Tim Moltzen ... (war is over)

[TimmyB]

It's subjective to a degree, I agree. But then you seem to contradict yourself. Don't ever become a lawyer.

So if I offer you a Honda Civic to replace a BMW that I smashed, and you refused, I would be off the hook?

Better analogy is if I used the BMW for a delivery business and you smashed it. Of course you would be liable for repairs to the BMW. But if you offered me the use of a Honda Civic to do my deliveries and I refused on the grounds that it's performance was inferior, I couldn't then claim all of my lost profits - they'd be reduced on the basis that I failed to take reasonable steps to mitigate the harm.

There's no contradiction. I don't know how the Dragons could possibly show actual, compensable loss - thus the comment about quantifiable. If you can't show actual loss, you don't get damages.

Scarily for me and the general public, I will be admitted in December.

Edit: The jibes about spelling directed at me were well deserved.

 

[dragon-83]

NRL official Ian Schubert to decide TIm Moltzen's future within next few days, maybe tomorrow. I think he should be a Dragon

@BulldogRitchie

 

[Bring back choc]

NRL official Ian Schubert to decide TIm Moltzen's future within next few days, maybe tomorrow. I think he should be a Dragon

@BulldogRitchie[/QUOTE

That's his opinion... Not a statement based on any fact or inside info.

 

[Bring back choc]

I would be very surprised if the recommendation wasnt that Tim should play with saints. He was told to look around for a contract. He did. And then he found one.

If he's allowed to back out it will open a very dangerous can of worms.
It's the principal of how contracts have been done for ages.

Hell be made to play at the dragons unless we agree to Let him stay a tiger.
Which I don't think we willl because it's too late for us to have a plan B.

 

[DirtyHarry]

If it wasn't a waste of money I'd love us to win the fight for Timmy's signature & then leave him playing park footy for three years. He's an asswipe & doesn't deserve to wear the red V

 

[boxa777]

Better analogy is if I used the BMW for a delivery business and you smashed it. Of course you would be liable for repairs to the BMW. But if you offered me the use of a Honda Civic to do my deliveries and I refused on the grounds that it's performance was inferior, I couldn't then claim all of my lost profits - they'd be reduced on the basis that I failed to take reasonable steps to mitigate the harm.

And that's where your deluded theory breaks down. By your reckoning, the Tigers could offer some reserve grader with 2 legs and 2 arms on the basis that he could provide the same service as Moltzen, albeit inferior. Won't ever hold up.

I can understand the desperation that you share in regards to the halfback situation for 2012 with your pathetic club management, so i can understand why your thoughts are misguided. But there is enough verbal quotation from a vast array of individuals to indicate that all parties were on the same page at one point. Unfortunately some with questionable integrity have now chosen to distance themselves from proceedings and try and play on the fact that a young impressionable Moltzen suddenly doesn't want to change clubs.

They clearly were ok with letting him go in June, otherwise his manager would not have been firstly negotiating with another club and then secondly allowing him to sign away his future for the next three years.

 

[andrew9148]

It's a big call to stop a player from playing for a club who want him
And he wants to play for.

 

[Guvner]

And that's where your deluded theory breaks down. By your reckoning, the Tigers could offer some reserve grader with 2 legs and 2 arms on the basis that he could provide the same service as Moltzen, albeit inferior. Won't ever hold up.

 

[nrlnrl]

hey guys, do you really want him at the Dragons ?

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...he-dragons-clear/story-e6frexnr-1226172303643

It is the insult that will anger every Dragons fan - but Tim Moltzen won't buckle.

Moltzen's manager Martin Tauber yesterday claimed that it would be "crazy and intolerable" for the NRL to force the Wests Tigers utility to play for St George Illawarra next season.

After receiving additional information from both clubs at 4pm on Wednesday, NRL salary cap auditor Ian Schubert continues to investigate the fact Moltzen has signed contracts with both clubs.

Schubert is the man who will recommend where Moltzen plays next season, and he will announce his decision within days, possibly even today.

Tauber has told The Daily Telegraph that his client does not want to represent the famous Red V for the next three seasons. After being in constant contact with his client, Tauber said: "Tim is anxious about this. He is a young man, he's only 22, and he is concerned about his playing future. He wants to stay at Wests Tigers, without question. He has a lot of friends there. Hopefully they (NRL) take the kid's wishes into consideration."

Asked what Moltzen's reaction would be if he was pushed to the Dragons, Tauber said: "That would be crazy. Intolerable. If it is Wests Tigers, then it's done and dusted. If it's St George Illawarra, then that is something we will have to consider, maybe an appeal.

"There's nothing more to say. We will just have to wait and see."

Saints officials privately question Tauber's comments because the accredited player manager guided his client to Saints in July. The NRL is saying little until Schubert announces his recommendation.

Dragons chief executive Peter Doust was not commenting yesterday, while Wests Tigers CEO Stephen Humphreys did not return calls.

Former greats from both clubs have very contrasting views.

"He (Moltzen) signed the piece of paper, no one forced him to," former Saints grand final forward Brad Mackay said. "For a time there, he wanted to play for the Dragons, then all of a sudden Wests Tigers want him back. He should honour his contract and play with the Dragons. If it's on compassionate grounds, that's different. But he shouldn't be allowed to walk away just because he changes his mind. The Dragons could use him. He's a good player."

Ex-Tigers champion Ben Elias fired back. "I have a high regard for Peter Doust and his operations but why would you want a player who doesn't want to be at your club?" Elias said. "You can't get value from someone who wants to be elsewhere. Tim's heart is at the Tigers and that's where he is happy."

 

[MONGO]

compensation please !!!!

 

[Firey_Dragon]

It's a big call to stop a player from playing for a club who want him
And he wants to play for.

Indeed. It's an even bigger call to say no to a club who signed a contract with a player who sought permission to find another club, was given permission and then the contract was contested 3 months after it was signed when all transfer windows were virtually shut. It completely breaks the sanctity of contracts in the NRL and how they are handled from now on.

It's a very dangerous precedent for the NRL if they rule in favour of the Tigers. There'll be no winners out of this. I don't want Moltzen for any other reason than to see him rot in reserve grade for 3 years, unfortunately that would never be the outcome of this.

With that said, I'm enjoying the fact that the Tigers and Moltzens agent are trying to put as much pressure on the Dragons to relent and give up on this, and we aren't moving.

 

[Father Ted]

Moltzen 22 going on 2

 

[Father Ted]

There's no contradiction. I don't know how the Dragons could possibly show actual, compensable loss - thus the comment about quantifiable. If you can't show actual loss, you don't get damages.

I presume The Dragons legal people have a different view on the matter otherwise I can't see why we would have pursued this.

Scarily for me and the general public, I will be admitted in December.

I wish you every success in your career. I will probably be admitted around the same time but to an entirely different type of institution :crazy:

Edit: The jibes about spelling directed at me were well deserved.

Yep Nan used to talk about people in glass houses , I had fun with it all good.

 

[dubopov]

It's a big call to stop a player from playing for a club who want him
And he wants to play for.

they only wanted him after lui belted his missus

 

[andrew9148]

Indeed. It's an even bigger call to say no to a club who signed a contract with a player who sought permission to find another club, was given permission and then the contract was contested 3 months after it was signed when all transfer windows were virtually shut. It completely breaks the sanctity of contracts in the NRL and how they are handled from now on.

It's a very dangerous precedent for the NRL if they rule in favour of the Tigers. There'll be no winners out of this. I don't want Moltzen for any other reason than to see him rot in reserve grade for 3 years, unfortunately that would never be the outcome of this.

With that said, I'm enjoying the fact that the Tigers and Moltzens agent are trying to put as much pressure on the Dragons to relent and give up on this, and we aren't moving.

St George have arguments in their favor without you making up stories. The tigers put out a press release the day Tim signed saying he was nt released. And despite some inconsistent comments they never have released him.

It's not a dangerous precedent. Any contract dispute depends on it's own facts and it's own unique circumstances.

 

[big pat]

this has become, boring,boring,boring, going to be a long off season, when does the cricket start.

 

[Willow]

Better analogy is if I used the BMW for a delivery business and you smashed it. Of course you would be liable for repairs to the BMW. But if you offered me the use of a Honda Civic to do my deliveries and I refused on the grounds that it's performance was inferior, I couldn't then claim all of my lost profits - they'd be reduced on the basis that I failed to take reasonable steps to mitigate the harm.

So now you're saying that we can loan Brown while Timmy gets his head together and then swap them back later on? This is the problem with bush lawyering... it often goes down a dusty track.

Your analogy sounds like you're putting the onus of liability on the person who has done nothing wrong.

At least you agree that Saints are not the offenders here.

There's no contradiction. I don't know how the Dragons could possibly show actual, compensable loss - thus the comment about quantifiable. If you can't show actual loss, you don't get damages.

I don't actually care about the compo. To me it's more about doing the right thing. If you agree to something then you should do your best to follow through. I'm more curious about the desperate measures some WT supporters are going to in trying to wriggle their way out of any moral responsibility. The legal mumbo-jumbo, semantics and splitting hairs down to the finest slither is just bullshit people do to get out of doing the right thing.

Scarily for me and the general public, I will be admitted in December.

lol. I figured that much. Well good luck with that. Perhaps real estate law is more your style.

 

[Guvner]

St George have arguments in their favor without you making up stories. The tigers put out a press release the day Tim signed saying he was nt released. And despite some inconsistent comments they never have released him.

It's not a dangerous precedent. Any contract dispute depends on it's own facts and it's own unique circumstances.

His manager has stated several times that a verbal release was given. Otherwise he would be in a lot of trouble for allowing his client to sign a contract with another club. Verbal will hold up. The delay here is about appeasing us in return for tearing up his deal. Wont be easy.

 

[Drain the Dragon]

I don't actually care about the compo. To me it's more about doing the right thing. If you agree to something then you should do your best to follow through. I'm more curious about the desperate measures some WT supporters are going to in trying to wriggle their way out of any moral responsibility. The legal mumbo-jumbo, semantics and splitting hairs down to the finest slither is just bullshit people do to get out of doing the right thing.

I wish I'd said that.

Sums up the whole issue completely.

 

[Mr Red]

dont see the point in financial compensation - its not like you can spend that in addition to the salary cap limit anyway..