1st Test: New Zealand v Australia at Wellington on Feb 12-16, 2016

[Bazal]

Like I say, come back to this thread. 5 years, 10 years and see who is right.

My money is on Patto (if he stays fit) and Hazelwood outperforming Cummins in test career (even if he stays fit).

Who your money is on is simply not relevant. You've chosen the two with the (marginally, in Pattinsons case) better fitness record. What an insightful and daring opinion that is!

Niether Pattinson or Hazlewood could do what Cummins can/could at the same age. He has the potential to be better than both if he can strengthen his back and stay fit. That's not to say he will be, but calling him overrated simply shows a complete lack of any understanding of the game of cricket.

 

[JJ]

Taylor and Santner both out, seems the squad is unchanged

Ahh well, guess they have the chance to redeem themselves - bowling unit will be interesting

 

[hineyrulz]

Yeah they had Taylor in the comm box can't remember what day and he said he hadn't even been able to have a net yet. No way did he seem ready to play a test match.

 

[ANTiLAG]

WTF

Cummins has played 1 test, got Mom against SA on their decks & you reckon he is overrated:crazy:

He has one performance at test level for you to judge him on, he was the best player over the course of the game, & somehow you've come up with an opinion that he is overrated

You seem to be confusing being injury prone with being overrated

I'll let you off the hook this time, but smarten up

Yes. Overrated.

As for smartening up: "one swallow does not a summer make."

 

[Bazal]

Personally I don't think Taylor would be much help. Yes, he's quality when he's on and he played an absolute cracker against us over here, but he's not a renowned performer under pressure and he's just about one of the worst around for throwing his wicket away. He may take some pressure off Williamson, but there's just as much chance he'd fail anyway. He's just not consistent enough IMO.

 

[2 weeks]

Yes. Overrated.

As for smartening up: "one swallow does not a summer make."

Lol

I realize now that Bazal is correct in his assessment of your cricket knowledge

 

[Iafeta]

I get that you're trolling AL, but there has been no balls incorrectly called before that have been crucial, not all of them are replayed and for most of test cricket history there was no technology to replay it to an audience. The fact is we dropped our bundle yet again and Australia carved us up. The Australians comprehensively out played us frankly.

 

[ANTiLAG]

Lol

I realize now that Bazal is correct in his assessment of your cricket knowledge

Narendra Hirwani, Mathew Sinclair, Brendon Kruppu, Hamish Rutherford, even Mendis in a different format...

 

[JJ]

Yeah they had Taylor in the comm box can't remember what day and he said he hadn't even been able to have a net yet. No way did he seem ready to play a test match.

Huge loss - essentially means the Aussies have only one bat to worry about - Guptill is shit, Latham good but prone to stuffing up, Nicholls inexperienced, Andersom rubbish and Watling out of form. Always an outside chance that McCullum goes ballistic, nothing much that can be done, but that's low percentage stuff

 

[ANTiLAG]

I get that you're trolling AL, but there has been no balls incorrectly called before that have been crucial, not all of them are replayed and for most of test cricket history there was no technology to replay it to an audience. The fact is we dropped our bundle yet again and Australia carved us up. The Australians comprehensively out played us frankly.

I'm not trolling.

That wrong decision pissed me off.

I said previously that I agree that Australia played well. Certainly bowled with good plans and executed well. Lyon and Hazelwood were gun. Smith set good fields. And I said that Khawaja and Voges put on a clinic.

I don't get how you think that is trolling.

 

[2 weeks]

Nirandra Hirwani, Mathew Sinclair, Brendon Kruppu, Hamish Rutherford, even Mendis in a different format...

Just for clarification, what is your criteria for not being overrated?

And do you understand the definition of overrated?

 

[JJ]

Personally I don't think Taylor would be much help. Yes, he's quality when he's on and he played an absolute cracker against us over here, but he's not a renowned performer under pressure and he's just about one of the worst around for throwing his wicket away. He may take some pressure off Williamson, but there's just as much chance he'd fail anyway. He's just not consistent enough IMO.

Course there's a chance he fails, and I am not is biggest fan - but he's a quality test bat, and gives the Aussies a second player to think about - at the end of the day our success in recent years has been down to runs from KW, Taylor, McCullum and Watling - only one of those is a threat atm, and the Aussies have got plans that have proven reasonably effective for now

 

[Pete Cash]

I disagree with everyone lol

I think Starc has by far the most potential.

 

[ANTiLAG]

Just for clarification, what is your criteria for not being overrated?

And do you understand the definition of overrated?

Oh now you think to ask for definitions. Should you not have asked this question before going on the attack? Anyways, my definition is the same as the dictionary definition:

"overrate
əʊvəˈreɪt/Submit
verb
past tense: overrated; past participle: overrated
have a higher opinion of (someone or something) than is deserved.
"an overrated player"
synonyms: assess too highly, overestimate, overvalue, rate/prize too highly, think too much of, exaggerate the worth of, attach too much importance to;

Much like assuming someone after a stellar debut match will have an equally successful career is overrating someone.

 

[2 weeks]

Oh now you think to ask for definitions. Should you not have asked this question before going on the attack? Anyways, my definition is the same as the dictionary definition:

"overrate
əʊvəˈreɪt/Submit
verb
past tense: overrated; past participle: overrated
have a higher opinion of (someone or something) than is deserved.
"an overrated player"
synonyms: assess too highly, overestimate, overvalue, rate/prize too highly, think too much of, exaggerate the worth of, attach too much importance to;

And you base him being overrated on being Mom at his only opportunity at test level?

 

[JJ]

I disagree with everyone lol

I think Starc has by far the most potential.

has a real body language weakness :sarcasm:

 

[Bazal]

I disagree with everyone lol

I think Starc has by far the most potential.

I'm one of his biggest fans, and I was saying he'd be a very good bowler years ago when everyone thought he was a plodder. Being a lefty helps but I still think consistency is an issue for him. Potentially, it's hard to disagree much apart from saying that I think Cummins has shown more than he had at the same stage, both in results and in his bowling itself. But again, we're talking potential, which AntiCricket can't seem to grasp as a concept (much like the concept of someone being overrated).

Starc definitely has more runs on the board, and a quality lefty is an altogether different proposition to a similar right hander. Cummins needs fitness and some work on his action, I think Starc needs to mix it up a bit more. He goes to the full fast ball too often for me

 

[Twatface Magee]

I've watched him closely since he made a name for himself against SA.

I'd take Hazelwood and Pattinson ahead of him every day.

I'd like to know how you've been 'watching him closely' since then when he has only played 5 Sheffield Shield matches in that time frame. I'd be even more impressed to know how you did this seeing as Shield games aren't televised and the best you can do is occasional fixed webcam footage of games that really don't show you anything...

 

[Bazal]

Much like assuming someone after a stellar debut match will have an equally successful career is overrating someone.

See, you use the word assumption, and then go one to say something which literally no one has assumed in this thread, leading me to believe you should look up the meaning of that word too....

"He has the most potential of any of our bowlers" does not equal "he will take 7 wickets in every Test match he ever plays". You...you do know that....right?

 

[ANTiLAG]

And you base him being overrated on being Mom at his only opportunity at test level?

No. I think the people that rate his future test career as indicated by one debut match as overrating him. Hence, he is overrated in my opinion.

The first thing everyone points to is his debut, as witnessed in this thread, I can quote if you like, but post debut matches didn't work out well for Hirwani, Sinclair, Kruppu and Rutherford as examples I gave.

Further, I have not been as impressed with his performances after that match as I have been with Hazelwood's and Pattinson's.