Timana Tahu out, Joel Monaghan in for State of Origin II

[strider]

The Eels have released a video press release this afternoon. Can't find a link to the actual video yet however it does have the Eels Reel watermark on it so i expect it will be posted on the site Tuesday. SkyNews are running it.

http://www.skynews.com.au/national/article.aspx?id=473419&articleID=

an interesting bit of that ...

'The remarks were directed at various races and the situation I encountered was totally unacceptable.

... I was wondering the other day - the reports said johns also called himself "white trash from cessnock" - and I was wondering how that tied in with the "you have to stop the b- c-" comment, cos I just didn't see the 2 linked .... :-k

 

[2150_souLJA]

an interesting bit of that ...



... I was wondering the other day - the reports said johns also called himself "white trash from cessnock" - and I was wondering how that tied in with the "you have to stop the b- c-" comment, cos I just didn't see the 2 linked .... :-k

Agree, totally ridiculous.. Its like saying its OK to stab somebody just because you want to die and stab yourself while taking somebody else down with you.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

Well the Golden Rule is 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you'.

That's why I don't think Johns is a racist; he's just ignorant.

 

[2150_souLJA]

Well the Golden Rule is 'do unto others as you would have them do unto you'.

That's why I don't think Johns is a racist; he's just ignorant.

True, but as a COACH you need to have better judgment than what he showed. He's not a random bogan fan, he's in a position of responsbility and instead of setting a good example he's talking out of his ass and alienating his players.

Shows football IQ doesnt translate to real world IQ.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

True, but as a COACH you need to have better judgment than what he showed. He's not a random bogan fan, he's in a position of responsbility and instead of setting a good example he's talking out of his ass and alienating his players.

Shows football IQ doesnt translate to real world IQ.

Agree totally. I'm in favour of Johns losing every official-type job he holds (media and coaching) and I think I already said that in this thread.

But he has set an example by being suitably contrite in the media ever since. He's been honest and explained himself and admitted his ignorance and stupidity. In this he's set an example to all the people who think a few 'black merkins' between mates is ok.

I've got black mates who I call 'black merkin' but after all this I think I'll stop it - whether my black mates care or not.

I've decided it's not worth the chance of hurting somebody who might not be comfortable speaking up about it.

 

[hindy111]

Everyone is effected different than others-some are more emotional-Personaly if it happend to me well id have no respect for JOHNS.And once i didnt have respect for him well i wouldnt listen so it wouldnt matter how he talked or what he said.But everyones personality is different.What doesnt upset one person may upset another.

 

[bartman]

That's why I don't think Johns is a racist; he's just ignorant.

The two aren't mutually exclusive...

 

[bartman]

You really just need to shut up.

:lol: Get f**ked. Why are you allowed your opinion, yet I need to shut up?

NSW is an entire state, 6 million+ people, that is what we are cheering for, so we can beat those foolish Queenslanders.

There we have it... the stereotypes are flying freely.

And cheering Inglis? Is Johns suddenly playing now? How is that going to 'stick it up him'?

Well, it would go to show that Joey's type of (racist) motivation is wasted, and made things worse. The NSW didn't deal with this in a good way, they condoned Johns' actions by letting him "leave camp" instead of kicking him out for it.

And calling someone a racist when he is not, on the basis of one remark when you do not even know the person, is very, very low.

Yeah, Joey can't be racist :roll:. What is the difference between saying something racist and being a racist? nothing in my book.

Sure, I've made racist comments in my life... but it was when I was only 12 years old in the school yard - it's something I now regret and I'm glad I've learnt a bit about the world since then. Joey is my age - what's his excuse? Bellamy is over 10 years older than me - what's his excuse for condoning it by not sacking Johns?

And Tahu did not do this to send a message about racism. Rothfield (yeah, I know) in the 'Inside the Andrew Johns race scandal' story has said that Tahu proposed they use injury as the excuse, Andrew Johns also offered to quit the camp as soon as he found out, and even though the players wanted him to stay, he stood down anyway, like he should.

Rothfield... but what that shows is Johns is a protected species. Why is Joey such a protected species. Why can't he cop it when he f**ks up like anyone else. Why can't he be disciplined like anyone else? It's been going on his whole career, special treatment for "one of the boys". Mundine has a point - Joey probably wouldn't have gotten his special treatment if he was of a different race.

Also, a hypothetical, as this is a race issue, what if the same situation occured but based on sexuality, I mean if someone called someone 'a gay c***, and someone in their team was homosexual and walked out, what would the reaction be? Since gay, like black, is a term used often in many contexts, and homosexual people have been discriminated against since time began, I wonder how the players actions would be received.

You seriously can't work it out? The reaction would be exactly the same - well mine would at least. I'm trying to understand why you asked that as a hypothetical - do you think it's ok to talk about gay people in that way to groups of people while you're at work?

 

[parra-matters]

http://www.skynews.com.au/topstories/article.aspx?id=473410&articleID=1529968

 

[bartman]

I've got black mates who I call 'black merkin' but after all this I think I'll stop it - whether my black mates care or not.

I've decided it's not worth the chance of hurting somebody who might not be comfortable speaking up about it.

For those calling Tahu soft and thinking he over-reacted, this post alone is proof that Tahu's stance and action has actually made a difference....

Poupou's happy admitting that on an internet forum, for every Poupou hopefully there are many others out there following this story on the news, and thinking they might now give up making the odd racial remark. :thumn.

 

[eelandia]

What this has exposed more than anything is how many redneck, inbred people support League, based on comments posted here and in the news sites. A common attack on Tahu is "I don't get offended if I am called a white C". This completely disregards modern history and the treatment of other races (and the poor old Irish) by us whites.

****

 

[bartman]

We saw the same thing during the Petero C incident at Parra Stadium, people on forums (including moderators here) coming out and essentially condoning racism, by refusing to see anything wrong with one comment in isolation, thinking the penalty on the crowd members was harsh.

When Gallen got done for being a racist prick on the field, people trot out the old "one comment doesn't make a racist" line, it's not his go etc etc. Pathetic imo.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

When Gallen got done for being a racist prick on the field, people trot out the old "one comment doesn't make a racist" line, it's not his go etc etc. Pathetic imo.

I agree a racist comment doesn't make a person racist.

It's just ignorance. A lot of people make racist comments (myself included) because they don't realise that some people find such comments genuinely hurtful.

I used to think people only complained about that type of thing because they wanted to cause trouble.

 

[bartman]

There's no doubt ignorance is a central part of racism, and making racist comments.

But just because someone is ignorant doesn't mean they aren't racist. It's in the eye of the beholder for a good reason - they should be the judge (as Tahu was here) and we should follow their lead.

 

[bartman]

And Tahu did not do this to send a message about racism. Rothfield (yeah, I know) in the 'Inside the Andrew Johns race scandal' story has said that Tahu proposed they use injury as the excuse,

Just on this, here's a quote from Tahu himself, in an article from Rothfield's own paper saying the opposite...

"I believe I am a role model for children and I did this to show my kids this type of behaviour is wrong.
"This isn’t about me or Andrew Johns, it’s about arresting racism and standing up for my beliefs.
"I want to move on now and i know something positive will come from this.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sp...e-of-origin-camp/story-e6frexnr-1225879193319

When you've stopped spouting false excuses for racism, let me know.

 

[Poupou Escobar]

There's no doubt ignorance is a central part of racism, and making racist comments.

I think you can also be racist without being ignorant.

But just because someone is ignorant doesn't mean they aren't racist.

Although I agree with you, this isn't what I said. I think Johns made his racist comment out of ignorance, and that he himself isn't racist - as in, I don't believe Andrew Johns would discriminate against a person based on their race - he's described himself as white trash, implying that he doesn't see himself as any better than a 'black merkin'.

It's in the eye of the beholder for a good reason - they should be the judge (as Tahu was here) and we should follow their lead.

I agree. If Tahu says he was offended then he was. And even if he wasn't, it doesn't stop Johns' comment from being wrong.

 

[Springs]

:lol: Get f**ked. Why are you allowed your opinion, yet I need to shut up?


There we have it... the stereotypes are flying freely.


Well, it would go to show that Joey's type of (racist) motivation is wasted, and made things worse. The NSW didn't deal with this in a good way, they condoned Johns' actions by letting him "leave camp" instead of kicking him out for it.

Yeah, Joey can't be racist :roll:. What is the difference between saying something racist and being a racist? nothing in my book.

Sure, I've made racist comments in my life... but it was when I was only 12 years old in the school yard - it's something I now regret and I'm glad I've learnt a bit about the world since then. Joey is my age - what's his excuse? Bellamy is over 10 years older than me - what's his excuse for condoning it by not sacking Johns?


Rothfield... but what that shows is Johns is a protected species. Why is Joey such a protected species. Why can't he cop it when he f**ks up like anyone else. Why can't he be disciplined like anyone else? It's been going on his whole career, special treatment for "one of the boys". Mundine has a point - Joey probably wouldn't have gotten his special treatment if he was of a different race.


You seriously can't work it out? The reaction would be exactly the same - well mine would at least. I'm trying to understand why you asked that as a hypothetical - do you think it's ok to talk about gay people in that way to groups of people while you're at work?

It was a joke! We always say NSWelsmen are better than Queenslanders, stupid Queenslanders etc. It's part of footy! It's the same as when everyone talks about Storm players and fans, that bloody makes me angry, all the crap people on here spew up about that.

I'm asking you, would you go for the Storm in a Grand Final if one of the eels staff or players made a racial comment?

Um, you said 'What is the difference between saying something racist and being a racist? nothing in my book. ' And then said 'I've made racist comments in my life'. By your book, it makes you a racist, you should obviously be fired from any position you currently hold...
There is obviously a ton of difference. If I called my best mate 'blacky', and he is aboriginal, and he laughs about it and called me 'vanilla something or other', I would not be racist. Why? Because even though it was a racial comment, he is my best mate, and I obviously do not discriminate against other races. Have ye ever watched Scrubs? The 2 main characters are best mates and different races, they call each other names to do with race all the time, the main ones being 'brown bear' and 'vanilla bear'. It is technically casual racism, but they obviously are not racist.

And yeah, the hypothetical was about 'gay' being used as a synonym for 'bad' these days. And that if the slur was made about a person who was not gay, yet a gay member of the team walked out, would it be the same? I was simply asking because the term 'gay' is used a lot more in a derogatory sense than the word 'black'.

And sorry about the shut up fool thing, frustrated moods is all.

 

[Springs]

I think you can also be racist without being ignorant.



Although I agree with you, this isn't what I said. I think Johns made his racist comment out of ignorance, and that he himself isn't racist - as in, I don't believe Andrew Johns would discriminate against a person based on their race - he's described himself as white trash, implying that he doesn't see himself as any better than a 'black merkin'.



I agree. If Tahu says he was offended then he was. And even if he wasn't, it doesn't stop Johns' comment from being wrong.

I agree with what you have said. Johns' comment was completely inappropriate and out of line. But it wasn't said with intent to cause hurt or discriminatory. He is ignorant, but not racist.

 

[guruminga]

And the fact that aboriginal people were generally treated (by white people and the white government) as sub-humans. They were only allowed to vote in the mid-sixties, for f**k sake. Before that they were not even considered to be worthy of having a say in this country. That`s not very long ago. And they had their children taken away from them (or they were taken away from their parents) or their parents suffered this. Once again, very recent history. And they have all the scars from that.
My father was a school headmaster. His father was a manager in the coal-mining industry. What the hell do I care if someone calls me a white merkin? I`ve got all that safe, secure heritage to fall back on. But you go back two generations of aboriginal people and what have they got? Unemployed, disenfranchised, unempowered. Great-grandfathers murdered by whites; maybe grandfathers and grandmothers. Making up only 1 or 2% of the population. Really in the minority. No power. No voice in society. Fathers and mothers and grandparents not teachers or doctors or postal workers or even clerks or factory workers; but more likely unemployed, no confidence, no power, ashamed of their station in life. Call someone like that a 'black merkin' and it means a whole lot more than anything they could call a white man.

 

[guruminga]

Do you think the nsw selectors are racist? I would be surprised if they are. I know that I don't even think about what race all the players are. They are all just blue and gold and then the rest to me.

Me too!