14 despite the travel times

 

[Ride the Lion to Zion]

every club will be trying to copy the panthers now

Penrith are a ruthless efficient machine who strangle the life out of the opposition.

I'd rather watch Parra any day.

 

[Gobsmacked]

Realistically australia can only support two clubs now

and the two pacific sides aren’t viable

so it’s a comp with six viable teams

they should copy South Africa and join the top 14 despite the travel times

I think 3 reds act and nsw. For a comp that's struggling, the last thing they need is WA. If twiggy wasn't backing them, they'd be folded in between breakfast and lunch.