Miller was a legend
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Seriously, this whole thread is farkin boring!
Seriously, this whole thread is farkin boring!
Seriously, this whole thread is farkin boring!
Speculation Alert: BOT a wee bit there's a few things I'm pretty sure of now. ASADA may well be taking their sweet time in complete accordance with whatever Act they administer. But they don't know what the substances are/were, just that something was administered to the players. No news there for anyone. I'm encouraged to hear that if the commish wanted to kick us out the fine would have been crippling. It seems, and Smith said this also, that they are committed to the sharkies and have no plans to remove us from the comp. It seems likely that Flanno will only get the 9 months and the fines will be just 600k (speculation only). The payments might be paid through a payment plan that would see our monthly payment deducted from our share of some of the NRL revenue for example (we'd get say 25k less a month for however long). Turning to the debate about ASADAs powers, if what I?ve heard is correct (this is for you LB), the evidence as your AFP contacts have said may be there but it would seem that its either inconclusive or can?t be substantiated to make it worthwhile. They are continuing on with the investigation but it seems though they can?t act without that, which they currently, do not have. I heard the words "...the case is in a shambles" used some time back but the source had second hand info and it might have been an emotive comment. What is quite clear though is the duty of care has been breached and the club is exposed. We will get through this and be better for it, which I?m certain of.
The fine is the maximum allowable under the NRLs anti doping code.
Good point Frenz. Duty of care breach (code of conduct) though is what they are hammering. Maybe they could have, but elected not to, add that to the provisional fine. Not sure.The fine is the maximum allowable under the NRLs anti doping code.
SOME industrial and defamation lawyers have indicated Cronulla Sharks and head coach Shane Flanagan have a strong defence against high-level sanctions imposed upon them by the National Rugby League (NRL).
The Sharks, now with a CEO in Steve Noyce and a new board of directors, say they will continue to work closely with the NRL to improve governance but will "strenuously defend" charges relating to the club's 2011 supplements regime, the $1 million fine ($400,000 suspended) on the club and the 12-month suspension of Flanagan.
"The Sharks will survive this ... we are in a strong position," said chairman Damian Keogh, indicating the club's $300 million Woolooware unit and retail development was going as planned and leagues club trading had lifted substantially.
The NRL found the Sharks breached the NRL code of conduct in several respects and that head coach Shane Flanagan and the then head of strength and conditioning Trent Elkin (now at Parramatta) were responsible for various failings leading to those contraventions.
But in cancelling Elkin's registration completely, the NRL made it clear where it believed most blame lay, and officials and players privately believe Flanagan has been made the "fall guy" for the Sharks, nearly three years on today.
Also, numerous legal experts indicated the NRL may have erred in airing details, especially in the case of Flanagan, without "indisputable proof" and in the absence of any ASADA investigation findings.
At issue is the NRL's publication of what the NRL chief executive Dave Smith admitted were only "preliminary findings" based on their own integrity unit's investigation.
One lawyer told the Leader: "If any of those so-called findings before a packed press conference and published, aired and televised are not proven, then the NRL will have a serious case to answer.
"On face value, the club and coach can feel seriously compromised by the airings of any findings that are in an only preliminary stage."
In defence of Flanagan, another lawyer wrote: "There is a concept in safety called "reasonable reliance" you are allowed to rely on competent people to undertake work. You don't have to stand over their shoulder. The NRL don't seem to have factored this into their investigation."
While the NRL has given all parties until January 15 to submit their defence, Sharks chairman Damian Keogh and Flanagan were tied up yesterday in discussions with lawyers, while assistant coach Peter Sharp took over the off-season running of the Sharks team, with World Cup winners, Sharks captain Paul Gallen and Andrew Fifita along with fellow representative Luke Lewis (shoulder operation) resting.
Despite rumours swirling in league circles the past month about his possible suspension, Flanagan was deeply upset when the findings finally came down, but guarded when contacted by the Leader later.
What have I done wrong bar trust people to do their job? he said.
Asked what some of the advice was that he had received, he said: Unfair, un-Australian ... not a football club.
Before the ASADA dramas broke in February this year, the old board headed by former chairman Damian Irvine and chartered accountant Craig Douglas had managed to secure an up-front payment of $10 million from the developers thus reducing bank debt from $13.3m and accompanying crippling annual interest bills.
Following a club investigation and the leaking of the [Trish] Kavanagh report into the 2011 supplements program, the old board decided to sack football manager Darren Mooney, trainer Mark Noakes, club doctor David Givney and physio Konrad Schultz (contracted to the club), and stand down Shane Flanagan, who was reinstated after a fortnight.
RALLY CALL
Don Rogers, who recently became engaged in the club lounge named after his late father, Sharks Immortal Steve Rogers, has urged all Cronulla supporters to buy club memberships, sponsorships and supporters gear.
Show you are a real Sharks supporter this Christmas, said Rogers.
CRONULLA SHARKS TODAY
PLUSES
Development first year: club to receive $1.5-$2m revenue from unit sales;
Next eight years: receive up to $40m from unit, retail and new club development revenue; Board: includes wealthy businessmen headed by chairman Damian Keogh and Craig Airey (and backing from some old board members); Membership: up 210 per cent on this time last year; Sponsorship: 60 per cent of 2014 target sold; Leagues Club: previous losses turned to profits mid-2013.
MINUSES
Bank loan: $2.6m (originally $13.2m); ASADA costs: $820,000 (mainly legal fees); Salary cap breach: $150,000 fine; NRL fine: $600,000 (expect to be paid off in stages); Additional costs? A new coach/assistant if Flanagan appeal fails; for new NRL players if any suspensions follow ASADA investigation and/or if ex-players succeed in legal action against the club over 2011 supplements program.
NRL CHARGES
PRELIMINARY FINDINGS AGAINST THE CLUB
Exposed players to significant potential risks to health and to possible breaches of the NRL anti-doping rules; allowed persons without the necessary qualifications and training to administer supplements to players; failed to obtain the fully informed consent of players to the administration of particular supplements; failed to ensure proper supervision and controls were in place or to devise and implement systems to ensure compliance with appropriate standards to safeguard the health and welfare of its players and, failed to take appropriate action when it became aware that unsafe practices had been employed in the administration of supplements to players.
PRELIMINARY FINDINGS AGAINST SHANE FLANAGAN
Failed to ensure a safe and healthy work environment or properly supervise the head of strength and conditioning [Trent Elkin]; failed to ensure [Elkin] complied with his obligation to inform the club doctor about changes made to the supplement program and to obtain his prior approval about those changes; failed to take appropriate action when he became aware that unsafe practices had been employed in the administration of supplements to players; failed to ensure [Elkin] complied with a protocol that had been agreed on April 7, 2011: that previous approval of the club doctor be obtained with respect to any supplements intended to be administered to players.
PRELIMINARY FINDINGS AGAINST TRENT ELKIN
Exposed players to significant potential risks to health and possible breaches of the NRL anti-doping rules; allowed persons without the necessary qualifications and training to administer supplements by injection; personally injected players without adequate qualifications and training to do so; failed to obtain the fully informed consent of players to the administration of particular supplements; failed to comply with his obligation to inform the club doctor about changes made to the supplement program and to obtain his prior approval with respect to those changes; misrepresented material facts to players in relation to the supplement program; failed to comply with a protocol that had been agreed on April 7, 2011, to the effect that previous approval of the club doctor be obtained with respect to any supplements that were intended to be administered to players.
As news broke yesterday regarding the provisional suspension of Cronulla head coach Shane Flanagan and the $1m fine handed down by the NRL, I, along with many other Sharks fans were disappointed yet relieved that a small slice of this seemingly everlasting drug scandal had come to a conclusion.
This was a large step in ending this painfully long scandal that has not only tarnished Cronullas name but has dragged the NRL through the mud as well.
Despite there being many loyal Shane Flanagan supporters, it didn’t take long for someone to have a crack at Flanagan and the person to do so was Daily Telegraph journalist Rebecca Wilson.
Wilson has been covering the ASADA story since it made headlines and her apparently, one-sided, dog with a bone mentality, comes as no surprise to any Sharks fan.
Following a day in which Sharks fans had to come to terms with the temporary loss of their head coach, the last thing they needed was a Wilson article that in my view, spoke more opinion than fact.
Instead of simply doing what we all want and sticking to the facts, Wilson went on, not only to have an attack at Coach Flanagan but also at the Cronulla fans.
It all started with Wilson claiming “Cronulla coach Shane Flanagan is a man disgraced.”
Wilson’s emotive, headline grabbing use of the word disgraced, is a far from accurate description of Shane Flanagan.
Wilson then went on to make the most outrageous of statements.
“I believe his coaching days should be over”
Well! Thankfully Wilson is not in a position to make that call.
Wilson should have done the decent thing after making such an attack on Coach Flanagan, and explained her reasons for holding this opinion.
Flanagan has been handed down his punishment by CEO Dave Smith and the NRL after what Smith continues to explain as a “thorough investigation”
A 12 month ban, which could be reduced to 9 months doesn’t indicate to me the NRL thinks Flanagan’s coaching days should be over. So why does Wilson believe so? Or is this just another one of Wilson's anti Crounlla attacks?
Just when I thought this piece couldn’t get any more lopsided, Wilson went on to attack the group of people that certainly don’t need any more negativity, the Cronulla fans.
Wilson said “I have worked on this story for eight months. During that time, the team working with me has been pilloried, threatened and abused by some involved with the scandal and the fans who purport to believe nothing was amiss at their club”
I’m not going to comment on the allegations of threats and abuse from those involved with the scandal because I simply don’t know if they are factual. However I am going to comment on the “fans who purport to believe nothing was amiss at their club” part of Wilson’s statement.
This is just simply wrong.
Cronulla fans would be the first to agree that any wrong doing in the 2011 year needs to be dealt with in the appropriate ways. Whether that is through player suspension, fines or any other means of punishment.
If Wilson wonders why her time covering this ASADA story has been so difficult, then maybe she should take a long look back at the articles she has produced this year.
Her 2013 ASADA articles seem to have a total, anti Cronulla theme rather than a balanced reporting of events.
For example her article regarding the apparent plans to relocate the Sharks “into the burgeoning league heartland of southern or central Queensland”
After the fines the NRL handed down to the Sharks yesterday I don’t believe the NRL ever had concrete plans to relocate the Sharks, as a fine of this size will not sink the club or force them into relocation as Wilson’s article suggests.
Again, another example of Wilson writing down her thoughts and simply pressing post.
Wilson’s articles had a common theme throughout the 2013 year and anyone could be mistaken for thinking that Wilson has an axe to grind.
This couldn’t have been made clearer in Wilson’s article that had the headline “New Cronulla Sharks boss has his head stuck in the sand”
Wilson set the tone early in the article by saying “I believe Keogh, like many followers of either Essendon or Cronulla, are in denial.”
Harsh words coming from someone who isn’t Damien Keogh or a supporter of either of these embattled clubs.
Wilson went on to say “This is not the figment of my imagination. It is real very, very real and it’s coming to Cronulla within weeks.”
Well it’s either a figment of her imagination or she has a poor knowledge on what ‘within weeks’ means.
Wilson posted this article on July 6th 2013 and yesterday , December 17th 2013 ,was the first day for any punishments to be handed down to the club.
That is a total of 164 days and approximately 23.4 weeks from the time Wilson claimed that the Big Bad Wolf was on his way to get the Sharks, to the time something actually happened.
In the end Rebecca Wilsons eight month, win at all cost, crusade against the Sharks Coach, players and fans will all be to no avail. Wilson needs to understand that the Cronulla club is bigger than present events just as journalism is bigger than Rebecca Wilson.
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So it begins. Wonder who they are, if this is accurate.
http://www.kiamaindependent.com.au/story/1982004/more-2011-sharks-seek-legal-advice/?cs=12
Speculation Alert: BOT a wee bit there's a few things I'm pretty sure of now. ASADA may well be taking their sweet time in complete accordance with whatever Act they administer. But they don't know what the substances are/were, just that something was administered to the players. No news there for anyone. I'm encouraged to hear that if the commish wanted to kick us out the fine would have been crippling. It seems, and Smith said this also, that they are committed to the sharkies and have no plans to remove us from the comp. It seems likely that Flanno will only get the 9 months and the fines will be just 600k (speculation only). The payments might be paid through a payment plan that would see our monthly payment deducted from our share of some of the NRL revenue for example (we'd get say 25k less a month for however long). Turning to the debate about ASADAs powers, if what I?ve heard is correct (this is for you LB), the evidence as your AFP contacts have said may be there but it would seem that its either inconclusive or can?t be substantiated to make it worthwhile. They are continuing on with the investigation but it seems though they can?t act without that, which they currently, do not have. I heard the words "...the case is in a shambles" used some time back but the source had second hand info and it might have been an emotive comment. What is quite clear though is the duty of care has been breached and the club is exposed. We will get through this and be better for it, which I?m certain of.
Then you should shut the f**k about there being more to come for Sharks fans. I nowt seems that since I shoved the specifics of the ACt & the Code up your nose, you now realise that at present there is no or very very little evidence against any players in the NRL as no infraction notices have been served. & since the onus of proff is on the athlete not ASADA, that means not very much evidence is required & can be as little as somebody elses word.Just clear one thing up, I only made inquiries about ASADAs investigative powers. I have no knowledge of what actually evidence they have (if any).
Wrong again.I'm simply saying that time is not an indication on how much evidence they do or don't have.