New Zealand 2 will deal a massive blow to NZ rugby

[Wb1234]

Id have thought itd be easier to sell sunday 12.30 to fans than Thursday night?
Point still stands though, warriors dont draw on australian tv and that will be something they know and will consider when they think about how much club 18 is worth to them.

missed the point

aussie fans won’t want to attend in person games at midday so aussie clubs don’t want them due to the loss in gate (same applies to Friday 630)

but those slots are valuable for aussie tv

then there’s the value of nz audiences to kiwi tv

 

[Te Kaha]

missed the point

aussie fans won’t want to attend in person games at midday so aussie clubs don’t want them due to the loss in gate (same applies to Friday 630)

but those slots are valuable for aussie tv

then there’s the value of nz audiences to kiwi tv

Valuable to Aussie TV? when its barely half the next game... and valuable to NZ TV? sure it is...

 

[Perth Red]

missed the point

aussie fans won’t want to attend in person games at midday so aussie clubs don’t want them due to the loss in gate (same applies to Friday 630)

but those slots are valuable for aussie tv

then there’s the value of nz audiences to kiwi tv

leaving aside the nz tv as I think there are very differing views on what Sky will offer with no spark competition, and NZ tv only makes up about 7% of the overall value,
yes having a NZ club to fill the fan unfriendly 6pm slot would be a good thing for the Australian clubs, but of no value to Australian TV given NZ clubs rate lower, much lower, than the Australian clubs.
You're basically consigning the Friday 6pm game to lower ratings than could be. Not sure Tv will be happy about that?

Then we have to find a new slot regardless. Seems the fave option will be Sunday at 6pm or 6.30pm. So Australian clubs might not have to fill the 6pm Friday slot every other week if NZ2 come in but they will then have to fill that Sunday slot every week, which I don't think will be very favourable with fans either.

 

[Wb1234]

leaving aside the nz tv as I think there are very differing views on what Sky will offer with no spark competition, and NZ tv only makes up about 7% of the overall value,
yes having a NZ club to fill the fan unfriendly 6pm slot would be a good thing for the Australian clubs, but of no value to Australian TV given NZ clubs rate lower, much lower, than the Australian clubs.
You're basically consigning the Friday 6pm game to lower ratings than could be. Not sure Tv will be happy about that?

Then we have to find a new slot regardless. Seems the fave option will be Sunday at 6pm or 6.30pm. So Australian clubs might not have to fill the 6pm Friday slot every other week if NZ2 come in but they will then have to fill that Sunday slot every week, which I don't think will be very favourable with fans either.

Those slots are valuable to Aussie tv

and a second nz side is of value to nz tv

even if you want to argue it’s going down (it’s not)

a second team will mitigate that

 

[Perth Red]

Those slots are valuable to Aussie tv

and a second nz side is of value to nz tv

even if you want to argue it’s going down (it’s not)

a second team will mitigate that

You'd really have to look at the Friday 6pm slot when warriors are in it compared to when two Australian clubs are in it to determine that. Not sure if Wookie has an tv audience by club by game slot break down?

Again that's you're opinion re skytv. Its logical to think that with no competition the rights become less valuable.
We've witnessed it in NZ and in Australia recently so not sure why you think this time would be different?

 

[Wb1234]

You'd really have to look at the Friday 6pm slot when warriors are in it compared to when two Australian clubs are in it to determine that. Not sure if Wookie has an tv audience by club by game slot break down?

Again that's you're opinion re skytv. Its logical to think that with no competition the rights become less valuable.
We've witnessed it in NZ and in Australia recently so not sure why you think this time would be different?

If you want to make up scenarios about a second nz team being of no value to kiwi tv then argue that Perth are valuable for Aussie tv then it reflects on you

 

[Te Kaha]

Those slots are valuable to Aussie tv

and a second nz side is of value to nz tv

even if you want to argue it’s going down (it’s not)

a second team will mitigate that

How can you be this thick Wally? The ratings show that the Warriors only get "good" ratings when there is no competing Rugby match. So Sky TV already has most of those slots covered. A second team may be of some value, but not enough to keep their payment for TV rights anywhere near what it is now.

It's really not hard to understand, If the NRL turns down Skys offer they will get nothing from NZ rights. So no second team is paid for and the Warriors start costing more than what they bring in.

Anybody with even a modicum of sense knows this to be true. Clearly you don't even have that modicum.

 

[Gobsmacked]

How can you be this thick Wally? The ratings show that the Warriors only get "good" ratings when there is no competing Rugby match. So Sky TV already has most of those slots covered. A second team may be of some value, but not enough to keep their payment for TV rights anywhere near what it is now.

It's really not hard to understand, If the NRL turns down Skys offer they will get nothing from NZ rights. So no second team is paid for and the Warriors start costing more than what they bring in.

Anybody with even a modicum of sense knows this to be true. Clearly you don't even have that modicum.

Sky will pay more for 2 NZ teams than 1.
Whatever that figure is, it will be more with a second team.

So without doubt a second NZ team brings in more tv revenue. Obviously there's an extra game for all broadcasters but let's see if you can at least understand the first fundamental fact . Take your time

 

[Te Kaha]

Sky will pay more for 2 NZ teams than 1.
Whatever that figure is, it will be more with a second team.

So without doubt a second NZ team brings in more tv revenue. Obviously there's an extra game for all broadcasters but let's see if you can at least understand the first fundamental fact . Take your time

They will pay more than the 20 million they paid before Spark. They wont pay anything near what they are paying now. They have zero need to. So less money than there is now, means LESS revenue. If you can't work out that basic mathematics there is something wrong with your education.

 

[Iamback]

That is a good point, most Kiwis in the NRL come through Australian systems, not NZ ones. Would that change with a second NRL team in Wellington? I guess it might but Australian clubs are still going to be out scouting for the best 14-15 year olds to entice to Oz.

Warriors have almost zero juniors from the past 2 seasons due to covid and put Storm to sword and beat Souths 1st up. This is from running tryouts to fill the side, RL has only just touched the surface of talent in the pacific as a whole

 

[Perth Red]

If you want to make up scenarios about a second nz team being of no value to kiwi tv then argue that Perth are valuable for Aussie tv then it reflects on you

no one is saying they will be of no value. Just questioning what that value is, especially given SkyNZ previous reticence to up the tv contract, the only time it has increased in 3 tv deals is when there was competition.
So they now pay $32mill. How much more do you think they will pay with no competition but a second NZ side? How many new subscribers is a second NZ side going to drive to them which is ultimately how they will value it in the face of no competition?

Then you have to factor in Australian TV value that pays 93% of the tv contract given Warriors poor audience performance in Australia.

To say SkyNZ will pay loads more and Australian Tv will pay anyone the same for the ninth spot seems simplistic and overly optimistic given past performance.

 

[Perth Red]

Warriors have almost zero juniors from the past 2 seasons due to covid and put Storm to sword and beat Souths 1st up. This is from running tryouts to fill the side, RL has only just touched the surface of talent in the pacific as a whole

Noone is disputing that. They are physically made for RL. I was staggered at the size of these islander/Maori kids when I used to watch SG Ball. At 17/18 they are way bigger than most white kids at that age, we shouldn't be surprised they dominate at this age group.

 

[Wb1234]

no one is saying they will be of no value. Just questioning what that value is, especially given SkyNZ previous reticence to up the tv contract, the only time it has increased in 3 tv deals is when there was competition.
So they now pay $32mill. How much more do you think they will pay with no competition but a second NZ side? How many new subscribers is a second NZ side going to drive to them which is ultimately how they will value it in the face of no competition?

Then you have to factor in Australian TV value that pays 93% of the tv contract given Warriors poor audience performance in Australia.

To say SkyNZ will pay loads more and Australian Tv will pay anyone the same for the ninth spot seems simplistic and overly optimistic given past performance.

Let’s say sky are going to cut the rights by ten million for arguments sake

Nz2 will mitigate that

the reality is if they are paying 32 million now then I would expect them to pay at least 45 million for two teams

and they are valuable to foxtel by taking Friday 630 and noon Sunday which don’t work for Australian crowds but do ok for nz

the reason why Perth will beat nz2 aren’t because of tv deals or juniors or international competition

it’s because the wa govt will do what it takes to win it and because of the covid impact on the warriors

nz2 will just have to hope expansion is a success and they join in ten years

 

[Perth Red]

the reality is if they are paying 32 million now then I would expect them to pay at least 45 million for two teams

haha, there's optimism, then there's delusion! So you think SkyNZ are going to pay an extra $23mill for a nz2 club?
With no competition we will be very lucky to still get $32mill with or without a second club.

 

[Wb1234]

Warriors have almost zero juniors from the past 2 seasons due to covid and put Storm to sword and beat Souths 1st up. This is from running tryouts to fill the side, RL has only just touched the surface of talent in the pacific as a whole

That’s why it’s so funny the kiwis who know nothing about league quoting useless nz junior numbers

nz2 will have nsw cup flegg Matts etc

that’s an extra 150 places potentially for kiwi players and the club will have around one million to spend pa on juniors

and that 150 will be high calibre juniors not some guy kicking a ball around a park on Sunday

 

[Wb1234]

haha, there's optimism, then there's delusion! With no competition we will be very lucky to still get $32mill with or without a second club.

So a second club will add nothing for sky nz ?

make up your mind

 

[Perth Red]

So a second club will add nothing for sky nz ?

make up your mind

Again with the false eloquence. At no point did I say nothing, but they sure as hell aren't going to stump up $23mil a year for another club lol.
If anything it might stop them reducing the deal, but I doubt it will add much extra, if anything.
With zero competiton they dont have to. NRL arent going to turn down anything they offer, and they know that. Its why in 2013 and 2018 the SkyNZ deals were exactly the same.

 

[Wb1234]

Again with the false eloquence. At no point did I say nothing, but they sure as hell aren't going to stump up $23mil a year for another club lol.
If anything it might stop them reducing the deal, but I doubt it will add much extra, if anything.

Yours maths is on par with your knowledge of rugby league

45 million minus 32 million is in increase of 13 million

it seems this whole topic baffles you but yet you seem to know a Perth team will lead to a large increase in the tv deal

it would be nice if you could actually answer a simple question like do nz2 bring extra value for sky nz

but I understand the lack of an answer is obfuscation

 

[Gobsmacked]

Whatever sky pays, it will be more with a second team.
So NZ 2 adds tv revenue without question.

Foxtel will pay more for an extra game. Given there's almost always going to be at least 1 Aussie side in the contest outside of 2 games a year, the fact that the side is located outside of Australia will have next to no difference in value to Foxtel.

NZ 2 is clear winner for TV revenue.
NZ 2 is the clear winner for talent.
NZ 2 is on par with available time slots.
NZ 2 is a clear winner in travel distance.
NZ 2 has a better stadium.

This forum has been led by PR into an eco chamber where Perth becomes the clear favourite.
This is the drumbeat of 4 or 5 posters on a relatively unknown forum.
It doesn't reflect in anyway the reality of revenue/ talent/logistics that put NZ 2 in the box seat.

But sure go back to your little anonymous eco chamber.

 

[Wb1234]

If I was ranking them

value for tv deals

nz2 9 vs Perth 2
Juniors nz2 10 vs Perth one
Benefit to international comp nz2 10 Perth zero
Crowds nz2 8 Perth 8
Members nz2 9 Perth 7
Grounds nz2 8 Perth 6
Sponsorship Perth 8 nz2 7

can’t think of many places Perth wins