2nd Test - Australia v New Zealand Hobart Dec 9 - Dec 13 2011

[typicalfan]

Without thinking much about it.

Ponsford
Hayden
Bradman
Chappell/Ponting
Border
Waugh
Gilchrist
Miller/Walters
Warne
Lillee
McGrath

I would consider removing Waugh and having both Miller and Walters or Miller and Lindwall. Grimmett and O'Reilly would be the back up spin bowler but this team wouldn't need two. Openers could be swapped around but it would still crush Bunniesman XI

 

[BunniesMan]

Chappell faced the best attacks around and averaged over 50. Waugh faced a very strong WI attack in his time including Curtley Ambrose who is the only guy over the last 30 years I would consider as good as McGrath or maybe slightly better. Also he was a handy bowler in his younger days. Ponting at his absolute best would have dominated any era, he scored some runs on less than spectacular pitches as well as roads.

O'Reilly and Grimmett are far better than Benaud. And Miller is a third quick isn't he? lol.

I've said you don't need a 3rd quick after Mcgrath and Lillee. If they can't get a bloke out it's time to throw the spinners in.

About Benaud, I don't know as much about O'Reilly and Grimmett, but from the majority of people who were old enough to see all of them play they mostly said Benaud was the greatest until Warne came along.

Waugh did face a strong Windies attack and did very poorly, he averaged sub 40 until 1993. Again he comes close, but he didn't really score at an elite level until the pitches got easier and the bowlers got worse. He comes close but just not quite enough for the all time top 6.

I disagree about Ponting. I have Tendulkar and Lara as his superiors. He's a Kallis. A truly elite player and his countrys best of his generation. But compared to the all time greats, I don't think he's there equal.

 

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

Lol Waugh did poorly against the Windies? Stick his 200 in the Caribbean right up your arse and stop talking tripe

 

[yappy]

lol..... not many would argue that Gilchrist is a shit keeper but there is no chance in hell that he was in the same league has Healy

So where were all the bad misses, or even the freak catches that Gilly didn't get to? People are just marking Gilly down because his batting was so good. Or marking Gilly at his worst (early on) against Healy at his peak. Healy dropped catches, he missed stumpings, he wasn't the faultless gloveman some make him out to be. He was a top shelf keeper, but so was Gilchrist. Like I said Healy might shade Gilly on glovework, but Gilly was more athletic and his extra height and athleticism got him to balls Healy would't have.

Frankly I don't think Healy would have got near this:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VuBHL_vRCtc&feature=related

 

[Bazal]

I've said you don't need a 3rd quick after Mcgrath and Lillee. If they can't get a bloke out it's time to throw the spinners in.

About Benaud, I don't know as much about O'Reilly and Grimmett, but from the majority of people who were old enough to see all of them play they mostly said Benaud was the greatest until Warne came along.

Waugh did face a strong Windies attack and did very poorly, he averaged sub 40 until 1993. Again he comes close, but he didn't really score at an elite level until the pitches got easier and the bowlers got worse. He comes close but just not quite enough for the all time top 6.

I disagree about Ponting. I have Tendulkar and Lara as his superiors. He's a Kallis. A truly elite player and his countrys best of his generation. But compared to the all time greats, I don't think he's there equal.

:lol::lol::lol:

 

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

Gilchrist used to frequently drop catches in his early years but to say he was shit is wrong. Healy was great and was particularly great to Warne, Gilchrist was pretty good and got better towards the end of his career.

 

[BunniesMan]

How can you pass judgement on players you never saw?

What are you basing your opinion on that Benaud was the best spinner prior to Warne? I'm pretty sure Richie himself gives that honour to O'Reilly for Australia anyway

Derp. Like everyone here I only know about players from the first half of the 20th century from second hand knowledge. After taking in everything I've read and heard from people who have seen them, I formed my own opinion. Like everyone else taking part in this discussion.

Without thinking much about it.

Ponsford
Hayden
Bradman
Chappell/Ponting
Border
Waugh
Gilchrist
Miller/Walters
Warne
Lillee
McGrath

I would consider removing Waugh and having both Miller and Walters or Miller and Lindwall. Grimmett and O'Reilly would be the back up spin bowler but this team wouldn't need two. Openers could be swapped around but it would still crush Bunniesman XI

The rest is debateable but I can't see how you put Hayden ahead of Woodfull.

Hayden: 50.74 94-09.
Woodfull: 50.9 (as an opener) 26-34

Essentially equal scorers as openers. One got those runs in the 20s and 30s. One got them in modern times on relatively easier pitches against weak opposition and mostly in the greatest team ever.

The rest can be put down to differences of opinion but I just can't see how anyway rates Hayden above Woodfull.

 

[typicalfan]

Waugh averaged 45 against the WI when they had Curtly playing. Not bad compared to Mark Taylor averaging 28 as an example.

 

[Bazal]

I don't think anyone is saying Gilchrist was shit...he was a genuine international standard keeper. Healy was just a lot better

 

[BunniesMan]

Lol Waugh did poorly against the Windies? Stick his 200 in the Caribbean right up your arse and stop talking tripe

:lol::lol::lol:

Sub 40 average until 1993.

It's not a coincedence his average improved as the Windies began their decline.

 

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

Derp. Like everyone here I only know about players from the first half of the 20th century from second hand knowledge. After taking in everything I've read and heard from people who have seen them, I formed my own opinion. Like everyone else taking part in this discussion.

That's code for "I have NFI what I'm talking about and basing my opinion on averages"

Stop talking about players you don't know about

 

[BunniesMan]

That's code for "I have NFI what I'm talking about and basing my opinion on averages"

Stop talking about players you don't know about

How old are you? I'm fairly sure you have no more direct knowledge about anyone who played before 1980 than I do.

 

[typicalfan]

Derp. Like everyone here I only know about players from the first half of the 20th century from second hand knowledge. After taking in everything I've read and heard from people who have seen them, I formed my own opinion. Like everyone else taking part in this discussion.

The rest is debateable but I can't see how you put Hayden ahead of Woodfull.

Hayden: 50.74 94-09.
Woodfull: 50.9 (as an opener) 26-34

Essentially equal scorers as openers. One got those runs in the 20s and 30s. One got them in modern times on relatively easier pitches against weak opposition and mostly in the greatest team ever.

The rest can be put down to differences of opinion but I just can't see how anyway rates Hayden above Woodfull.

Hayden played simple but he got big runs when he cashed in and he is far more beneficial to the side than Healy.

You might argue pitches were tougher to bat on back then, personally I couldn't tell conclusively. Besides Woodfull never played in the sub continent, a place Hayden played well at. So it balances itself out. I wanted a technician down one end and someone who can dictate terms down the other.

 

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

My age is not your concern, im definitely older than you though, but you also do not see me talking about players I never saw as though I saw them live and know how good they are acting like I am an expert.

Sub 40 average until 1993.

It's not a coincedence his average improved as the Windies began their decline.

Were you even born in 1995?

Ambrose
Walsh
Bishop
Benjamin
Patterson

Don't talk shit.

 

[Hallatia]

game should resume at 5:30
it will, so long as there is no more rain

 

[BunniesMan]

Hayden played simple but he got big runs when he cashed in and he is far more beneficial to the side than Healy.

You might argue pitches were tougher to bat on back then, personally I couldn't tell conclusively. Besides Woodfull never played in the sub continent, a place Hayden played well at. So it balances itself out. I wanted a technician down one end and someone who can dictate terms down the other.

Fair enough. I disagree with your opinion but I respect the polite response. We'll agree to disagree.

TT learn a thing or two from typicalfan.

 

[BunniesMan]

Yay, just what Warner and Hughes need. A 30 minute session...do the kiwis want their 27th new ball?

 

[typicalfan]

Don Bradman said Bill O'Reilly was the best bowler he had seen or faced, including Warne. I am not aware of a mass of information suggesting Benaud was a better spinner than him or Grimmett. Benaud is a great captain though.

 

[Tonearm Terrorwrist]

Maybe you should learn to stop acting like you're an expert on everything and you know it all

 

[Bazal]

Not happening. I'm betting the day is over