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Organised crime and drugs in sport investigation part II

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El Diablo

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the Victorian media are a joke

Dank gave Cronulla wrong information and the players should be banned for taking a banned WADA drug

Dank gave Essendon right information and it's all ASADA's fault that they took a banned WADA drug and no player should be banned
 
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Perth Red

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Perth Red

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the Victorian media are a joke

Danjk gave Cronulla wrong information and the players should be banned

Dank gave Essendon right information and it's all ASADA's fault

I'd rather we had a media friendly to the game and protecting it than one that shts on it at every opportunity.
 

El Diablo

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there are journalists the NRL should ban from games

they do not deserve the honour of attending and being able to report on the game
 

taipan

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There is no way that cycling could be considered an individual sport, the whole sport is based around teams and team cultures. It is unfortunate for players who innocently followed advice of trusted club employees, but they must be punished to prevent future rorting of the system.

It is also impossible to spell out the remainder of drugs in detail as there are new drugs created everyday. They have to have a generalised statement to prevent players from using a performance enhansing drug until it is placed on the banned list, and then just moving onto the new drug on the block.

Yet my understanding he was dobbed in by teammates,who did not follow the "team"culture.

If it is good enough for WADA and ASADA to provide bans resulting in livelihood losses for athletes,then in my view it is good enough for organisations who are the arbiters ,to have the resources and knowhow to update their lists regularly.This is the age of the computer,not done by someone with a ball point pen.Generalisation is bloody amateurish.
Anyone has only to look at the Tax act which rules and regulations that fill a library.
 

Sea_Eagles_Rock

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Interesting read... Dank had left Manly in 2010.

In 2011, Kenley got a tip-off. "I was told the Manly Sea Eagles were using AOD. And I was told that the man I needed to speak to was a sports scientist called Stephen Dank." Kenley contacted Dank and arranged a meeting. "I wanted to know more about his thoughts on the potential for the drug's use in sportsmen."

Dank, who was then working with NRL clubs to improve player health and performance, never confirmed the drug was being used at Manly, but he told Kenley of his belief that AOD could help injured players heal faster. Kenley was impressed by Dank's passion for cutting edge science. "Steve got it and I presumed it was through his experience of the use of it," Kenley says.


This bit gives me the feel that the whole case is over the AOD9604 use and based of evidence from Kenley. It will be interesting if Dank has some evidence he checked the validity of the use of the product.

Based on Dank's advice that they would not breach WADA rules, some NRL players used supplements that encourage the body's own production of human growth hormones. More than a dozen NRL officials and players, mostly from Cronulla where Dank worked as a sports scientist in 2011, now face the prospect of lengthy bans for using these drugs on Dank's advice that WADA insists is wrong.
 

magpie4ever

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Yet my understanding he was dobbed in by teammates,who did not follow the "team"culture.

If it is good enough for WADA and ASADA to provide bans resulting in livelihood losses for athletes,then in my view it is good enough for organisations who are the arbiters ,to have the resources and knowhow to update their lists regularly.This is the age of the computer,not done by someone with a ball point pen.Generalisation is bloody amateurish.
Anyone has only to look at the Tax act which rules and regulations that fill a library.

Do you know how chemists work?

How can anyone update a list of banned substances when it doesn't have a name and was invented yesterday?

The white list is probably the way to go - a list the allowable supplements.
 

Sea_Eagles_Rock

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Do you know how chemists work?

How can anyone update a list of banned substances when it doesn't have a name and was invented yesterday?

The white list is probably the way to go - a list the allowable supplements.
While I understand where you are coming from on the pace and change associated with drug development, I can't see a whitelist keeping up. They would be lucky to list Panadol as approved without a lead time of about 100 years. WADA and ASADA don't even seem to be able to keep up with each other at this time.
 

magpie4ever

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Interesting read... Dank had left Manly in 2010.


This bit gives me the feel that the whole case is over the AOD9604 use and based of evidence from Kenley. It will be interesting if Dank has some evidence he checked the validity of the use of the product.





Maybe, but the article does mention other weird shit.

Maybe AOD9604 was being delivered intravenously; certainly raises many questions.
 

magpie4ever

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While I understand where you are coming from on the pace and change associated with drug development, I can't see a whitelist keeping up. They would be lucky to list Panadol as approved without a lead time of about 100 years. WADA and ASADA don't even seem to be able to keep up with each other at this time.

I reckon a white list would be better for the non-trained sports scientists (players etc) then the black and grey (covering all non-approved substances with certain characteristics) lists presently does. Even if it slows down the high performance programs for players, at least the players would be comfortable.

Half dozen of one, six of the other.
 

unforgiven

Bench
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Yet my understanding he was dobbed in by teammates,who did not follow the "team"culture.

If it is good enough for WADA and ASADA to provide bans resulting in livelihood losses for athletes,then in my view it is good enough for organisations who are the arbiters ,to have the resources and knowhow to update their lists regularly.This is the age of the computer,not done by someone with a ball point pen.Generalisation is bloody amateurish.
Anyone has only to look at the Tax act which rules and regulations that fill a library.

No he was dobbed in by teammates who did follow the team culture but were asked to dob in Lance so they could receive a reduced sentence, does that sound familar to anyone. There is a lot of testamony that team mates felt pressured into doping because they would be kicked off the team if they didn't.

You really do have no idea when it comes to this subject. All that would need to be done by the people making these drugs is to change a couple of compounds and give it a new name and its off the list again. The reason the catch all statement is there is the people recommending and giving these drugs are usually well aware of what they are doing to the body, thats why they use them. They just drug shop and play dumb when they are caught.
 
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El Diablo

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http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/...-to-help-protect-athletes-20130412-2hqxk.html

Calls to create doping ombudsman to help protect athletes

Date
April 13, 2013

Adrian Proszenko
Chief Rugby League Reporter

An ombudsman must be set up to protect athletes against the Australian Sports Anti-Doping Authority's conflicts of interest, say Australia's foremost anti-doping researchers.

Martin Hardie, a lecturer in law at Deakin University and Ben Koh, a doctoral researcher of complementary and alternate medicine at the University of Technology, Sydney, are both experts on the World Anti-Doping Agency code and doping issues.

The pair argue that ASADA has a conflict of interest in that it is a source of information on doping issues, while it is also charged with policing potential anti-doping violations. They argue that an athlete advocacy organisation needs to be established to guide athletes through the confusing issues of which substances they should or should not take.

''What sport needs is some kind of ombudsman,'' said Hardie, who is representing a cyclist accused of doping in a case that will be heard in the Federal Court next month.

''On a whole lot of issues, there is nowhere for an athlete to turn to get advice. And not just on whether to take a certain supplement or not.

''I've come across instances where sportspeople have been treated badly by administrators, whether it be doping or not, or received advice they are not happy with. There's nowhere for them to deal with this.'' Koh, a former elite sportsman, pointed to research that showed athletes were reticent to go to ASADA for advice, with a survey showing that coaches (87.85 per cent), GPs (86.53 per cent) and the internet (82.83 per cent) ranked much higher than ASADA (23.34 per cent) as a preferred source of information.

''One problem with ASADA being the information source is that they also police violations,'' Koh said.

''It's like asking the police about the legality of cannabis - once you ask them how much may be legal or illegal you then draw attention to yourself. All of a sudden it's a case of 'Oh, you may want to try something, so we're going to keep an eye on you'.

''Someone needs to look out for the players.''

The NRL has shown a desire to begin a blood passport register, but the pair felt the screening method was problematic for rugby league.

''Does it work as a tool to catch dopers? I say no,'' Hardie said.

''The experience in cycling has been that on one level it's reduced doping, but the guys at the top level just keep their blood values stable so as not to cause any abnormalities which the blood passport may pick up. So they can keep doping but doing it sensibly.

''The blood passport doesn't give you proof of doping like a positive test. All it does is, because there is an abnormality in someone's blood values, show there is a probability that they may have used a method which is probably banned.''

Hardie highlighted the fact there was no uniformity with how ASADA dealt with Australian athletes. For example, it had the power to prosecute cyclists over alleged doping breaches, while any evidence it produced on NRL players would be handed over for the ARLC to rule on. He also felt for the players, saying they had almost no chance under the present system to gain credible advice on what not to take.

''Here am I, supposedly an expert, and I can't work out whether the [substances in question] are banned or not. So how is a footballer going to work it out?'' he said.
 

El Diablo

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Interesting read... Dank had left Manly in 2010.


This bit gives me the feel that the whole case is over the AOD9604 use and based of evidence from Kenley. It will be interesting if Dank has some evidence he checked the validity of the use of the product.



WADA also insists what Essendon took is banned yet that same article is more about how AFL players should not be banned
 

El Diablo

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http://www.theaustralian.com.au/spo...on-nrls-passport/story-fnca0von-1226619451589

A $1 million stamp on NRL's passport

by: Brent Read
From: The Australian
April 13, 2013 12:00AM

The NRL is budgeting to spend close to $1million as part of its revised drug testing regime, which will be headlined by the introduction of biological passport testing.
Source: The Daily Telegraph

THE NRL is putting its money where its mouth is when it comes to the war on drugs. The Weekend Australian can reveal the game's governing body has budgeted to spend close to $1 million as part of its revised drug testing regime, which will be headlined by the introduction of biological passport testing.

Club officials have been given until Tuesday to provide feedback on the proposed changes and an announcement could be made as early as the next day. Club chief executives have also been asked to provide their imprimatur to the introduction of a whistle-blower scheme, although its finalisation seems more problematic.

Australian sport has been plunged into controversy since allegations emerged that sports scientist Stephen Dank had introduced supplement programs to NRL and AFL clubs which may be deemed illegal.

Dank was last night at Allianz Stadium to watch the Sydney Roosters-Canterbury match. When asked why he would attend a football match at this heated time, he replied: "I've got to live my life."

Support for a strengthened drug regime is universal. As part of the documentation provided to clubs, it is understood they were informed the NRL would spend upwards of $850,000 on its drug testing program this season. A large part of that expense will be devoted to the athlete biological passports.

Up to 50 players will be subject to the first round of testing and will face as many as 10 blood tests each season. Each test costs the game $1200. That accounts for $600,000 before adding up other costs.

The Rugby League Players Association has also been consulted over the proposed changes and chief executive David Garnsey said he anticipated he would convey his body's position to the NRL soon.

NRL chief executive Dave Smith first raised the prospect of using the athlete biological passport in February, when he told The Australian that members of the Queensland and NSW State of Origin sides could be among the first batch of players tested.

However, it is understood the documentation given to the clubs suggests the identity of the players to be tested will remain anonymous. Smith raised the prospect of using the athlete biological passport in response to the Australian Crime Commission report into drugs, gambling and organised crime in Australian sport.

That report subsequently led to an Australian Sports Anti-Doping Authority investigation which is ongoing.

The other proposal in the response to the ACC report - the NRL has already set up an integrity unit - is the whistleblower scheme. The proposal was distributed to clubs last month and outlines plans to grant immunity to whistleblowers who provide information in relation to drug use or match-fixing.

The proposal prompted a backlash from some officials and seems unlikely to receive unanimous support among the clubs. It also appears unlikely to gain support from players if the reaction of Wests Tigers captain Robbie Farah is any guide.

"My job is to play footy, not dob on people or catch out cheats," Farah wrote in a column for newspaper mX.

"I can't see a hotline set up for NRL players to inform on each other getting much use. I wouldn't dob in anyone, whether it be a teammate or a guy from another side.

"The NRL and ASADA are there to catch players doing the wrong thing."
 

taipan

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Do you know how chemists work?

How can anyone update a list of banned substances when it doesn't have a name and was invented yesterday?

The white list is probably the way to go - a list the allowable supplements.

Based on the speed that WADA and ASADA works,I could have written another version of War and Peace.
 

taipan

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No he was dobbed in by teammates who did follow the team culture but were asked to dob in Lance so they could receive a reduced sentence, does that sound familar to anyone. There is a lot of testamony that team mates felt pressured into doping because they would be kicked off the team if they didn't.

You really do have no idea when it comes to this subject. All that would need to be done by the people making these drugs is to change a couple of compounds and give it a new name and its off the list again. The reason the catch all statement is there is the people recommending and giving these drugs are usually well aware of what they are doing to the body, thats why they use them. They just drug shop and play dumb when they are caught.


In the eyes of the beholder actually,as I am not the only one who thinks that a generalisation is lazy or amateurish.The whold thing from the very start was handled amateurishly by authories and the Govt,and one can see why.
Ings sprouting off on Tv ,and he is not even with the mob in quesion now
Never heard of using more resources,both human and technical,to try and nip it in the bud or at least try to keep abreast of developments.Thsi inept Govt ,spends billions on an NBN,and under resources other depts.Go figure.

And you believe players are going to dob in their mates,when they have NFI whether supplements now and used then were illegal,and followed "doctors'"orders so to speak.

Of course crims try to keep ahead of the pack,it's been going on for ages.That's why new techniques and technologies are introduced and more resources put into play.

If players knew it was illegal,I have no problems with them being shafted.I want it done in a fair legal manner
 
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