Sack Adam O'Brien

[TooheysNew]

Once again. As I’ve said before already. We’re not a top 4 team and if that’s what the club had expected of AOB when they approached him then he’s failed at that so far. But people have said things like “no improvement” etc which isn’t true if you’re basing it on wins & losses for the first couple of years that he’s been here.

Our attack is worse.
Our defence is worse.
We are running 12th, with a points differential of -164 (120 points worse than 11th place).
We are four wins out of the eight.
Our only wins were against the Roosters in Round 1, the Tigers (who sacked their coach), the Bulldogs (who sacked their coach), the Warriors (who sacked their coach), the Titans (who are looking like sacking their coach).
We've had players sign elsewhere for less money and then talk about not being able to achieve what they want at the Knights.
Our "improved" players, even from your own list, all come with a caveat.

The only thing you can point at is our win % (which is currently the lowest it has been since 2017), but even then we can only beat teams that are more terrible than us. Apart from the Roosters game in round one, all of our wins are from the bottom 4 teams. And even those weren't convincing.

I really can't see this improvement. Yes, we performed better in 2020 than we had in previous years, but since then it's been a downhill slide.

 

[Mr_Knightside]

Yeah I’ve already said we’ve been bad this year, you don’t need to convince me. My point was based on our results in the 20-21 seasons.

 

[Yosh]

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Pretty clear which coach was responsible for most of the improvement in the club recently.

I have no idea who you think is responsible for the improvement of the club. Improvement means you calculate the rate of change not final results or figures. Clearly we saw most improvement under Brown. The trend clearly shows AOB is having a negative influence on the club.

Also, those graphs taken out of perspective mean very little in the grand scheme of things. If we add the Storm and Panthers to those graphs, we literally are nowhere near them. Those graphs literally mean nothing.

 

[TooheysNew]

I literally have no idea what you are trying to say. The graphs are right, but they're also... wrong?

 

[slotmachine]

Clearly we saw most improvement under Brown.

Maybe AOB should have started by winning 1 game in a full season.

In any case can't we all just agree they are both bad coaches.

 

[Yosh]

I literally have no idea what you are trying to say. The graphs are right, but they're also... wrong?

What did you want to prove with those graphs? AOB is a superior coach than Brown, based solely on 3 data points? Doesn't take into consideration anything else including player development, the influence of the new owners on the club and literally a billion other things. I'll probably need an essay to point out all the problems with your post but anyway.

We shouldn't be basing anything on Brown vs. AOB. It should be Knights vs. Storm/Panthers, AOB vs. Bellemy/Cleary/Robinson etc. Why we happy about making the 8? How low have we sunk? If we aren't top 4 and challenging, what's the difference between 2nd last and 7th or 8th and 10th?

 

[TooheysNew]

What did you want to prove with those graphs? AOB is a superior coach than Brown, based solely on 3 data points? Doesn't take into consideration anything else including player development, the influence of the new owners on the club and literally a billion other things. I'll probably need an essay to point out all the problems with your post but anyway.

We shouldn't be basing anything on Brown vs. AOB. It should be Knights vs. Storm/Panthers, AOB vs. Bellemy/Cleary/Robinson etc. Why we happy about making the 8? How low have we sunk? If we aren't top 4 and challenging, what's the difference between 2nd last and 7th or 8th and 10th?

Re-read my posts mate.

 

[Haffa]

Maybe AOB should have started by winning 1 game in a full season.

In any case can't we all just agree they are both bad coaches.

Incorrect. The clubs "Toxic Culture" is to blame.

 

[Frederick]

Yeah I’ve already said we’ve been bad this year, you don’t need to convince me. My point was based on our results in the 20-21 seasons.

 

[Jono078]

Haha I think you need to look at Toohey’s graphs again @Yosh, it shows the upward trend of Brown and then the decline with AOB.

Like I said when I posted my negative 40% assessment of AOB. Not sure what other club puts up with that decline and then the results of this year where we’ve literally only beaten teams below us (besides Roosters who were a round 1 mess).

Whether we like it or not I think the writing is on the wall that AOB is our coach next year. He’d be odds on to be first fired if things turn to shit quickly though.

 

[Yosh]

If I was totally wrong, I fully apologize. AOB annoys the crap out of me.

 

[Johns Magic]

Our big money players are stars in rep games but rubbish when playing for us.

No way around it - AOB, you don’t have the room. You have to go.

 

[Knight Tales]

Our big money players are stars in rep games but rubbish when playing for us.

No way around it - AOB, you don’t have the room. You have to go.

This. J Saf looked like a world beater. That post contact was incredible.

 

[Apey]

Brown was a bad coach (see us, then Warriors) but the recruitment while he was here was the best for us in a long time. I'm not sure what positive impact AOB has had on the club if any.

 

[Johns Magic]

Brown was a bad coach (see us, then Warriors) but the recruitment while he was here was the best for us in a long time. I'm not sure what positive impact AOB has had on the club if any.

Yep.

If nothing else, Brown was at least a very good salesman and could land signatures. AOB ain’t that. The club vibe which was on the up under Brown is now on the slide.

Not ideal struggling to recruit when you can’t get the best out of the current roster.

I think we need a facelift.

 

[Haffa]

The clubs brand is stale. The whole place needs a facelift. We were all saying this a few years ago and the only thing they've done is pimp Ponga out. Which has helped his brand more than the clubs.

A new coach is a great place to start. This bloke is vanilla and offers nothing.

 

[Johns Magic]

The clubs brand is stale. The whole place needs a facelift. We were all saying this a few years ago and the only thing they've done is pimp Ponga out. Which has helped his brand more than the clubs.

A new coach is a great place to start. This bloke is vanilla and offers nothing.

The brand was going the right direction under Brown. We landed guys like Ponga, Pearce, Klemmer, Brailey etc with Brown selling it. It wasn’t stale then.

We now have more money and more facilities/resources with Wests than back then…but players running the other direction. It’s why we are stuck throwing money at guys who might hang around like Milford and Mann, rather than backing ourselves to sign better talent from other clubs.

Having a coach who increasingly comes across as a clipboard-holder rather than a great coach so we underperform and damage the brand, with a personality to match so we can’t recruit, is shooting ourselves in the foot.

His recent spiels about needing to change the long-term culture scream of buying himself time. I would be prepared to give him that if the on-field performance was heading in the right direction, or we were building the roster and appealing to players. Instead I just see the slide getting deeper.

If we had signed say Craig Fitzgibbon last year, I think the club vibe would be good right now. The right coach is all I think is missing.

 

[macavity]

One thing that sticks out like dogs balls to me is our lack of a player welfare department. And not just to look after the players but their families.

look at Cliffo as a prime example. Mrs has a baby, no support around her, he falls to pieces.

If we sign or develop a player - any player of any age - they should have access to a department that means they only have to worry about football.

Mrs needs a baby sitter, a job, a shoulder to cry on? We should have a team of women to look after it.

Young fella missing home? There needs to be mother ducks to look after him.

lower grade toiler looking for a trade? We need to hook him up.

it is something the NFL and NBA have been doing for years. Can’t get the best out of players if they are miserable at home. And it would be be hugely expensive. Maybe $250k gets you a good welfare unit.

Players we have lost over the years (not to mention the ones who flamed out) because we don’t do welfare include all blacks legends Frank Bunce and Tana Umaga. Hell we wouldn’t have kept Timana Tahu if he didn’t hook up with his billet family’s daughter.

If we want the next Latrell Mitchell, Greg Inglis or whoever to be in our colours, if we want players to take less because their Mrs won’t leave, if we want to be bloody successful, this is the first place to start. Look after our bloody players.

 

[The Axe of Druss]

One thing that sticks out like dogs balls to me is our lack of a player welfare department. And not just to look after the players but their families.

look at Cliffo as a prime example. Mrs has a baby, no support around her, he falls to pieces.

If we sign or develop a player - any player of any age - they should have access to a department that means they only have to worry about football.

Mrs needs a baby sitter, a job, a shoulder to cry on? We should have a team of women to look after it.

Young fella missing home? There needs to be mother ducks to look after him.

lower grade toiler looking for a trade? We need to hook him up.

it is something the NFL and NBA have been doing for years. Can’t get the best out of players if they are miserable at home. And it would be be hugely expensive. Maybe $250k gets you a good welfare unit.

Players we have lost over the years (not to mention the ones who flamed out) because we don’t do welfare include all blacks legends Frank Bunce and Tana Umaga. Hell we wouldn’t have kept Timana Tahu if he didn’t hook up with his billet family’s daughter.

If we want the next Latrell Mitchell, Greg Inglis or whoever to be in our colours, if we want players to take less because their Mrs won’t leave, if we want to be bloody successful, this is the first place to start. Look after our bloody players.

This is an excellent point

I hate using Melb as an example yet again but f**k it im going to. Matty Johns talks a lot about how the Storm do "Family weekends" where all the players families come down and they have functions and events etc designed to make them all close knit. It works wonders for the new guys who have to move to that turd hole of a city and goes a long way to keeping good talent at the club, along with the other great cultural things the Storm do so well

All that comes from good leadership in the club which is more and more obviously lacking at Newcastle

 

[Yosh]

Why didn't AOB bring that system over from the Storm rather than the tactics they used a decade ago...