Troll dump thread

[Cooper-Man]

cooperman - a friendly comment - if these things keep happening (only up here?) maybe you need to get some of your regulars to tell the hangers-on to pull their heads in.... while it is probably easier for us as we are much less numerous than you guys, it is something we are big on. Whether regulars or not, drunken morons hanging about causing trouble reflects badly on the supporters group.

Guys I think you are all forgetting something. The Newcastle area has a MASSIVE St George following. They get one game a year sometimes one game every second year and they want to make the most of it. We cant control what they do and how they act.

The complaints you are making are for what? A little bit of swearing and shouting. Seriously. No one was touched and we NEVER threw anything at you guys. However we copped heaps of beer, cups, cans and HEAPS of chewing gum being thrown at our heads. There was also a group of 10 year old being encouraged by their drunken mother to make fun of this little old lady who was standing next to her 7ft husband. They were getting in her face and becoming aggressive. It caused her to have to slap one of them so they would leave her alone. (she is a local by the way)

Why is it that you Newcastle supporters keep shying away from the fact that all your actions towards us was alcohol fuelled. Everyone in Australia knows there is a massive drinking culture in Newcastle. I know its not everyone but a large percentage of the people behind us were drunken and aggressive. We controlled ourselves really well and kept communication with the security. No one was attacked like last time and people didnt have to be ejected from the ground. To me thats a successfull night.

I think its important to mention this again and hope you all understand. Newcastle has a MASSIVE St George following. There was many of them there on Sat night and all were influenced by alcohol. We dont know them and cant control them. Its unfair to brand us trouble makers when the issues were from people from your area.

We dont have a code of conduct as we are non club run. We dont believe we need a code of conduct because we NEVER have issues with the authorities. (i.e smashing trains and other supporters cars etc)

With the issue of standing. The admin at the Knights and I were in communication ALL WEEK and they informed me that the hill will be standing room only due to it being a sellout. This is a standard rull at ALL GROUNDS WITH A HILL. People with chairs should sit up the front.

 

[Joker's Wild]

Why is it that you Newcastle supporters keep shying away from the fact that all your actions towards us was alcohol fuelled. Everyone in Australia knows there is a massive drinking culture in Newcastle. I know its not everyone but a large percentage of the people behind us were drunken and aggressive.

Thats hardly fair mate.

Australia has a drinking culture especially relating to sport so to single out the Newcastle area in this regard is frankly, a bit of a joke on your part.
Singling out the Dragons as "trouble" supporters is just as stupid too.There are idiots at every game wearing the colours of every club. Just because someone doesnt mention it on an internet forum doesnt mean it didnt happen.

 

[macavity]

Look, I obviously don't expect you to admit to your lie in here. That would make you lose face in front of all.

However, I suggest you take a good hard look at yourself and maybe make some adjustments to the importance you place on truth in the future.

All-seeing, all-knowing.

FMD, you must be jehovah.

 

[macavity]

We dont have a code of conduct as we are non club run. We dont believe we need a code of conduct because we NEVER have issues with the authorities. (i.e smashing trains and other supporters cars etc)

We aren't club run, nor are the dogs army.

A code of conduct is a good idea because it sets out the behaviour standards expected of your members (and hangers-on for that matter). The people in the best position to tell the drunk hangers-on to pull their heads in are the regulars. It comes with the territory.

This has obviously upset TJS, and instead of calling him a liar, maybe the fair course of action is to accept that just maybe it did happen, and work towards a solution.

I am not going to say that some little kids or old ladies or whoever weren't giving you shyt just because I didn't see it happen - I can only hope you guys start to pay the same respect.

The difference here is our supporters group can't control what happens on the other side of the ground - you guys can influence what happens directly around you.

If you don't want to take the responsibility, don't be surprised when you are "unfairly besmirched" - if you won't take responsibility for your image, you are gunna end up with a bad one.

 

[macavity]

Call us all oversensitive, but we have a very large children,

We wish - might not have the front row issues we do.

 

[Timmah]

We aren't club run, nor are the dogs army.

A code of conduct is a good idea because it sets out the behaviour standards expected of your members (and hangers-on for that matter). The people in the best position to tell the drunk hangers-on to pull their heads in are the regulars. It comes with the territory.

This has obviously upset TJS, and instead of calling him a liar, maybe the fair course of action is to accept that just maybe it did happen, and work towards a solution.

I am not going to say that some little kids or old ladies or whoever weren't giving you shyt just because I didn't see it happen - I can only hope you guys start to pay the same respect.

The difference here is our supporters group can't control what happens on the other side of the ground - you guys can influence what happens directly around you.

If you don't want to take the responsibility, don't be surprised when you are "unfairly besmirched" - if you won't take responsibility for your image, you are gunna end up with a bad one.

That's actually not correct, to my understanding The Bulldog Army/The Kennel, are sanctioned by the club and given their own bay. The club even organised with the supporter group scarves through their merch provider.

Regulars telling hangers-on to pull their heads in - if they're not made aware of the problem, how can they deal with it? If you ask all regulars to police hangers-on, you in-turn have an effect on the enjoyment of the regulars, who then have less opportunity to create atmosphere because they're too worried about everyone else. The job of policing is the employed and paid security staff and police at the ground, last I checked anyway.

Maybe TJS is upset, maybe he's full of sh*t. As he's chosen a forum to air his grievances, that will be up for dispute until it can be disproven.

At the end of the day I saw unruly supporters from both sides of the coin randomly throughout the hill, but none serious enough to have a real problem.

As cooper man said, with no known evictions or physical altercations I think it sounds like a pretty successful night.

 

[Cooper-Man]

We aren't club run, nor are the dogs army.

A code of conduct is a good idea because it sets out the behaviour standards expected of your members (and hangers-on for that matter). The people in the best position to tell the drunk hangers-on to pull their heads in are the regulars. It comes with the territory.

This has obviously upset TJS, and instead of calling him a liar, maybe the fair course of action is to accept that just maybe it did happen, and work towards a solution.

I am not going to say that some little kids or old ladies or whoever weren't giving you shyt just because I didn't see it happen - I can only hope you guys start to pay the same respect.

The difference here is our supporters group can't control what happens on the other side of the ground - you guys can influence what happens directly around you.

If you don't want to take the responsibility, don't be surprised when you are "unfairly besmirched" - if you won't take responsibility for your image, you are gunna end up with a bad one.

We take responsibility of OUR OWN people. If someone we dont know comes over to us and he is ALREADY drunk, we are POWERLESS to stop their actions. We have tried in the past and it caused one of our guys to get punched in the nose. We deal with it by alerting security now. As for the girl that was with us that was acting like a man who is 6ft tall and has 20inch biceps. We pulled her into line and sorted her out.

Like I said, we take responsibility or our own people.

macavity I think your still upset about what happen two years ago. If i told you that I was informed by your club admin that the people who were employed to protect people back in 08 were dealt with due to their behaviour would you believe me?

Seriously mate we all enjoy coming to newy. Unfortunatly some people dont want us there.

 

[cleary89]

What happened in 08?

 

[macavity]

cooperman, I would be interested to know what you mean by that mate.

.... and of course you enjoy coming back here, you always bloody win!

 

[macavity]

That's actually not correct, to my understanding The Bulldog Army/The Kennel, are sanctioned by the club and given their own bay. The club even organised with the supporter group scarves through their merch provider.

very different to "run by the club" - the club gives us a hand when we ask for it too (when they can), however they don't "run" us. Took us 3 years and a change of admin before they would even talk to us, btw.

The job of policing is the employed and paid security staff and police at the ground, last I checked anyway.

Agree however while I can only speak for our group, we take the safety of those around us seriously - members and non-members alike. We keep an eye out, and deal with dyckheads by alerting security. I acknowledge it is harder in a larger group.

Maybe TJS is upset, maybe he's full of sh*t. As he's chosen a forum to air his grievances, that will be up for dispute until it can be disproven.

Very disrespectful Tim. This is a bloke you have met, and who is one of the most level-headed blokes you could meet - not some random keyboard hero. Your bias here is clouding your judgement.

At the end of the day I saw unruly supporters from both sides of the coin randomly throughout the hill, but none serious enough to have a real problem.

As cooper man said, with no known evictions or physical altercations I think it sounds like a pretty successful night.

Certainly could have been worse - but also could have been better.

If someone feels aggreived by you, rightly or wrongly, that is something to deal with, not bag them out about, because that reflects very badly on your club.

A simple "sorry you feel that way, I will have the boys keep an eye out for that sort of thing in the future" is an appropriate and mature response. Calling them a liar is not.

Congrats to the Dragons fans for getting good numbers to EAS - and congrats on a good season - but I don't think there is anything wrong with hoping that in future we could all work together towards ensuring a safe and enjoyable time by all. Might sound all airy-fairy to some, but it is hardly a bad goal to have.

 

[Big Tim]

There is a sign saying if you have a chair over 1.5m you have to sit behind a line......

Unreasonable to assume that an average human is over 1.5m tall they should probably stand behind that line.

Regardless of other grounds rules, it has been accepted that you do not stand in front of this line, just like you dont sit on a folding chair in front of this line. I imagine the first calls for you to sit down where not heated, and escalated from there because of the lack of reasonable response.

Fact is, if there are people sitting behind you the courteous thing to do is to move back and let them sit in front of you.

Being part of the Crusade when we were in Bay 1, there was a rule that if you want to stand, go to the back, and that there was to be no standing on the southern side of the bay so that we did not effect anyone else's game day.

Mate, it takes a moment for a senior member to look around and realise that there are other people there to watch the game rather than just one group.

 

[cleary89]

There is a sign saying if you have a chair over 1.5m you have to sit behind a line......

Unreasonable to assume that an average human is over 1.5m tall they should probably stand behind that line.

Regardless of other grounds rules, it has been accepted that you do not stand in front of this line, just like you dont sit on a folding chair in front of this line. I imagine the first calls for you to sit down where not heated, and escalated from there because of the lack of reasonable response.

Fact is, if there are people sitting behind you the courteous thing to do is to move back and let them sit in front of you.

Being part of the Crusade when we were in Bay 1, there was a rule that if you want to stand, go to the back, and that there was to be no standing on the southern side of the bay so that we did not effect anyone else's game day.

Mate, it takes a moment for a senior member to look around and realise that there are other people there to watch the game rather than just one group.

I thought it was 150mm, but ok.

As stated numerous times, we were there from the get go standing up. We were maybe 3m from the back, leaving room because we knew more people would be coming. The people who were telling us to sit down either came after we were there, put blankets down and then told us to sit down or they were up on the retaining wall. If they are up on the retaining wall not much we can do about that as what you suggested has the same result anyway (us standing infront of them).

Maybe have a word to management who as already stated, told people it would be standing room only in GA so were fine to stand at the back of the hill (which we did).

 

[St. Linnane]

As stated numerous times, we were there from the get go standing up. We were maybe 3m from the back, leaving room because we knew more people would be coming. The people who were telling us to sit down either came after we were there, put blankets down and then told us to sit down or they were up on the retaining wall. If they are up on the retaining wall not much we can do about that as what you suggested has the same result anyway (us standing infront of them).

I bet they would complain about living under the flight path; despite the fact the airport opened 50 years before they were born.

 

[DaSuperHero2]

Its ok guys we enter a different country , we enter different rules , but when they are hurt they whinge to the same jurisdiction....f**k em i say

and macavity i assume your still hurting from 2 years ago...

 

[boxa777]

Well handled as always Coops..

One of the comments I have read here is that the Newcastle supporters don't have the issues they have with the Dragon Army with anyone other supporting group including the Dogs army. Big statement.

But the same can be said for the Dragon Army. We don't have the issues we have at Marathon anywhere else to this extent and it always comes back to alcohol. The standing thing is minute in comparison to the behaviour of some of the locals whose sole objective is to get under the skin of our support group as opposed to watching the game and supporting their own team. The spraying of beer is the kind of gutless treatment that has been goin on for years up there.

And for the dude complaining about his parents being sworn at. How certain are you that this person was a Dragons Army member and not some run of the mill Newcastle local who supports the Saints? Cooperman has gone to great lengths to minimise the sh*t that happens every season. Probably gone beyond what I would expect of him.

And the tough guy who's challenging Cleary. Very easy to be 6 foot tall when the game is done and dusted for the season. Perhaps next year you can identify yourself and show everyone what a big man you are.

Personally I love support groups coming to Kogarah. It adds to the colour, to the atmosphere, the excitement. It's what footy is all about. But at Newcastle, all we get is drunk f**kwits throwing things from the safety of their group. And for what? Standing? Some people have lower tolerance than others.

A lot of supporters didn't travel up this season because of the history at the ground but Cooperman put it beautifully when he said he will bring 5 buses next year. And he will. You'll just have to accept that.

And more than likely they'll be standing.

 

[TooheysNew]

Its ok guys we enter a different country , we enter different rules , but when they are hurt they whinge to the same jurisdiction....f**k em i say

and macavity i assume your still hurting from 2 years ago...

Back to your mirror champ...

 

[Timmah]

There is a sign saying if you have a chair over 1.5m you have to sit behind a line......

Unreasonable to assume that an average human is over 1.5m tall they should probably stand behind that line.

Regardless of other grounds rules, it has been accepted that you do not stand in front of this line, just like you dont sit on a folding chair in front of this line. I imagine the first calls for you to sit down where not heated, and escalated from there because of the lack of reasonable response.

Fact is, if there are people sitting behind you the courteous thing to do is to move back and let them sit in front of you.

Being part of the Crusade when we were in Bay 1, there was a rule that if you want to stand, go to the back, and that there was to be no standing on the southern side of the bay so that we did not effect anyone else's game day.

Mate, it takes a moment for a senior member to look around and realise that there are other people there to watch the game rather than just one group.

I think you've missed the point here, we're talking a group bigger than anything Newcastle's RL support has produced. You can't expect a group of 100 people to fit into the 1.5m space between the retaining wall and the line. They made sure they were as far back in the bay as possible but with a large group it is difficult. One of two things needs to happen - Newcastle need to accept this will happen in 2011 when these teams meet and inform fans they are allowed to stand (which is the rule for a sold out game anyway) - or the smarter solution is for the DA to organise with EAS management to use Bay 1 or 2 as a DA standing area or something, like our Army did 3 weeks ago.

Very disrespectful Tim. This is a bloke you have met, and who is one of the most level-headed blokes you could meet - not some random keyboard hero. Your bias here is clouding your judgement.

And you yours, there's no objectivity from either side here, hence why I'm saying the discussion is up in the air. There's no reason we should simply take one person's story for gospel, just as we shouldn't take the Dragons' fans defence of it for gospel either. The truth, as I've said, is usually somewhere in the middle.

Certainly could have been worse - but also could have been better.

If someone feels aggreived by you, rightly or wrongly, that is something to deal with, not bag them out about, because that reflects very badly on your club.

A simple "sorry you feel that way, I will have the boys keep an eye out for that sort of thing in the future" is an appropriate and mature response. Calling them a liar is not.

Probably because it's a pretty scathing accusation and came across rather abusively early on. It wasn't exactly put in a diplomatic fashion, it was highly emotional and wasn't ever going to get a calm or collected response from anybody, including your own fans in the immediate aftermath.

I think both sides are coming to a much better understanding now, for the record.

 

[Big Tim]

So what you are saying is:

1. You were there first so you should be allowed to stand up.
2. It was a full house on the hill, so you should be allowed to stand where ever you like.
3. It was a full house on the hill so people found a seat where they could, and asked the people in front to sit down.

Just seeking clarification.

If you cant accept that the situation could and should have been handled better than you will end up with the same result every time you come to the ground.

FWIW if the sign says 150mm it actually gives my argument more cred. ie. in front of the line is designed for sitting down, as a chair over 150mm, or person standing will possibly obstruct the view and game day experience of all those behind said chair or person.

 

[Timmah]

So what you are saying is:

1. You were there first so you should be allowed to stand up.
2. It was a full house on the hill, so you should be allowed to stand where ever you like.
3. It was a full house on the hill so people found a seat where they could, and asked the people in front to sit down.

Just seeking clarification.

If you cant accept that the situation could and should have been handled better than you will end up with the same result every time you come to the ground.

FWIW if the sign says 150mm it actually gives my argument more cred. ie. in front of the line is designed for sitting down, as a chair over 150mm, or person standing will possibly obstruct the view and game day experience of all those behind said chair or person.

I think the shoe is on the other foot. You cannot expect a large group in excess of 100 people that at every other ground is given licence to stand and cheer to just sit down because of a few old locals who are used to an empty hill 10/12 games each year. To suggest the large group try to stand within the small space at the back of the hill behind the line is quite silly and not an achievable resolution.

Where you get the idea I can't accept the situation couldn't be handled better has me miffed - my suggestion (I think others even raised it before me) that perhaps the Dragons Army and EAS/Knights work together to allocate Bay 1 to them in 2011 and the future (like the Bulldogs Army did) may go a long way to solving these sorts of problems.

To be perfectly honest mate, I think you're letting a very straight-forward discussion on resolutions to this issue get bogged down in semantics and measurements. JMO.

 

[The_Joey_Show]

I think the shoe is on the other foot. You cannot expect a large group in excess of 100 people that at every other ground is given licence to stand and cheer to just sit down because of a few old locals who are used to an empty hill 10/12 games each year. To suggest the large group try to stand within the small space at the back of the hill behind the line is quite silly and not an achievable resolution.

Where you get the idea I can't accept the situation couldn't be handled better has me miffed - my suggestion (I think others even raised it before me) that perhaps the Dragons Army and EAS/Knights work together to allocate Bay 1 to them in 2011 and the future (like the Bulldogs Army did) may go a long way to solving these sorts of problems.

To be perfectly honest mate, I think you're letting a very straight-forward discussion on resolutions to this issue get bogged down in semantics and measurements. JMO.

I have written information from both the Knights CEO and the Chief Financial Officer showing that the Knights in fact tried to do this for 2010, only to be stymied by the DA.

I won't bother posting it in full. It doesn't suit your argument, and therefore would only further make me "precious", "bitter", and of course a liar (or to quote you directly "full of sh*t").