Round 8 vs Roosters

[Bests Golden Boots]

Sele played to the coaches instructions of mistake free footy

It's a shame we still didn't have Benji with us, at least then then Sele may have caught one on the many passes he threw over the sideline.

 

[Bests Golden Boots]

Yeah, this coming 5 weeks is probably the 2nd toughest stretch of our draw, round 17-21 the toughest. And agreed there’s no easy wins, though I may have noticed some posters - possibly you and OV among them arguing that we can’t put stock in our six wins so far as they weren’t against the best teams.
Also while I think and argued last year the burnout argument didn’t stack up then, it’s a genuine concern this time around as our starting props are averaging longer minutes now. I can but hope that there are plans to manage that workload through the middle of the year.

I don't know if anyone is trying to diminish our wins.
Some of them have been great, the first one against the Sharks, while they were terrible in the second half, were good wins against a quality team.
But they aren't the Storm, Roosters, Penrith.

The similarities with last year are starting to become appearant, the player burn out due to the "power game", the poor bench use, the use of Frizzell as a battering ram, when we could all agree he should be used better.

You can hope it will be managed better all you want, but history will teach use that our coach dosnt learn very many new things.

 

[Old Timer]

Yeah, this coming 5 weeks is probably the 2nd toughest stretch of our draw, round 17-21 the toughest. And agreed there’s no easy wins, though I may have noticed some posters - possibly you and OV among them arguing that we can’t put stock in our six wins so far as they weren’t against the best teams.
Also while I think and argued last year the burnout argument didn’t stack up then, it’s a genuine concern this time around as our starting props are averaging longer minutes now. I can but hope that there are plans to manage that workload through the middle of the year.

The 6 wins are not to be overlooked but their absolute value as to making us contenders has to be evaluated correctly.
Far too many say you beauty 6 wins, on top of the ladder, top 4 here we come.
Others say, yes 6 wins with a brighter style of footy but yet to play against the heavyweights who will be their at the end of the season. So I say exercise caution in how we view the rest of the season as our recent history tells us we have been here before and failed to get over the line and beating 6 middle of the road teams early in the season is no reason for me not to exercise caution.

 

[The Damo]

I don't know if anyone is trying to diminish our wins.
Some of them have been great, the first one against the Sharks, while they were terrible in the second half, were good wins against a quality team.
But they aren't the Storm, Roosters, Penrith.

The similarities with last year are starting to become appearant, the player burn out due to the "power game", the poor bench use, the use of Frizzell as a battering ram, when we could all agree he should be used better.

You can hope it will be managed better all you want, but history will teach use that our coach dosnt learn very many new things.

Mostly having a light hearted jab T OT after him saying no easy wins when he has done a bit of downplaying our opponents. Again, I honestly don’t agree with the whole theme of our ‘power game burnt us out’ last year. It just didn’t show up in the actual work done by the forwards. This year it does have some evidence as graham and Vaughan are averaging longer. Though still not excessive really as similar to many others like RCG.
And as both an optimist and a realist I would note that the coach has improved (from a very low base and much slower than he should have) and there are some signs of better bench use with Mann. There’s also shockers like last week where it was stupid, but there’s also games where Vaughan’s played low 40’s and graham under 40. So yeah optimist me hopes there is a plan.

 

[Bests Golden Boots]

Mostly having a light hearted jab T OT after him saying no easy wins when he has done a bit of downplaying our opponents. Again, I honestly don’t agree with the whole theme of our ‘power game burnt us out’ last year. It just didn’t show up in the actual work done by the forwards. This year it does have some evidence as graham and Vaughan are averaging longer. Though still not excessive really as similar to many others like RCG.
And as both an optimist and a realist I would note that the coach has improved (from a very low base and much slower than he should have) and there are some signs of better bench use with Mann. There’s also shockers like last week where it was stupid, but there’s also games where Vaughan’s played low 40’s and graham under 40. So yeah optimist me hopes there is a plan.

I will never understand the bench rotation of props today, and all teams do it.
I don't see the point of taking your starting props off after 25 minutes and leaving them off for the starting ten minuites of the second half.
Surely you want your two best props on the feild to start the second half, they have had a rest, get them back on.

I'm not a coach, therefore have the credentials to coach the Dragons, but I would have two second rowers play the 80, JDB and Frizzell can do this, then rotate Graham, Vaughn and Simms on and off for 15 min stints.

 

[Mark D]

It was this game last year that changed our season... The golden point loss , Widdop going down and so did the season with it... I do feel this years team is far more matured and a repeat won’t happen... I really hope Hunts steps up against Cronk. A lot on this forum gave him 1-2-3 points last week but I thought his first half was non existent . Here’s hoping he manages this game brilliantly.

Love ANZAC day , live overseas so really miss the occasion but will be watching from a pub in Thailand somewhere..... Go saints

 

[Brutalitops]

It was this game last year that changed our season... The golden point loss , Widdop going down and so did the season with it... I do feel this years team is far more matured and a repeat won’t happen... I really hope Hunts steps up against Cronk. A lot on this forum gave him 1-2-3 points last week but I thought his first half was non existent . Here’s hoping he manages this game brilliantly.

Love ANZAC day , live overseas so really miss the occasion but will be watching from a pub in Thailand somewhere..... Go saints

Heads up, WatchNRL (the overseas NRL subscription service) is opening up for all of ANZAC Day for free, so you can watch on your PC, phone or smart tv for free if you wanted https://www.watchnrl.com/subscribe/anzac

 

[Draginzaaar]

If we have to play our Anzac game in a bigger stadium then take it to ANZ not the oppositions fricken home ground. Does that not sound stupid to you?

I hate ANZ with 30,000, it's like there is 5,000. It's been at Allianz every year and we have won most of them. What's wrong with you people? Let's play it where the march isn't???

 

[Mark D]

Heads up, WatchNRL (the overseas NRL subscription service) is opening up for all of ANZAC Day for free, so you can watch on your PC, phone or smart tv for free if you wanted https://www.watchnrl.com/subscribe/anzac

Thanks mate.... Already a subscriber!! Cheers

 

[Draginzaaar]

Then why don't the NRL just make the ANZAC game every year a Roosters home game? We play it at their home ground every year don't we?

Because they would get the gate takings every year. Want us to throw money away?

 

[muzby]

http://forums.leagueunlimited.com/threads/round-8-vs-roosters.469700/

 

[MilanDragon]

I’m not convinced on the player burnout part. Most teams have a couple of backrowers that normally play the full 80 or close to, so no different to Sims or Frizz for us.

Vaughan has gone up slightly, and 52mins I’d dare say is as much or maybe even less than other clubs’ premier prop plays.

The key will be to manage it for the rest of the season and Keep the numbers roughly what they are. Maybe JDB could have more time and reduce Frizz/Sims after origin. Plus use of Sele/Host will be key. That’s the concern I think we all have.

Vaughan 47 to 52
Graham 52 to 47 (years before that he was closer to an average of 60 mins per game)
LAM 42 to 36
JDB 67 to 57
Frizz 61 to 72
Sims 52 to 74

 

[Dragonslayer]

I’m not convinced on the player burnout part. Most teams have a couple of backrowers that normally play the full 80 or close to, so no different to Sims or Frizz for us.

Vaughan has gone up slightly, and 52mins I’d dare say is as much or maybe even less than other clubs’ premier prop plays.

The key will be to manage it for the rest of the season and Keep the numbers roughly what they are. Maybe JDB could have more time and reduce Frizz/Sims after origin. Plus use of Sele/Host will be key. That’s the concern I think we all have.

Vaughan 47 to 52
Graham 52 to 47 (years before that he was closer to an average of 60 mins per game)
LAM 42 to 36
JDB 67 to 57
Frizz 61 to 72
Sims 52 to 74

Also by adding Mann as a go fix if utility playing just about every position now adds that extra 5 mins break for the forwards.
I agree burn out shouldnt he our issue, however, injury is, and McGregor really needs to have reserves that are hardened and ready which IMO they're not.
The drop between our current forwarx pack and those in ISP is enormous just need to watch replays of our ISP in action to confirm this.
Host is going to be a very good player but needs minutes and a bit more mongrel in his game. He's also not a prop.
Sele also is not a prop and plays more like a lock.
Lawrie and Kerr still need ISP development time.
Allgood and Latimore are just plodders and add no starch.
So, who is left to fill that void?
I have a sad feeling we will need to find out soon enough

 

[possm]

Mostly having a light hearted jab T OT after him saying no easy wins when he has done a bit of downplaying our opponents. Again, I honestly don’t agree with the whole theme of our ‘power game burnt us out’ last year. It just didn’t show up in the actual work done by the forwards. This year it does have some evidence as graham and Vaughan are averaging longer. Though still not excessive really as similar to many others like RCG.
And as both an optimist and a realist I would note that the coach has improved (from a very low base and much slower than he should have) and there are some signs of better bench use with Mann. There’s also shockers like last week where it was stupid, but there’s also games where Vaughan’s played low 40’s and graham under 40. So yeah optimist me hopes there is a plan.

Stats don't measure intensity or speed off the line. They don't mention off-side defence or depth of attack either.

The team looked frustrated with the up in your face defence of the Warriors and you can be sure that the Rooster will do the same tomorrow. Where we fall down is:
1. Not adjusting our attack to counter the 'up in your face' defensive plan.
2. Not adjusting our compressed defence for tackles 4 and 5.

The players are playing to their coach's instructions; blame the coach.

 

[Bests Golden Boots]

I’m not convinced on the player burnout part. Most teams have a couple of backrowers that normally play the full 80 or close to, so no different to Sims or Frizz for us.

Vaughan has gone up slightly, and 52mins I’d dare say is as much or maybe even less than other clubs’ premier prop plays.

The key will be to manage it for the rest of the season and Keep the numbers roughly what they are. Maybe JDB could have more time and reduce Frizz/Sims after origin. Plus use of Sele/Host will be key. That’s the concern I think we all have.

Vaughan 47 to 52
Graham 52 to 47 (years before that he was closer to an average of 60 mins per game)
LAM 42 to 36
JDB 67 to 57
Frizz 61 to 72
Sims 52 to 74

Well if it's not burnout what is it?
What happened last year when we lost so many games with the season in the line.
You can't blame Widdops injury because even when he came back we kept losing.
Why do we start seasons so well and end up going backwards?

 

[ouryears]

Well if it's not burnout what is it?
What happened last year when we lost so many games with the season in the line.
You can't blame Widdops injury because even when he came back we kept losing.
Why do we start seasons so well and end up going backwards?

Our coaching staff don't know how to manage, motivate and inspire the lads in our team for the entire length of the season.

Across an entire year many things can happen within a team environment where you need good man managers in your coaching team.

The first 6 to 8 weeks is easy, everyone is raring to go.

Like a fun run, the first 3 klms are easy.

However, across a whole season some players get a stale, some too cocky, some lose confidence, some have self doubt, and some are even too sure of themselves.

It's an ever moving beast.

A good coaching team stay on top of all the personalities in the team, their strengths and weaknesses, their mental state, and get THE BEST out of each player every week, across the entire year.

Any footy coach can just get a game plan together and pick the team.......but if he can't get the best out of his troops through knowing what makes each player tick... and how to keep them mentally fresh, it results in what had happened to us.

A constant deterioration in weekly performance.

It's not a football thing, it's a mind thing, we need coaches who are great at knowing how to create a motivated, engaged and high performing team.

The skills are secondary by this stage, the team have the skills, but not the right mental state to keep performing.

Same as teams in any business.

 

[MilanDragon]

Well if it's not burnout what is it?
What happened last year when we lost so many games with the season in the line.
You can't blame Widdops injury because even when he came back we kept losing.
Why do we start seasons so well and end up going backwards?

We had no plan B if the power game didn’t work. While it wasn’t burn out, the plan just wasn’t as effective by end of season and we didn’t have another go-to strategy.

Widdop injury hurt us quite a bit in terms of momentum. Add to the disruption of Frizz, we just didn’t have players ready to step up or play. The difference for us to other clubs was that the reserves didn’t ‘know their role’ when they had to come in.

Ouryears’ post already discusses the mentality piece which would be my other reason. Maybe the burnout was more mental than physical.

But when I say burnout shouldn’t be a factor, I mean this season as the minutes seem more spread. Also Mcgregor has alluded in a few different interviews to being smarter this season with players’ minutes.

 

[ALSGI]

Burnouts, no game plan, poor bench use, Friz is flat, Vaughan is quiet, Dufty is Shit, Aitken can’t pass, Latimore’s a plodder, Sack Mary etc.

FMD we’re 6-1. We’re going really, really well.

There’s always improvement, we all have our expert opinions - mine’s Nighty needs to be replaced asap by Mann, Lomax or Field.

But honestly it’s not 2015, 16 or 17 we’re a much better team this year. Mary and co aren’t L platers anymore. The team and coaches were outsmarted last week not outplayed - it happens to the best in footy. Aitken made Inglis look like a rookie yet I’d love to have Inglis.

Let’s see how we go tomorrow, and the next few weeks but even beyond that there’s 17 games to go and they’re killing it.

I think we’re going very well and will continue to go very well.

 

[Bests Golden Boots]

Burnouts, no game plan, poor bench use, Friz is flat, Vaughan is quiet, Dufty is Shit, Aitken can’t pass, Latimore’s a plodder, Sack Mary etc.

FMD we’re 6-1. We’re going really, really well.

There’s always improvement, we all have our expert opinions - mine’s Nighty needs to be replaced asap by Mann, Lomax or Field.

But honestly it’s not 2015, 16 or 17 we’re a much better team this year. Mary and co aren’t L platers anymore. The team and coaches were outsmarted last week not outplayed - it happens to the best in footy. Aitken made Inglis look like a rookie yet I’d love to have Inglis.

Let’s see how we go tomorrow, and the next few weeks but even beyond that there’s 17 games to go and they’re killing it.

I think we’re going very well and will continue to go very well.

I shall quote this post around this time tomorrow........damn, I just did it now........anyhoo.

It's not just that we were 6-1 this time last year and became the first team leading the comp after however many rounds and not to make the finals.
It's the similarities with last year that have people worried.
The lapses against the Sharks and Souths that looked bad.
The lack of a coherent strategy to counter what the Warriors were doing on Friday, the ever elusive Plan B.
The continuing poor use of the bench.

If we come out and flog the Roosters tomorrow we may all have a different perspective.

But the fact we have all been burned badly before is making everyone a little gun shy.

 

[Bests Golden Boots]

We had no plan B if the power game didn’t work. While it wasn’t burn out, the plan just wasn’t as effective by end of season and we didn’t have another go-to strategy.

Widdop injury hurt us quite a bit in terms of momentum. Add to the disruption of Frizz, we just didn’t have players ready to step up or play. The difference for us to other clubs was that the reserves didn’t ‘know their role’ when they had to come in.

Ouryears’ post already discusses the mentality piece which would be my other reason. Maybe the burnout was more mental than physical.

But when I say burnout shouldn’t be a factor, I mean this season as the minutes seem more spread. Also Mcgregor has alluded in a few different interviews to being smarter this season with players’ minutes.

Maybe not burnout, but maybe the fact that we start well, but then opposition teams work out our game plan and counter it, but Mary being Mary refuses to admit that what was working early in the season is no longer working and will not change it.

The player then get discouraged and loose hope.

As for smarter use of minuites, I'll ask Sele how it feels to sit on the bench the whole game, see what he thinks about this "smarter" use of the bench.