New Zealand 2 will deal a massive blow to NZ rugby

[Perth Red]

Yours maths is on par with your knowledge of rugby league

45 million minus 32 million is in increase of 13 million

it seems this whole topic baffles you but yet you seem to know a Perth team will lead to a large increase in the tv deal

it would be nice if you could actually answer a simple question like do nz2 bring extra value for sky nz

but I understand the lack of an answer is obfuscation

woo champ, you were the one who said, and I qoute:

"Let’s say sky are going to cut the rights by ten million for arguments sake
Nz2 will mitigate that
the reality is if they are paying 32 million now then I would expect them to pay at least 45 million for two teams'

So you said that skynz without NZ would reduce the deal to $22mill but with NZ2 theyd pay $45mill. Thats a $23mill value right there. Maths not whose strong point?

To answer the question, I doubt it but no one knows for sure until they are asked.
Why do I question how much, if any they are worth to SkyNZ?
Because they dont have to pay more, and no business I've ever dealt with pays more than they have to for something. Whats the NRL going to do if they say 'nah we are only going to pay $25mill next deal'?

 

[Gobsmacked]

If I was ranking them

value for tv deals

nz2 9 vs Perth 2
Juniors nz2 10 vs Perth one
Benefit to international comp nz2 10 Perth zero
Crowds nz2 8 Perth 8
Members nz2 9 Perth 7
Grounds nz2 8 Perth 6
Sponsorship Perth 8 nz2 7

can’t think of many places Perth wins

It beat the next viable expansion team across the board... but apparently is no chance lol

 

[Perth Red]

Whatever sky pays, it will be more with a second team.
So NZ 2 adds tv revenue without question.

Foxtel will pay more for an extra game. Given there's almost always going to be at least 1 Aussie side in the contest outside of 2 games a year, the fact that the side is located outside of Australia will have next to no difference in value to Foxtel.

NZ 2 is clear winner for TV revenue.
NZ 2 is the clear winner for talent.
NZ 2 is on par with available time slots.
NZ 2 is a clear winner in travel distance.
NZ 2 has a better stadium.

This forum has been led by PR into an eco chamber where Perth becomes the clear favourite.
This is the drumbeat of 4 or 5 posters on a relatively unknown forum.
It doesn't reflect in anyway the reality of revenue/ talent/logistics that put NZ 2 in the box seat.

But sure go back to your little anonymous eco chamber.

thats alot of guesswork right there lol

1. Arguable. Australian clubs generate bigger audiences and subscribers for Australian TV. Australian TV pay 93% of the TV contract- fact
2. Yep NZ jnrs are made for the game and another direct pathway will bring them through - fact
3. Arguable. For Australian TV Sunday 6/6.30pm will be the next slot, thats better suited to a Perth club filling
4. Travel is on par with each other in time and cost - fact
5. Arguable. Depends on where the club is based. Wellington, no. Christchurch, by a long way.

But like I said before the main criteria NRL will be driven by is TV value, value to NRL sponsorship, long term viability, existing club acceptance and what ever its strategic plan is.

 

[Wb1234]

woo champ, you were the one who said, and I qoute:

"Let’s say sky are going to cut the rights by ten million for arguments sake
Nz2 will mitigate that
the reality is if they are paying 32 million now then I would expect them to pay at least 45 million for two teams'

So you said that skynz without NZ would reduce the deal to $22mill but with NZ2 theyd pay $45mill. Thats a $23mill value right there. Maths not whose strong point?

To answer the question, I doubt it but no one knows for sure until they are asked.
Why do I question how much, if any they are worth to SkyNZ?
Because they dont have to pay more, and no business I've ever dealt with pays more than they have to for something. Whats the NRL going to do if they say 'nah we are only going to pay $25mill next deal'?

Nah you totally misunderstood what I meant

and I assumed you had a certain level of intelligence

so your opinion if you had to have one is nz2 will have no value for kiwi tv

just be clear about it if that’s what you believe

people can judge if you are biased or not

 

[Perth Red]

It beat the next viable expansion team across the board... but apparently is no chance lol

only in some peoples heads lol.

 

[Wb1234]

only in some peoples heads lol.

You admitted yesterday nz2 is a chance

and if the arlc choose them you would know why

lmao

 

[Gobsmacked]

woo champ, you were the one who said, and I qoute:

"Let’s say sky are going to cut the rights by ten million for arguments sake
Nz2 will mitigate that
the reality is if they are paying 32 million now then I would expect them to pay at least 45 million for two teams'

So you said that skynz without NZ would reduce the deal to $22mill but with NZ2 theyd pay $45mill. Thats a $23mill value right there. Maths not whose strong point?

To answer the question, I doubt it but no one knows for sure until they are asked.
Why do I question how much, if any they are worth to SkyNZ?
Because they dont have to pay more, and no business I've ever dealt with pays more than they have to for something. Whats the NRL going to do if they say 'nah we are only going to pay $25mill next deal'?

Let me try to explain this to you.
If milk is $1 per litre and it goes down to 75 cents
1 litre = 75 cents
If I want a second litre, is the total bill less or more than 75 cents?
Take your time.

 

[Perth Red]

Nah you totally misunderstood what I meant

and I assumed you had a certain level of intelligence

so your opinion if you had to have one is nz2 will have no value for kiwi tv

just be clear about it if that’s what you believe

people can judge if you are biased or not

so when you said that without NZ2 the deal would be $22mill and with it it would be $45mill, thats not relly what you meant? Why did you type it then?

I think it will have limited value, without competition SkyNZ isnt upping the deal, they didnt in the past, there is no reason to suspect they will in the future. Why would they?

 

[Wb1234]

so when you said that without NZ2 the deal would be $22mill and with it it would be $45mill, thats not relly what you meant? Why did you type it then?

I think it will have limited value, without competition SkyNZ isnt upping the deal, they didnt in the past, there is no reason to suspect they will in the future. Why would they?

So nz2 will have value to kiwi tv

wow what an amazing admission that is on your part

 

[Perth Red]

You admitted yesterday nz2 is a chance

and if the arlc choose them you would know why

lmao

They are a chance. But it will likely come down to the criteria I have laid out. Neither you nor I know for sure if that is the criteria they will use or how each area in the real world meets that criteria. We can argue the case for and against any expansion option against that criteria till we are blue in the face and it wont make a jot of difference to the outcome lol

 

[Gobsmacked]

thats alot of guesswork right there lol

1. Arguable. Australian clubs generate bigger audiences and subscribers for Australian TV. Australian TV pay 93% of the TV contract- fact
2. Yep NZ jnrs are made for the game and another direct pathway will bring them through - fact
3. Arguable. For Australian TV Sunday 6/6.30pm will be the next slot, thats better suited to a Perth club filling
4. Travel is on par with each other in time and cost - fact
5. Arguable. Depends on where the club is based. Wellington, no. Christchurch, by a long way.

But like I said before the main criteria NRL will be driven by is TV value, value to NRL sponsorship, long term viability, existing club acceptance and what ever its strategic plan is.

Perth is the same distance as Wellington now ?

 

[Perth Red]

So nz2 will have value to kiwi tv

wow what an amazing admission that is on your part

I hope so, but I or you, dont know. And then the second question, and the really really important one is does the extra value for SkyNZ counteract a potential lack of value seen by Australian TV of a NZ2 club. That will be the one that is the deal breaker as they pay 93% of the tv deal.

So lets say SkyNZ offer $3mill a year more for NZ2. But Fox and Ch9, knowing how poor the warriors rate and add value, deem another Australian club worth $25mill more and a NZ2 only worth $10mill more. Whose the NRL goign with?

Now again all guesswork and none of us know what Fox and Ch9 will want from the next deal. We have just seen a record media deal for a sport with a strong presence in all 5 metro capitals though so that should tell them something.

 

[Perth Red]

Perth is the same distance as Wellington now ?

Travel time it is. In fact quicker from perth.
Wellington to Sydney is 3hr 45min flight plus 90mins international check in = 5hr 15min (plus getting out of international area)
Perth is 4hr 10min plus 45min domestic check in = 4hr 55min

Cost is about same

 

[Matua]

As I said some of the league fans were quite positive

It's really like you looked at my post, but didn't actually read any of it and just randomly responded. Did you just use Chat GPT based off previous of yours and your mate gobs posts?

ngl you need to watch the nrl regularly and understand how nrl operates regarding juniors to get it

Why on earth would you think I don't watch NRL and don't know how it's juniors system broadly operates? I have more knowledge about both than you have about the state of league and league juniors in NZ.

trying to want rugby league in New Zealand to be like union isn’t how it’s going to go

Nobody has advocated this.

the nrl has absolutely no problems generating kiwi juniors that’s solely a union problem

Are you so deluded that you believe this? The bulk of junior talent in NZ goes to rugby.

you keep saying one off games there were two on the weekend with fantastic crowds.

I've once said "one off game", but there is a huge difference between a one off game and the support a team can generate over an entire season.

maybe if you weren’t so negative about rugby league I might take your posts more seriously

I'm negative about origin (because it's generally detrimental to the international game) and how badly league is being run in NZ. But I'm negative about aspects of NZ rugby as well. That's what being a fan is all about, you voice your opinions when things aren't being run as well as they can. You've been negative about the prospect of a Perth team often on this very thread. I'm not negative about the Perth bid because I don't have enough knowledge about the state of the game there so don't need to throw my ignorance around.

 

[Gobsmacked]

I hope so, but I or you, dont know. And then the second question, and the really really important one is does the extra value for SkyNZ counteract a potential lack of value seen by Australian TV of a NZ2 club. That will be the one that is the deal breaker as they pay 93% of the tv deal.

So lets say SkyNZ offer $3mill a year more for NZ2. But Fox and Ch9, knowing how poor the warriors rate and add value, deem another Australian club worth $25mill more and a NZ2 only worth $10mill more. Whose the NRL goign with?

Now again all guesswork and none of us know what Fox and Ch9 will want from the next deal. We have just seen a record media deal for a sport with a strong presence in all 5 metro capitals though so that should tell them something.

The difference will be negligible for tv in Australia. The deal will be another game.
There's 0 people on the east coast that will want to watch Perth..0
There's actually a shit ton of kiwi expats across Australia that would like to watch another NZ team and they outnumber the amount of people in Western Australia who would watch 2 to 1.

 

[SpaceMonkey]

Perth is the same distance as Wellington now ?

There is the international factor to account for with travel too, longer checkin and arrival times. However I don’t think that’s a particularly big factor nowadays, I went to nz the other week and it was quick in both directions, plus a footy team who travels regularly would presumably have priority fast lane access. I’d say Wellington would still come out ahead by 90 min to an hour each way.

 

[Perth Red]

The difference will be negligible for tv in Australia. The deal will be another game.
There's 0 people on the east coast that will want to watch Perth..0
There's actually a shit ton of kiwi expats across Australia that would like to watch another NZ team and they outnumber the amount of people in Western Australia who would watch 2 to 1.

Again you state opinion like its fact. You have no idea of that, and looking at Warriors ratings in Australia the opposite is much more likely to be true.
Yeh like no one in Sydney or Brisbane wants to watch Melbourne. Doh.
Why arent they watching the Warriors now? And again with the opinion as fact lol

 

[Perth Red]

There is the international factor to account for with travel too, longer checkin and arrival times. However I don’t think that’s a particularly big factor nowadays, I went to nz the other week and it was quick in both directions, plus a footy team who travels regularly would presumably have priority fast lane access. I’d say Wellington would still come out ahead by 90 min to an hour each way.

Nope, its only 25min flight time difference!
Then add in the domestic to international check in times.
None of which has any influence though on who will be team 18 lol.

 

[Wb1234]

It's really like you looked at my post, but didn't actually read any of it and just randomly responded. Did you just use Chat GPT based off previous of yours and your mate gobs posts?


Why on earth would you think I don't watch NRL and don't know how it's juniors system broadly operates? I have more knowledge about both than you have about the state of league and league juniors in NZ.


Nobody has advocated this.


Are you so deluded that you believe this? The bulk of junior talent in NZ goes to rugby.


I've once said "one off game", but there is a huge difference between a one off game and the support a team can generate over an entire season.


I'm negative about origin (because it's generally detrimental to the international game) and how badly league is being run in NZ. But I'm negative about aspects of NZ rugby as well. That's what being a fan is all about, you voice your opinions when things aren't being run as well as they can. You've been negative about the prospect of a Perth team often on this very thread. I'm not negative about the Perth bid because I don't have enough knowledge about the state of the game there so don't need to throw my ignorance around.

Your the one saying the arl should be investing millions more into junior nz kiwi systems as the a first precondition for nz2

we don’t want our elite athletes playing in a poor standard competition

the pathways that matter are those provided by nz2 playing in the Australian system playing against the best each week so when they make nrl they are used to it

150 players provided by nz2 will be far more useful than 10k playing at a middling standard that can’t make the nrl

So nz2 gets those kids at 16 or younger and then spend years in their systems playing the best Aussie juniors

that’s how it works

which if you were a league fan would know and I wouldn’t have to explain it

 

[Gobsmacked]

Travel time it is. In fact quicker from perth.
Wellington to Sydney is 3hr 45min flight plus 90mins international check in = 5hr 15min
Perth is 4hr 10min plus 45min domestic check in = 4hr 55min

Cost is about same

If you're are going to do it accurately.
First both flights have to go with the trade with or against ( same direction)
Because Sydney to Perth is 4.55
So it's an hour and ten minutes difference.
Sit on a plane for 5 hours is brutal.
3.45 minutes is much easier.
I've been flying around the world for the last 2 months, so I think I qualify to speak to it.

The check-in time is irrelevant and is only 45 minutes difference anyway.
Obviously that whole process is streamlined for big groups anyway.