NRL: Lets talk about relocating teams, says QRL boss.

[MugaB]

Just to bring you into the real world of 2018 according to Roy Morgan as you love to quote him:-For you're enlightenment.
The Sharks have 245,000 supporters an increase of 9.5% on 2017 the second highest increase of the clubs after the Storm.
The Roosters have 219,000 a drop of 2.2% on he previous year
Knights 199,000 a drop of 2%
Raiders 174,000 a drop of 20.2%
Warriors 139,000 a drop of 14.2%
Panthers 139,000 a drop of 25.3%
Titans 122,000 a drop of 35.1%

This cannot be correct
Start of the year had figures for memberships not "supporters"
You cant get an acurate figures for supporters unless it was done using a question via the census, even then not correct, i know guys who buy multiple tickets to games for their mates to come who dont all support whoevers playing, i personally buy 1-3 jerseys and other merchandise every year, yet im not a member, and some of those are gifts, there is no way to specifically state who has more supporters, roy morgan is a rubbish example of random questionnaires, along with tv veiwership, and turnstiles counts
Memberships count but not everyone turns up game day, souths and roosters fans are evident of that, (except when they play each other)
Heres a screenshot of memberships 2017 to 2018

 

[Stallion]

This cannot be correct
Start of the year had figures for memberships not "supporters"
You cant get an acurate figures for supporters unless it was done using a question via the census, even then not correct, i know guys who buy multiple tickets to games for their mates to come who dont all support whoevers playing, i personally buy 1-3 jerseys and other merchandise every year, yet im not a member, and some of those are gifts, there is no way to specifically state who has more supporters, roy morgan is a rubbish example of random questionnaires, along with tv veiwership, and turnstiles counts
Memberships count but not everyone turns up game day, souths and roosters fans are evident of that, (except when they play each other)
Heres a screenshot of memberships 2017 to 2018

Very true. Which alludes to a far greater significance, relevance and overall support for clubs than is being suggested. The established clubs have cemented established markets which grow in relevance as new people find this great game. The people chastising a club for being 'small ' to their eye are way off the mark.Television, other media, merchandise and generational support have embedded such clubs into the Australian sports Psyche. The hard yards for acceptance and relevance have already been made. And we have fools wanting such advantages to be lost from the league?

 

[Pommy]

It's not selling the sport cheap. It's the go in Australia . What your logic supports is 'Lets charge higher than market demand and have less turn up." That, to me is not good for this very vulnerable code that has not got the establishment based favours of the elite private schools propagating it's code like union. Horses for courses. It's a different scenario in Australia compared to England.

Or maybe just maybe the market demand you think is there just isn’t.
I really don’t think the people of Manly are staying away because the ticket is $30.

 

[Stallion]

Or maybe just maybe the market demand you think is there just isn’t.
I really don’t think the people of Manly are staying away because the ticket is $30.

The $33 ga ticket for the hill is one reason. The loss of credibility and relevance when decisions like shafting longtime local rival North Sydney Bears is another factor. Things like these factors are negatively impacting on the Sea Eagles ability to attract fans and general public confidence in the code/competition decision makers. The NRL is starting to look like an ogre rather than a genuinely proactive organisation aimed at growing this more deserving code.

 

[Stallion]

Or maybe just maybe the market demand you think is there just isn’t.
I really don’t think the people of Manly are staying away because the ticket is $30.

Lol. Just like when the South Sydney Rabbitohs were shafted!? Yes. Your skepticism is rife for all to see. The Rabbitohs were written off and not worthy of the league yet have/had one of the largest fan bases for a football team in any comp within Australia. Think you are giving poor administrative decisions way too much credit!

 

[taipan]

This cannot be correct
Start of the year had figures for memberships not "supporters"
You cant get an acurate figures for supporters unless it was done using a question via the census, even then not correct, i know guys who buy multiple tickets to games for their mates to come who dont all support whoevers playing, i personally buy 1-3 jerseys and other merchandise every year, yet im not a member, and some of those are gifts, there is no way to specifically state who has more supporters, roy morgan is a rubbish example of random questionnaires, along with tv veiwership, and turnstiles counts
Memberships count but not everyone turns up game day, souths and roosters fans are evident of that, (except when they play each other)
Heres a screenshot of memberships 2017 to 2018

Never suggested it was worth putting my home on it.Just interesting, as it was used earlier for the year 2017 in an argument.
AFAIC membership,crowds ,scheduling are the real factors to take into account.
I pay little heed to mots surveys, unless it is a big sample and ongoing.

 

[Pommy]

Lol. Just like when the South Sydney Rabbitohs were shafted!? Yes. Your skepticism is rife for all to see. The Rabbitohs were written off and not worthy of the league yet have/had one of the largest fan bases for a football team in any comp within Australia. Think you are giving poor administrative decisions way too much credit!

Reducing the number of teams in the EPL hasn’t done them any harm.

 

[Stallion]

Reducing the number of teams in the EPL hasn’t done them any harm.

Totally different population density. TYRRANY OF DISTANCE etc. Not worth a comparison.Stop wasting time!

 

[ReddFelon]

Is "tyranny of distance" the new "North Sydney under assault from union?" Rationalisation is likely the only path forward at this point, need at least four more teams but can't allow numbers to go over 18. Perth, Brisbane #2, Adelaide and NZ #2 are necessary to create a genuine national footprint.

 

[Stallion]

Is "tyranny of distance" the new "North Sydney under assault from union?" Rationalisation is likely the only path forward at this point, need at least four more teams but can't allow numbers to go over 18. Perth, Brisbane #2, Adelaide and NZ #2 are necessary to create a genuine national footprint.

Why is 18 teams such a perfect number? I suggest that twenty (perhaps more as time goes on) is very achievable. Remembering a twenty team competition was happening and going forward but unfortunately compromised by the superleague disaster!
Ps: Northern Sydney is being taken up/taken over by other codes since the Bears ousting from the top flight. Australia's tyranny of distance is a major factor in making sure clubs are based in major population centres. It makes good sense. Otherwise the code becomes isolated particularly when a club experiences poor times. For instance: if the Cowboys have a bad year guess what? Rugby league suffers in that region. This is happening in the distinct northern Sydney region with one of its main clubs ousted courtesy of a flawed superleague agreement.

 

[ReddFelon]

Why is 18 teams such a perfect number? I suggest that twenty (perhaps more as time goes on) is very achievable. Remembering a twenty team competition was happening and going forward but unfortunately compromised by the superleague disaster!
Ps: Northern Sydney is being taken up/taken over by other codes since the Bears ousting from the top flight. Australia's tyranny of distance is a major factor in making sure clubs are based in major population centres. It makes good sense. Otherwise the code becomes isolated particularly when a club experiences poor times. For instance: if the Cowboys have a bad year guess what? Rugby league suffers in that region. This is happening in the distinct northern Sydney region with one of its main clubs ousted courtesy of a flawed superleague agreement.

At 20 the ARL was overstretched, the talent supply was too thin and the overcrowding of the NSW market is part of what led to Super League and it's argit's argument for a 12 team rationalisation.

Ideally there'd be 2 fewer Sydney teams. Allowing for the NZ market to feature two teams, expanded areas in Perth and Adelaide allowing for two one team states taking all the financial support and another Brisbane team so that Suncorp is used every weekend and the Brisbane talent supply is give a broader pathway.

Even an 18 team expansion will suffer the talent drop, realistically 10-12 teams may be able to organise a spine that can make the 8. The supply of quality halves is too low to sustain a 20 team league, in particular two clubs in the heartland must be dissolved to ensure that the expansion teams in Perth and Adelaide have access to quality players, ten years down the line when the presence of professional teams has allowed the local pathway to develop you might be able to look at further expansion, but as it stands national expansion is the right call if Rugby League wants to develop a genuine national footprint.

 

[Stallion]

At 20 the ARL was overstretched, the talent supply was too thin and the overcrowding of the NSW market is part of what led to Super League and it's argit's argument for a 12 team rationalisation.

Ideally there'd be 2 fewer Sydney teams. Allowing for the NZ market to feature two teams, expanded areas in Perth and Adelaide allowing for two one team states taking all the financial support and another Brisbane team so that Suncorp is used every weekend and the Brisbane talent supply is give a broader pathway.

Even an 18 team expansion will suffer the talent drop, realistically 10-12 teams may be able to organise a spine that can make the 8. The supply of quality halves is too low to sustain a 20 team league, in particular two clubs in the heartland must be dissolved to ensure that the expansion teams in Perth and Adelaide have access to quality players, ten years down the line when the presence of professional teams has allowed the local pathway to develop you might be able to look at further expansion, but as it stands national expansion is the right call if Rugby League wants to develop a genuine national footprint.

Lol . The "lack of talent " argument is the biggest furfy in the code. As an ex trialist for a top flight club I'm well aware that the talent is there. I managed to reach the final 30 in my experience and noted that many of the aspirants before my demise were "footballing freaks". THE TALENT IS OUT THERE. IT JUST NEEDS TO BE GIVEN OPPORTUNITY!

 

[MugaB]

Lol . The "lack of talent " argument is the biggest furfy in the code. As an ex trialist for a top flight club I'm well aware that the talent is there. I managed to reach the final 30 in my experience and noted that many of the aspirants before my demise were "footballing freaks". THE TALENT IS OUT THERE. IT JUST NEEDS TO BE GIVEN OPPORTUNITY!

Totally true, we have too much talent leave the code or play in superleague overseas every year, most might be over 30 years old, but still experienced
I heard widdop now wanting to go there to finish his career, then theres trent merrin, blake austin, etc.
there's always a long list of talent leave nrl, and lots of other junior talent too, not to mention each 30 man squad fighting for the same positions, so talent is there, 20 team comp seems do able, and should create enough rivalries to keep the code interesting, with 10 games a week, the broadcasters will be licking lips for it
Main issue is which cities deserve a shot first, i'd be adding two teams in SEQ one west of brisbane, the other North east (redcliffe-sunshine coast)
Then perth and then central coast
Adelaide needs time, and would prosper from a relocation, aswell as Perth too, maybe a south island NZ team after that,
The "talent pool being thin" is a myth
and its what the greedy clubs who buy all there juniors want the public to think,
The clubs who produce juniors, don't mind more teams, (means more customers)
Thinning out broncos foothold on brisbane (arguably the biggest league city with only one team) can only be good, funny thing is ARL had 20 teams
In 1995 with perth and 2nd brisbane side, now we are trying to get back there, imagine if superleague didnt mess it up where these 2 teams would be in scope now, cowboys and warriors are now 25 years old

 

[Pommy]

Totally true, we have too much talent leave the code or play in superleague overseas every year, most might be over 30 years old, but still experienced
I heard widdop now wanting to go there to finish his career, then theres trent merrin, blake austin, etc.
there's always a long list of talent leave nrl, and lots of other junior talent too, not to mention each 30 man squad fighting for the same positions, so talent is there, 20 team comp seems do able, and should create enough rivalries to keep the code interesting, with 10 games a week, the broadcasters will be licking lips for it
Main issue is which cities deserve a shot first, i'd be adding two teams in SEQ one west of brisbane, the other North east (redcliffe-sunshine coast)
Then perth and then central coast
Adelaide needs time, and would prosper from a relocation, aswell as Perth too, maybe a south island NZ team after that,
The "talent pool being thin" is a myth
and its what the greedy clubs who buy all there juniors want the public to think,
The clubs who produce juniors, don't mind more teams, (means more customers)
Thinning out broncos foothold on brisbane (arguably the biggest league city with only one team) can only be good, funny thing is ARL had 20 teams
In 1995 with perth and 2nd brisbane side, now we are trying to get back there, imagine if superleague didnt mess it up where these 2 teams would be in scope now, cowboys and warriors are now 25 years old

You do realise Gareth Widdop isn’t Australian and has always stated his desire to play in England.

 

[Stallion]

Totally true, we have too much talent leave the code or play in superleague overseas every year, most might be over 30 years old, but still experienced
I heard widdop now wanting to go there to finish his career, then theres trent merrin, blake austin, etc.
there's always a long list of talent leave nrl, and lots of other junior talent too, not to mention each 30 man squad fighting for the same positions, so talent is there, 20 team comp seems do able, and should create enough rivalries to keep the code interesting, with 10 games a week, the broadcasters will be licking lips for it
Main issue is which cities deserve a shot first, i'd be adding two teams in SEQ one west of brisbane, the other North east (redcliffe-sunshine coast)
Then perth and then central coast
Adelaide needs time, and would prosper from a relocation, aswell as Perth too, maybe a south island NZ team after that,
The "talent pool being thin" is a myth
and its what the greedy clubs who buy all there juniors want the public to think,
The clubs who produce juniors, don't mind more teams, (means more customers)
Thinning out broncos foothold on brisbane (arguably the biggest league city with only one team) can only be good, funny thing is ARL had 20 teams
In 1995 with perth and 2nd brisbane side, now we are trying to get back there, imagine if superleague didnt mess it up where these 2 teams would be in scope now, cowboys and warriors are now 25 years old

Absolutely agree ! Shame the game's administrators have been lacking/incompetent and also sitting on their hands again!

 

[MugaB]

You do realise Gareth Widdop isn’t Australian and has always stated his desire to play in England.

So? And blake green is Australian, who played some years in SL, but both are still talented, i dont care about who comes from where, point is we have more than enough talent to spead it around 20 teams

 

[Perth Red]

We don’t have the money or corporate support for 20 clubs.despite a massive nrl grant increase 1/2 the clubs still lost money this year. There’s too many mouths to feed as it is.

 

[Stallion]

We don’t have the money or corporate support for 20 clubs.despite a massive nrl grant increase 1/2 the clubs still lost money this year. There’s too many mouths to feed as it is.

Bullshit! You are just so negative. Remembering most sports clubs do not run at a profit. Still pedaling your destructive logic PR!

 

[greenBV4]

could always go to 20 teams, which would spread the money thinner, which would put more stress on struggling clubs who would then fold or drop a tier, then eventually we're left with 18-16 teams again anyway, and if not then we get to keep a 20 team comp with all the clubs surviving, so win-win

 

[MugaB]

could always go to 20 teams, which would spread the money thinner, which would put more stress on struggling clubs who would then fold or drop a tier, then eventually we're left with 18-16 teams again anyway, and if not then we get to keep a 20 team comp with all the clubs surviving, so win-win

Yep love this idea, its the most positive way to expansion, since 1908 the NSWRL had added 1-2 teams nearly every decade, with a few falling away on the wayside also, its why newtown isnt in the NRL, as they folded just before canberra & illawarra entered.

Im a believer in survival of the fittest, especially since there is a 2nd tier comp in nswrl and qrl for the clubs to continue onto.

Not sure why it costs so much money to run these clubs now, 1980s players still were working jobs and playing on weekends, pro sport is getting stupid with money, clubs had the sponsors,
Now its all about which teams have a sleeve sponsor....
The game itself doesn't cost money, its all the bullshite that clubs are spending, that is, the grant given to each club is more than enough to play for wages,
Staff soon will have a cap too, the rest should be profit, i mean everyone should have a gym and probably most wouldnt need upgrades, the annoyances are stadium rent, which if they all owned their own that wouldn't be an issue.
Other than injury costs and rehabilitation, not sure where all the money they are given by NRL/sponsors and revenue from tix/merch goes