The Crockett debate

[Captian_Klutz]

Whether or not he should have been sent, he was. This isn't about that, it's about what's to come - was the send off a sufficient penalty now the event has passed? That is the question.

Well Captain Obvious would say No weeks at all then and the send off was a "travesty of justice" FFS :roll:

Captian Klutz would just call you then idiot you already are ;-)

 

[-Dr.J-]

ouch.... his neck has bent back 90 degrees after that shot.

for those who said it was a shouder shot are clearly blind.
IMO this shot was much worse than the AJ shot, as AJ was hit from behind and at low elevation.
CP was hit at standing height, facing directly to his opponent. Crockett had all the torso and the legs to tackle and he's chosen to go high with a swinging arm, first contact to the jaw.

CP has been left in a serious concussion with violent vomiting. Luckily he escaped without any serious neck injury.

Everyone that is downplaying the seriousness of this tackle should really ask themselves what they would do if there kid was hit like that?

Way to try and bias the situation there. But photos can be decieving when not viewed as it was in full slow mo. For instance, if I took a photo behind you while you were sitting down and with Sean Hampstead standing in front of you, it'd probably look like you were copping one in the mouth.

What kind of emotive nonsense is pleading people try and imagine it were their kid. The fact of the matter is he copped some shoulder that crept higher as he went to surrender. This straightened him up a bit too much from the position he was looking to be in and then he slammed into the hands coming through (at the right height) from Witt.

I can understand a penalty and even being put on report. But sending off?! What?!


Man the Warriors year in year out cop the brunt of some absolutely shocking calls and games where they have to blow the enemy off the park because in any close game the ref can have way too much influence.

Dodger, I liked how your poll backfired on you from people spanning almost every NRL club, including your own, then were only backed up by a couple of muppets thinking it was funny to vote for lots of weeks for jollies. You're being one eyed then trying to change the focus halfway through the thread kinda makes you look worse.

Judging by the Warriors first half play (which lately has been a bit dire really over both halves) I think we definitely could've competed if we were in a more even position. Toward the end there our men were too tired from so much extra workload and with the Doggies really aiming up on that gap it was a blowout.

I don't mind losing (hell I'm a Warriors fan I must be a glutton for punishment) to a good side if we played well and the playing field was even. But it wasn't even there today at all and that should be disappointing to everyone involved. Poor refs decision. I hope Phelps is okay though cos he got rinsed.

 

[Bernster]

I reckon Crockett will get anywhere up to six weeks.

On the matter of SBW in round 1...

A - SBW the player in the wrong (although I didn't see anything wrong with the tackle on the replay)

B - The hit was on Johns

and

C - Crowd pressure

In conclusion The ref had no other option imho

 

[Winston Smith]

He should get nothing, but since Sonny got 2 weeks, I dare say he will as well.

Shouldn't have been sent off ... Hampstead and co reacted to the damage not the crime. But he will get about the same as SBW (maybe the no-name factor will get him 3-4 weeks) as the send off decision has to be backed by the judiciary to save face.

 

[AuckMel]

Pics are funny. In this one it looks like Hohaia's about to do all the damage.

 

[Timmah]

Yeah, pictures are a funny thing.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IOdcN579-go

High shot sickens Phelps
By Steve Mascord

June 03, 2007 12:00
Article from: The Daily Telegraph

Bulldogs 40 Warriors 20

WARRIORS winger Michael Crockett was last night trying to contact rival Cameron Phelps after a sickening hit that left the Bulldogs youngster still vomiting four hours after its perpetrator was sent off.

The home side was left one man down after just five minutes at Mt Smart Stadium when Crockett – back in first grade after Manu Vatuvei's Monday Night Football shocker – collected Phelps high as he was running the ball out of his own corner.

Phelps was still dizzy and physically ill late last night as team-mates stayed by his side, forgoing celebrations after their first competition points in four games.

"I ran down to put a bit of pressure on – I thought it was a good kick and I wanted to pin them down there," a stunned Crockett told The Daily Telegraph in the Warriors' rooms. "I wanted to fire up the boys, you know?

"I've hit him with my shoulder. I've got a corked shoulder now, you don't get a corked shoulder from a swinging arm. It's out of my hands now."

Warriors official Richard Becht last night handed Phelps' phone number to the former Wests Tigers and St George Illawarra winger at a post-match function and he made several unsuccessful attempts to get through.

But Phelps was in bed at the Crowne Plaza and not taking calls.

"I haven't had the chance to speak to him but I'd like to," Crockett said.

"I didn't mean anything by it, it was an accident."

Team doctor Hugh Hazard said that Phelps had no structural injuries, just severe concussion. Coaches Steve Folkes and Ivan Cleary agreed that Sonny Bill Williams' dismissal for a shot on Andrew Johns on March 18 meant Crockett's tackle was "a send-off offence". Williams said: "He (Crockett) would be feeling pretty bad right now. He'd be feeling sorry for what he's done."

But despite being told by their captain Andrew Ryan that they should put the Warriors in their own round-one shoes after Crockett's departure, the Bulldogs' lead at halftime was only 18-14, after Warriors winger Patrick Ah Van posted a spectacular score from Michael Witt's cross-kick in the 33rd minute.

In the second half, however, the Bulldogs' numerical advantage came to the fore. Man-of-the-match Williams ignored the attention of three defenders for one of his two tries and set up additional touchdowns for Kane Cleal and Reni Maitua.

The Warriors got as close as 20-24 for six minutes, but that was it.

It was an imperfect triumph for Folkes and his players after a week in which the club's unity has been questioned, with Williams saying: "After all the contro- versy of the week, we shut a few people up."

Unfortunately, outstanding back-rower Lee Te Maari will have to watch the Dogs' resurrection bid from the sidelines. He is out for eight weeks suffering from a medial ligament tear.

"You always look forward to playing a team like the Bulldogs – it's just a shame it wasn't 13 on 13," Warriors captain Steve Price said.

Asked what impact the sending-off had on the result, coach Ivan Cleary answered: "Lots."



BULLDOGS 40 (S Williams 2, L Te Maari, J Hickey, K Cleal, R Maitua, B Roberts tries; H El Masri 6 goals) NZ WARRIORS 20 (L Swann S Mannering P Ah Van J Ropati tries; T Martin 2 goals) at Mt Smart Stadium, Auckland. Crowd: 10,041. Referee: S Hampstead.

http://www.news.com.au/dailytelegraph/story/0,22049,21841274-5001023,00.html



Watch it all the times you like, Crockett went in wrong, the upper arm went for Phelps' neck-head area.

Trying to exonerate him based on the screen shot AuckMel posted is f**king laughable. A case to answer IMO but a week max - he was attempting a lower tackle and unfortunately the player was slightly coming down. Look pretty clear from the point of contact to me that Crockett is clearly the one who did the damage (and I'm not suggesting it was deliberate as I said he looked to be trying to impact on the chest/torso rather than anywhere high). Hohaia had little to do with the injury.

 

[Timmah]

If I may...

"I've hit him with my shoulder. I've got a corked shoulder now, you don't get a corked shoulder from a swinging arm. It's out of my hands now."

Now, am I supposed to feel sorry for the kid? Give me a break, it doesn't matter what you hit him with, it was high and the match review committee will decide an appropriate charge. I'm not suggesting it was a deliberate high shot in the slightest but whining "It was my shoulder not my arm" does nothing.


Team doctor Hugh Hazard said that Phelps had no structural injuries, just severe concussion. Coaches Steve Folkes and Ivan Cleary agreed that Sonny Bill Williams' dismissal for a shot on Andrew Johns on March 18 meant Crockett's tackle was "a send-off offence". Williams said: "He (Crockett) would be feeling pretty bad right now. He'd be feeling sorry for what he's done."

My point... personally, from an individual case point of view it wasn't a send off offence. Unfortunately though, based on the precedent set in round one, which is what I've been saying, he had to go. Perhaps the injury consideration is having too much effect on refereeing decisions relating to high tackles and send offs but a decision needed to be made and Hampstead made it.


Asked what impact the sending-off had on the result, coach Ivan Cleary answered: "Lots."

Oh boo fricken hoo. Any team can win any game if they put their mind to it. The final winning margin suggests to me the Warriors would've still lost - hell, the 'Dogs could've run riot for all we know. Every game is what you make it and NZ have noone to blame but themselves for butchering opportunities left right and centre in the second half in particular.


I'll clarify in the end my verdict on Crockett, which another 'Dogs fan said earlier. I personally believe he shouldn't have been sent off. However, he was. As a result, a 0 or 1 week suspension would be sufficient. Based on SBW (as was the send off), he'll get one or two weeks on the sidelines instead IMO. A pretty unfortunate situation for all involved - but the Warriors have been without the guy for a fair chunk of the season already - what's the big deal... bring Vatuvei back or blood a younger bloke.

 

[Timmah]

Another angle. Hohaia yet to touch him and he looks more or less gorn (unconscious) already.

 

[Timmah]

I take back what I said about Lance:

 

[Dr Crane]

Jesus Dodge, shut up. Funny how your other angle doesn't show Crocketts arm on Phelps' shoulder at the start.

You can do anything with photos.

Look! Chris Lawrence is flying!

Quick! Lets ban tackles!

 

[Glenn]

Send off sufficient, the inital contact was around the shoulder.

 

[smitty]

you need a fifth option "nothing - the send of was excessive"

 

[Fast Eddie]

If I may...

"I've hit him with my shoulder. I've got a corked shoulder now, you don't get a corked shoulder from a swinging arm. It's out of my hands now."

Now, am I supposed to feel sorry for the kid? Give me a break, it doesn't matter what you hit him with, it was high and the match review committee will decide an appropriate charge. I'm not suggesting it was a deliberate high shot in the slightest but whining "It was my shoulder not my arm" does nothing.


Asked what impact the sending-off had on the result, coach Ivan Cleary answered: "Lots."

Oh boo fricken hoo. Any team can win any game if they put their mind to it. The final winning margin suggests to me the Warriors would've still lost - hell, the 'Dogs could've run riot for all we know. Every game is what you make it and NZ have noone to blame but themselves for butchering opportunities left right and centre in the second half in particular.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

You are getting into Cleary after he said that the sending off had a large impact on the game!! Of course it did! Whats he supposed nospam46 say!?

And since Crockett got sent of for a swinging arm I'd say his statement says says a bit about the touch judge report.....as he says it's out of his hands and you are trying to accuse him of whinging! Give me a break. Go dig up some more photos.

 

[Timmah]

I posted the photos in order for those who might not have seen it or who wanted to see different angles, have a f**king cry.

I accused him of whinging. He can say "it's out of my hands" at the end but the comments preceding it "You don't get a corked shoulder from a swinging arm" is smart-assy and whingey.

Kinda like me

 

[Fast Eddie]

I would like to know what question he was asked to get that response.

Probably something like "Did you actually hit him with a swinging arm" or something along those lines.

 

[Timmah]

As would I - one of the problems of newspaper reporting - they only tell you what they want you to read.

Ah well. End of the day it's not like he's gonna cop a month on the sidelines. Also makes me glad it was two relative nuffies involved and not two big name players, the sh*te would be hitting the fan right now.

 

[The Preacher]

I'm saying two weeks only for the fact Sonny's tackle had set a precedent.

In terms of what he deserves, given the send off, I'd say one week at an absolute max.

Agree 100%. The "crime" will not have any bearing on the suspension. The precedent has been set.

 

[-Dr.J-]

I think it's laughable how you guys think one crappy call in round 1 means they have to stick to it and make crappy calls all year to satisfy poor old SBW. Remembering his was a swinging arm from behind and this is a shoulder riding up. If you wanna set a precedent for shoulder charges look at any SBW highlight reel where he obviously donked someone on the head with it and the Bulldogs one eyes like Dodger got a chubby. No send off there eh?

Perhaps we should keep the obstruction rules from round 1 cos of all the poor teams that suffered from the call then. COS THAT WOULD BE SENSIBLE!!1

 

[skeepe]

Clearly a shoulders tackle. Not even a penalty, IMO. Warriors play on for the knock on, try.

Thanks for the proof that there should have been no send off Dodge. Phelps was just unlucky. As for the touch judge "first point of contact the head" get some glasses you f**king clown.

 

[skeepe]

Another thing to think about:

Reni Maitua, not long after this incident, collared a Warriors player with a swinging arm around the nose. The Warriors player got up and played on, and Mr Bean didn't even blow for a penalty. If there is any consistency, Maitua should have been sent off as well.